Speak Out February 2 to March 1, 2010

Tuesday, February 2, 2010

The Marshall Democrat-News welcomes views or questions on any issue. We hope you'll express yourself freely and responsibly. We reserve the right to exclude entries that we deem disrespectful, threatening, obscene or in other ways objectionable.

Past Speak Out conversations

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  • Time for a fresh start!

    -- Posted by Eric Crump on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 1:24 PM
  • Any news on a new head football coach or athletic director?

    -- Posted by OldOwlFan on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 1:28 PM
  • Has anyone addressed the situation with the MHS wrestling team? Why is it that they have went from over 30 wrestlers at the beginning of the season and now have only 10 or 12 AND seem to be losing everything. Ive heard it has to do with coaching....anyone else hear anything?

    -- Posted by lland on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 2:27 PM
  • lland,why is it in this town that when the numbers aren't what they used to be or the team is not winning like it used to, that it has to always be the fault of the coaching staff? In my experience, it would not be unusual, especially for a sport like wrestling, for students to start the season, but not finish it. Wrestling is particularly grueling and some people (me for one)just are not made out to be wrestlers. Could it be that the wrestling program is just having an off season. It happens to nearly every program at some point in time. Just relax, let the coaches coach and the kids have fun.

    -- Posted by OldOwl on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 3:03 PM
  • Sometimes the kids can't have fun if the coach is incompetent.

    -- Posted by WickedWitch on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 3:08 PM
  • OldOwl, I know that wrestling is a hard sport and that a lot of kids try and realize they arent cut out for it. I bring it up only because I have heard from many different sources that the kids are leaving because of the coach. It is also rumored that several of the really good kids say they wont be back if the coaching staff stays the same.

    -- Posted by lland on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 3:12 PM
  • LOL Scarpetta, you made nine points about me...you were (in my opinion) right on six of the nine. Not so bad girl. ;)

    Enjoyed your descriptions.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 3:51 PM
  • I believe in respecting the coach, but I also believe that coaches and administration have an obligation to the kids to be fair and tuned in to the situation at hand. A good coach has to adjust to the circumstances or to the talent he has. Arrogance has no place on the field, the court, or the mat.

    -- Posted by WickedWitch on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 4:08 PM
  • WickedWitch, sounds like YOU have reached the opinion that the wrestling coach is incompetent. What FACTS do you rely upon in reaching that conclusion? Are YOU qualified to make that conclusion? If you REALLY had concerns, seems to me that you might share those concerns with the Athletic Director or MHS Principal, rather than just complaining anonymously!

    -- Posted by OldOwl on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 4:33 PM
  • I know some kids and parents have contacted either the AD or Coach Heinzler about what is going on...but it seems that nothing has been done as of yet.

    -- Posted by lland on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 4:46 PM
  • Well "lland" it would do well if before you criticized the MHS wrestling staff that you got your facts straight and even had a clue of what you are talking about. They have won 2x as many dual meets this year compared to last (yes they have only won 4 duals this year but they only won 2 last year under the old head coach), and yes they had nearly 30 kids come out this year, but that was almost twice as many kids as they had the year before! At least they created more interest and got the kids to come out, though many found they weren't cut out for the sport, combined with injuries, they are down to the same numbers as the last couple years. So, get your facts straight before spouting off and trying to create some slander. When the wrestling program was already at the bottom it takes more than a year to build a solid program. As to "the really good kids" . . . oh really . . . what kids that have accomplished what? On what level? The club program has floundered for years with poor coaching and poor techniques that the kids coming into the H.S. know little and can't compete beyond rolling around in the room with their friends. "WickedWitch" (interesting name) as to competency . . . on the top of what wrestling podium have you ever stood? How many times have you had your hand held high in victory? Seriously, really, are you the judge of competency? It kills me when someone who doesn't know the difference between a spladel and a kitchen ladel tries to sit in judgment of others who have fought with blood, sweat and tears on the mat and wanna be's, who have never accomplished anything, couldn't lead a team across to the other side of a gym try to tell someone how to build a program. Coach Gaskill comes with some of the best endorsements in the state of Missouri and beyond so quit whining and lets start building.

    -- Posted by goonieboonie on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 5:09 PM
  • Goonie, I didnt make a comparison in wins to last year in my post therefore I dont really see how I was wrong in stating that they are losing alot. They are..that is a fact, regardless of the reason. I also know that many of the kids that are on the team, as well as the ones that have quit, have stated that they are very unhappy with the coaching staff, whether it is the head coach or assistant coach, that wasnt mentioned, but if you assume it is the head coach (as you mentioned in your post) that is the culprit, Ill take your word for it.

    -- Posted by lland on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 5:22 PM
  • I am glad to see our woderful

    Mayor move to a better position.

    -- Posted by marshallguy on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 5:23 PM
  • Scarpetta:

    LOL, Not close I am afraid on the personal appearance part, not far off on the age but I am happy to say I am a couple years younger. Yes, I am the Momma bear when it comes to my cubs! Thanks for the laughs!

    -- Posted by litlmissme on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 5:34 PM
  • Hey news, I'm not "goonie" but did you READ that? 9.6% " 'allegedly' confirmed" Wonder what the total number was? 74? But only 29 "identified"? What? I think that was exactly what W.C. Fields was talking about. "If you can't dazzle them....."

    -- Posted by missy08 on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 6:18 PM
  • Scarpetta

    You might not have been around for long, but your description is remarkably accurate.

    You aced that class in Personality, didn't you! :)

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 7:25 PM
  • lland,

    Actually you are partially right. You didn't compare wins this year to last year . . . because that didn't fit your cause. You only want to tear down, and not recognize the improvement that is there. That is a fact . . . Even though there has been a 100% improvement in wins . . . you don't care. Your true care is not about wins or losses or you would be celebrating the great improvement! Your primary concern is about "unhappy" adolescents, which you don't know how to handle. Perhaps you need to worry less about the tiny feelings of the kids around you, and worry more about the kids around you reaching their potential and what it actually takes to be a winner, everyone would be a lot better off. If you want, I'll see you at Bogey's and buy you a beer to cry in . . . and in a few years pull up a stool and buy a couple for that adolescent to cry in as well.

    -- Posted by goonieboonie on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 8:05 PM
  • Wow, Goonie! I guess that puts things in place. Haven't been able to make it to very many meets this year, but when I have the Owls were wrestling as solid as I have seen them for years. They are a young team and rebuilding, but the kids that are there were doing the right things.

    -- Posted by Alan J on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 8:25 PM
  • I see a headline about the governor cutting $74 million from the state budget, due to declining revenues.

    No small part of the declline can be attributed to giveaways to corporations, I'm sure.

    The country was in pretty darn good financial shape when the Vietnam conflict became official, and then the $2-3 billion cost per month ate into LBJ's quest to eradicate poverty, or vice versa, depending on how one wishes to view it.

    It's been a downhill slide since the 1960s, except for the surplus accrued during the Clinton years, when it was pay-as-we-go.

    Now Obama is wanting to get back to paying as we go, but the trillion or so deficit the current administration inherited is making that goal extremely elusive, or mayybe even impossible.

    Did anyone watch Charlie Rose last night? His guests were Senators Judd Greg (R) and Evan Bayh (D) who were talking about the dangers of the defecits and how they've been pleading with members of Congress to wake up and take corrective action, lest a huge bunch end up being ousted in the fall. You bet! The best thing that could happen! Bayh says the political system is broken and the citizens' tolerance of the stalemate and gridlock occurring up there is about over and Congress better wake up. He mentioned the minor stirring over Brown's election in MA, but now the indifference has settled in once again.

    Greg's tone is even more foreboding about the federal bedget, saying if meaningful steps aren't taken to bring down the deficit, within five years the US will likely be unable to borrow money to stay afloat.

    They both agree that Obama understands the dire nature of things, but that he and others (including the two senators) have been unable to make Congress understand. Hence the impending turnover in the fall.

    I think, from their tone, they believe the public is "...mad as hell, and we're not going to take it any more!"

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 8:53 PM
  • Thanks guys. It was a fun exercise. I had to keep it short because I didn't want to ramble on and on. I'm looking forward to see how well I did on the others.

    -- Posted by Scarpetta on Tue, Feb 2, 2010, at 9:37 PM
  • news across...

    ONE flaw in all of your thinking. With all the liberal SPENDING/entitlement programs come a HIGH cost with HIGH inefficiency, waste and fraud. These liberal entitlement programs are nothing but tax based drains on the economy and the more of these types of programs we have the worse our economy gets. One only has to look toward California to see what LIBERAL spending leads to.

    The NEXT flaw is that by simply providing a government program that decreases personal/individual responsibility, you are NOT attempting to solve the REAL problems but only but a bandaid on the situation to make it appear as if you are really caring.

    What do I mean by this? Just take the whole give a fish/teach people to fish story. If I give you a welfare check, food stamps, health care and other entitlements then you are NOT fixing the problems that cause poverty. You know REAL problems like not having an education because you dropped out due to stupidity of a teen or becoming pregnant before you have a career, or other problems like addiction.

    As other people have said, entitlements, not only are economic drains, they just multiply the drain on the economy by encouraging MORE people to be dependent on the government in a LEARNED behavior that prevents them from being made to fend for their selves. This is just another form of slavery, this time slavery to entitlement programs and the government....

    IF the liberals would REALLY care for the people they would solve the individual problems of the individual people and of society instead of trying to make a blanket type program to inadequately just provide handouts for people. BUT this would go against a liberals ideals because their goal is NOT caring for people but creating democrat voters by creating psychologically dependent people that are dependent on the failed government entitlement programs that do not cure ANY social ailment but actually increases the ailments.

    -- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 1:16 AM
  • How exactly does pay as you go work when you are only doing it for a VERY small fraction of the economy AND while purposing another 4 trillion dollars in another unstimulus plan? We were told unemployment would go to 8% if we did NOT go with the stimulus plan.... hmmmm if we DO this one then will that make unemployment go to 20% or more?

    -- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 1:20 AM
  • Hey news, just for comparison, it would be Wednesday if I'm lucky or most likely Friday for me to get into my doctor, for the reason you stated. My cost? $110.00 for the office visit.

    -- Posted by Scarpetta on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 1:27 AM
  • news, I am just curious. Where are all the sick people in Australia? If you have a pulled muscle and can see the doc within 1 hour, where are the kids with strep, the productive cough with chest pain, and the bladder infections going? Are all of those treated in the ED? What about those who have scheduled appointments for routine follow-up of CHF or diabetes? Do they get bumped because your arm hurts? Curious.

    Have a great day!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 7:25 AM
  • Goonie, My "cause" as you would have it, is concern for the kids. If they feel that they are being treated badly by the wrestling coach, then that should be the concern of every parent, teacher, coach, taxpayer, citizen of this town. If one or two kids said it was bad but the rest were happy...fine...but when the vast majority have the same complaint, that is a major concern. It is amazing how easily you are able to disregard "unhappy adolescents" and their "tiny feelings"...this is their school, this is supposed to be about them...no one else.

    -- Posted by lland on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 8:05 AM
  • But news, my question is -- don't the docs have sick people to take care of? Are there more docs than patients? How can you get in so quickly? My doctor stays pretty busy. If I am *sick* I can usually get in before the end of the day. But he has a very busy practice and takes care of a lot of kids....

    Have a great day!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 9:05 AM
  • lland

    This is exactly why MHS athletics across the board have been on a downward slide for years. Its not just wrestling it is the way we approach sports anymore in Marshall. Because parents coddle the feelings of their kids who aren't "happy" and it has evolved into a "happy fest." Standards, a solid work ethic, a sense of accomplishment and achievement no longer matter. It did at one time in Marshall athletics. But not any more. For years we have let the "inmates" run the "asylum." The lowest common denominator of maturity is allowed to call the shots. Who cares if we actually win, compete or ever accomplish anything as long as my little Johnny is happy. You're very choice to ignore and intentionally overlook the improvements that have been made reveal that your real problem is not knowing how to help someone handle their immature emotions. As long as "happy fest" is our focus, we will never restore championships back to MHS . . . but you and some of the other parents will be "happy" and Johnny will be "happy" . . . never accomplished anything . . . but "happy." Maybe it is time for our boys to actually grow up and be young men, and it is time the "big people" in their lives actually helped them do that, rather than let them hold on to their blankies and coddle their feelings.

    -- Posted by goonieboonie on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 9:32 AM
  • goonieboonie,

    I agree whole heartedly! We are raising an entire generation of wussies. Consider the proposal to lock down the lunch hour. Why? Because it's easier to punish everyone than to actually deal with those who may be causing trouble. Those kids may never really see the consequences for thier actions until it's too late.

    -- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 9:43 AM
  • News said this:

    "I find it most interesting that 2 conservative proponents of obstructionism from each of the 2 main conservative parties, the Republicans and the Democrats, should only now begin to see the failure of conservative obstructionism."


    I'm unclear on how you determine that those two members of Congress are "just now" seeing the light. They've been working together this past year trying to garner support for statutory action on the deficit issue but have failed to convince enough members that a potential catastrophic outcome will result unless meaningful steps are taken, and immediately. For example, they want the freeze to start now, not later as Obama has suggested, and they want a major overhaul/reduction of entitlements. I wouldn't necessarily characterize their efforts as part of the status quo. I do believe a few legislators of both parties actually care more about our country and its people than they do about their own selfish ways, but it's pretty obvious that number is way short of what's needed to put things right.

    And then News said this:

    "Oh by the way, are all of those problems in our medical-care access system that were the catalyst of the attempt to overhaul our medical-care access system all cleared up now?"


    A few months ago someone described Congress as being unable to comprehensively deal with one issue at a time, let alone a host of them simultaneously, and we're clearly seeing that to be the case, especially when the will to do so is lacking. Jay Rockefeller said that in his opinion at least 90% of legislators don't adequately understand the intricacies of health care reform to know whether a proposal has merit, and therefore he had no confidence that a real plan would emerge. It's looking like both of them have Congress pegged.

    So, where does that leave us? It leaves the American people with no choice but to turn over the crop in Washington and install some fresh minds coupled with new energy and spirit to tackle the issues head-on and work through them to a successful conclusion. If the voters continue turning out the deadbeats, eventually those seeking the chairs will know going in that any dilly-dallying will NOT be tolerated.

    The members of Congress realize this, but they've had their way for so long that they believe they're impervious to any action taken by the voters.

    We'll know in a few months if in fact the public has its finger on the pulse of our "august" lawmaking body.

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 9:55 AM
  • news wrote (and I hope he was kidding....) --

    "if you want more docs, you may need to produce less guns and end all the foreign wars...its all a matter of priorities. But if you believe that killing brown skinned people in 3rd World countries that pose no direct, imminent threat to the USA is a higher priority, then perhaps you need less doctors. Again, it just depends on your priorities."

    What? If we had fewer guns, we would have more docs? What?


    -- Posted by missy08 on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 10:20 AM
  • Any coach that's not from, here is going to have oldtown haters to shake off. People should either be supportive, be quiet, or... grab a whistle before they condemn coaches. Try to build a good program w/o pushing kids past their limits, its a daily grind.

    I question those, if any ,unfair practices those "unhappy" wrestlers had to endeour? How is it those few young grapplers, that still honor their commitments, have managed to make it this long if things are so severe?

    One of the great things about the sport of wrestling is the way it makes you be accountable for your own success/lack of . Ultimately, a kid has to push his/herself everyday in order to be successful, a coach's duty is to help them do so. There aren't any "in between plays" moments with teammates, or "just shoulder pads and shorts" days for practice. Its WORK!!

    -- There's no right field in wrestling!!

    Keep fighting OWLS!

    -- Posted by viking99 on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 10:37 AM
  • My kid ran cross country. Ever been to a meet? Everybody plays. The runners compete against the other teams and their own team members. They are also competing against their own time. Coach Denton and Mrs. Coach are practicing runners. Boy, that is something you don't see everyday...... Check out cross country.

    Have a great day!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 10:48 AM
  • Right! A wrestling coach should work the kids hard but they also have to have some kind of rapport with the kids and support them win or lose. Heinzler had great bonds with the kids both on and off the mat. I dont know that this one has figured that part out yet.

    -- Posted by lland on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 10:49 AM
  • lland I bet you little boy is one of the ones that left the team because the coach treated them bad.

    To me it sounds like your crying cause little jonnie could not hack a tough practice!!!!!!!

    -- Posted by OldOwlFan on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 10:56 AM
  • Not really. Im crying because I dont think a high school coach should cuss & yell at students, or call them degrading names. Maybe Im out of line on that but I think a lot of other people feel the same way, or more teachers/coaches would be doing it!

    -- Posted by lland on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 11:15 AM
  • Lland,

    Your real agenda is showing. When all else has failed you resort to lies and slander.

    You started out with the argument that "they are losing everything" - when that was shown to be false and that there has been a 100% improvement from year-to-year;

    Then you switched your main argument to "unhappy" kids. The weakness and ridiculousness of that was exposed.

    Then it became clear to everyone reading this board that you're unhappy about your son quitting and not getting to do as he wanted in the wrestling room.

    Now when all logic and truth is gone . . . you claim your real concern is a "yelling, cussing, name calling coach" in an attempt to scare people and garner support to keep the kids safe.

    Your real agenda has exposed itself.

    If you and your son have something personal with the coach(es) you need to take it up with them not lie and slander on a community board.

    -- Posted by goonieboonie on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 12:11 PM
  • goonieboonie you hit the nail on the head with your last comment well done.

    lland let me ask you a question are you taking a kids word about what is going on or have you seen these things for your self?

    -- Posted by OldOwlFan on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 12:48 PM
  • I do not have a child on the MHS wrestling team now or previously. I have friends who have kids on the team and am merely chatting about conversations we have had about this season. It does seem that you are taking the conversation personally, which is interesting.

    -- Posted by lland on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 1:00 PM
  • Personal . . . no . . . just tired of seeing people who have never even played a sport, never known success, don't even have a clue what it takes to win, who could barely even graduate from high school, with tactics that only undermine and tear apart, destroy one athletic program after another in Marshall. There was a day in Marshall when we new what it took to win, and parents supported it. But not today. We haven't for years. Will we ever see another state championship banner hang in the gym? Not with your approach. I guess I can always move to Kirksville and maybe take our old banner with me. But, oh, that's right Kirksville has one of their own. Since you can't lead . . . follow . . . or get out of the way.

    -- Posted by goonieboonie on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 1:30 PM
  • Has anyone heard about this and how much a role did Becky Plattner play among others?


    -- Posted by alphadog on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 1:36 PM
  • goonieboonie--love the remark let's not lie and slander on a community board. HA isn't that all this is? Nobody knows the facts yet everybody including you is free to shout an opinion. settle down and let lland have his say --and old owl i have no opinion what so ever about the wrestling coach--havent been this year--just making a general statement to get in on the fun

    -- Posted by WickedWitch on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 1:58 PM
  • Goonie, I agree wholeheartedly with you about knowing what it takes to win, but I think these kids first have to want it bad enough and that is hard to do without the proper support. This new coach is a young guy himself, I would think he would be able to relate to these young wrestlers better than anyone, but from what the kids are saying, it isnt happening. I hope that he learns to balance the roles of being a young person and being a person with a lot of control soon so he can keep this team on track!

    -- Posted by lland on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 2:04 PM
  • When are we going to get past blaming the kids, the lack of talent, the parents, lack of school spirit?? I am surprised someone hasn't said it's because people don't shop the square!!! Come on!!

    -- Posted by noshadesofgray on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 2:37 PM
  • The way I saw them wrestle a few weeks ago hard, solid, good positioning, good movement they seem on the right track to bring the wrestling program back. Give the program a chance.

    -- Posted by Alan J on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 2:44 PM
  • I guess you are trying to say it's time to get back to bickering about politics--tired of sports?

    -- Posted by WickedWitch on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 3:58 PM
  • Okay, since we fixed everything in sports we can move on to politics but that doesn't give me much hope!

    Hey, what do you think of the American church people from out west accused of "child trafficing" in Haiti?

    -- Posted by goonieboonie on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 5:41 PM
  • news --

    I did a quick internet search and found that the applications and enrollment to US medical schools and osteopathic school has increased since 05. I should have included the links but there were probably 6 or 8 sources that gave those statistics.

    I am still baffled as to how your Doc could be so accessible. Maybe he refers complicated cases? Maybe he doesn't "follow" patients? Pure speculation. Are you sure he is a doctor? *Grin*


    -- Posted by missy08 on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 7:00 PM
  • Was in Marshall today. Have you seen the HUGE political sign on the west side of the square? I didn't think you could put political signs up this far in advance of the election.

    Does anyone have an answer? By the way...who is Riley?

    -- Posted by silverdollar on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 7:03 PM
  • Brian Riley is running for Ike Skelton's seat in Congress. I don't know whether there is any time limit on when campaigning can start, but I'll check for you.


    -- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 7:09 PM
  • Have you read the "Kids Count" article yet? This situation is not acceptable to me and should not be acceptable to anyone that lives in this County. How about the Saline County Development Corporation change their focus to correcting this situation. That Corporation absorbs a great deal of money and has yet to prove its worth to me. All blow and no show. How about all the so called community leaders involved in this corporation putting their efforts into something worthwhile, such as solving this situation.

    -- Posted by red dog on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 7:26 PM
  • Wow! Good research "missy". You get an "A" for the day.

    -- Posted by Alan J on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 10:02 PM
  • News.... I really love the arrogance of people from other nations who think that the US should try to be identical to other nations.

    I grant you one thing, the Repubs failed to address the health care issues after Clinton. I have never said other wise.

    BUT, just because the Dems want to socialize medicine and create ANOTHER entitlement program and just because the Repubs failed to address health care reform before Obama, does not also create causation for the US to move to socialized medicine.

    Again, you nicely avoid the whole issue the underlies health care and welfare and any other entitlement program, in that it does NOT solve the problem but puts a nice band aide on it AND as I said, creates an even larger group of people dependent on the government, slaves to the government with NO real assistance to SOLVE the "why" problems the created the poverty in the first place.

    Dependency is an mental disorder

    -- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 10:25 PM
  • looking for the "rude comments have been deleted" button

    -- Posted by lhcg on Wed, Feb 3, 2010, at 11:53 PM
  • "red dog" you are dead on right to call attention to that article.

    It is a disgrace that Saline County as rich as it is compared to so many other counties has fallen to the bottom tier of counties. One would think it would be THE topic on the blog for sometime to come.

    How could the current situation occur here when it has not occured in the adjoining counties?

    Something is rotten.

    I posted further at the comments section below the story.

    It seems the decline in the quality of local sports programs, the increase in crimes related to poverty, ignorance, and drugs are just dead canaries in the coal mine. This article began to drag out dead miners.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 4, 2010, at 12:24 AM
  • No one who has even a modicum of concern about the future of Marshall, and Saline County should fail to read Ms. Fairchild's "Kids Count" article.

    Most of us who have grown up in Marshall were not subjected to a bottom of the barrel environment. Pity the kids of Saline County now as they decline toward a third world environment.

    What will the city, and county be when the disadvantaged kids of today, are running the businesses, the local government, working the jobs twenty years from now?

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 4, 2010, at 12:42 AM
  • Mr Xray:

    If you have a solution to poverty in this country or in any country, YOU NEED TO STEP forward and give us your answer. But as I suspect you are just interested in pointing out the issues in other's lives. Sometimes poverty is just a function of the current economic condition of people in a particular region during rough times. Remember it was Jesus who said that the poor will always be with you. Sometimes poverty is just bad luck followed by bad decisions followed by more bad luck.

    Remember that people need a hand up not a boot down.

    That is how I see it pssst!

    -- Posted by movaldude on Thu, Feb 4, 2010, at 1:15 AM
  • Land of the Free and the Home of the Brave.

    I am proud to be an AMERICAN!

    Some that post here seem to think they have all the answers to everything, especially what is wrong with our country.

    Some are "wanna be" socialists. The lack of capitalization is deliberate. These "wanna be" people are forgetting history, if they ever knew it.

    The Government of the United States does not owe me, or you, anything but a safe place in which to live with all the freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution and Bill of Rights. Good government starts right here at the City level and runs all the way to the top. We need to be very careful of whom we elect to represent us. Remember the old adage that some people grow with promotion, others swell. Let's leave the swells at home and send only our best to represent us.

    As for socialism in any form in MY government. A pox on all that promote it. Socialism is the first cousin of communism and we all know how that works out.

    Be it so.

    -- Posted by red dog on Thu, Feb 4, 2010, at 9:50 AM
  • MHS football players that signed with Mo West were not even mentioned....how sad....


    -- Posted by alphadog on Thu, Feb 4, 2010, at 11:01 AM
  • That is unfortunate....however, if you go to Missouri Western's website they are highlighted there.

    -- Posted by noshadesofgray on Thu, Feb 4, 2010, at 12:03 PM
  • noshadesofgray and alphadog: Hope you saw this:


    -- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Thu, Feb 4, 2010, at 4:37 PM
  • I see nothing wrong with Socialism, seems that's how we got this far! There is Socialism in just about every thing we Accomplish in this Country! Like Nana Dot, said try it on your own, and see how far you get? A Socialized, Democratic Government and your Neighbor's are the only thing between you, and something picking your Bone's clean! You think your going it alone? Get real!

    -- Posted by Jo on Thu, Feb 4, 2010, at 5:24 PM
  • News... I know you are dual citizenship at least according to you. And yes my UNveiled commentcwas directed st you

    my question regarding the liberal and newsacross's unsolutions of entitlement programs sponsored by the fed are still valid and unanswered except for one who wanted my answer but that accused me of not having solutions. When you all come up with an answer to my unanswered questions I will answer with my solutions. Until you answer my questions you are just avoiding the problem

    -- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Feb 4, 2010, at 10:35 PM
  • Good for you News Across Maybe they get it now,ha! We also have something in common,besides our Politics. We both have Property in Independence, Mo. Good little Town!Have seen Harry on some of his Walks down Truman Rd. & the Square way back when!

    -- Posted by Jo on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 1:02 AM
  • Hey news,

    Me again. I have a question. Are you tired of my questions? You pay no taxes in Australia but you have "improved and free public services such as socialized medicine, nationalized energy, free housing, socialized daycare for kids and parents, extensive, free public facilities such as swimming pools, theaters, public transportation, subsidized groceries, subsidized restaurants and pubs, free sporting events, free festivals and concerts, free communications including free phone service, internet, and cable TV, as well as socialized dentistry and anything else the majority wants and enjoys".

    Where does the money come from? Are there "special" trees there?


    -- Posted by missy08 on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 7:00 AM
  • news,

    So sorry that you think my question is silly. I was truly looking for an answer. I don't "think" nor pretend to "know" what Australia utilizes. I thought since you are so well educated in economics, and maintain your dual citizenship, and are familiar with both "systems", you could give me a basic explanation. I doubt that the physicians in Australia work for nothing. I doubt the school teachers don't get a paycheck. There has to be a source for these monies.

    "If Australia or the United States were a Democratic Socialist society the resources for such things would be allocated during the scientific planning of the economy done by a central economic planning committee elected by the People...rather than the current system which delivers most of those resources in the form of wealth to the richest fat-cats in the Country and away from the rightful owners...the People."

    Okay, so where do these "resources" come from?

    Have a great day!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 8:50 AM
  • Medical care in Oz is NOT free. The burden of visible and invisible taxes is enormous.

    And health care in the USA won't be "free" either. In fact, it will put a crushing burden on the middle class (where all taxes hit because that's where the money is). For example:

    "the President's policies in the stimulus bill and health-care debate increase current barriers to the American dream. These legislative efforts (we use the Senate health-care bill for illustration) raise to shocking levels the effective marginal tax rates (EMTR) on lower and middle-income singles and families--WITH THE GOVERNMENT TAKING UP TO 41% OF EACH ADDITIONAL DOLLAR.

    "The mechanics are simple. The effective marginal tax rate is the answer to the question: "If I earn $1 more, how much less than $1 do I get to save or spend?" If you can keep that full dollar for your disposal, the effective marginal tax rate is zero. If earning another dollar does not raise your disposable income by even a penny, the effective marginal tax rate is 100 percent.

    "Obviously, neither extreme is realistic. But exactly where federal policies come down in between has dramatic implications for the ability of families to rise from the ranks of the poor, or to ascend toward the upper end of the middle class. This mobility is the heart of the American dream that has made the United States a beacon of economic light for centuries. Equal opportunity to achieve that dream -- not equal paychecks or equal government handouts -- is the real-world litmus test for fairness in government policy. [continues]"


    -- Posted by AF Brat on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 10:28 AM
  • AF Brat,

    I think we are asking the wrong questions in the first place. Instead of how do we pay for health care we should be asking why is it so much in the first place?

    -- Posted by What the f...... on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 11:34 AM
  • Lack of competition always drives prices UP. There is little (none in some states) competition in plan design. Some states literally have only a single "approved" health care insurer. And the plans are exempt from the federal antitrust laws so they can collude over markets, products, and prices.

    As I've said repeatedly on this page, the simplist, quickest, and most effective remedy is for the Congress to preempt restrictive state regulation, allow NATIONAL competition in plan design, and allow insurers to to sell in a NATIONAL market. And repeal the antitrust exemption.

    I don't like crowded airplanes or poor service but I really did enjoy my $600 round trip flight to London. Deregulation works FOR THE CUSTOMER even if it does make life harder (by introducing competition) for the businessman -- some win and somw lose -- but prices go down.

    -- Posted by AF Brat on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 12:13 PM
  • Another thing that would possibly/probably decrease the health care cost would be limiting the payout on lawsuits. Doctors are practicing defensive medicine. Nurses spend more time documenting what they're doing than actually doing it. Also, hang out outside the emergency room sometime and watch the abuses of the ED services.

    Have a great day!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 1:03 PM
  • Oh news.... you make me smile. No, you make me laugh out loud.

    I think I will just go back to ignoring your posts and avoiding your rants. I asked for some simple info and get referred to textbooks and continuing ed. Thanks.

    And as for the malpractice... you are assuming that all claims are legitimate.


    -- Posted by missy08 on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 5:12 PM
  • news,

    I did notice in the post to AF you addressed part of my question. You do pay taxes. Now, was that so hard? And yes, I am guilty. I read the post. Kind of like a car wreck, I just couldn't help myself.

    As for the malpractice. Yes, that is for the courts to sort out. And that is where the major expense is involved. SO many times insurance companies will pay a settlement to avoid the cost of the trial. That doesn't mean the physician is guilty of malpractice, just that it isn't economically wise to fight the case. (Can I use the "e" word without having a degree in that field?)

    No, thank you to taking the econ classes. I will continue my nursing continuing ed and use my skills and my expertise where it is most needed.

    news, have a great weekend. I am watching the snow fall and preparing steaks for the grill....


    -- Posted by missy08 on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 5:59 PM
  • Rumor is...Stouffer wants a place on the square to put up a larger sign than the one Riley put up. Somebody should be able to make a few bucks renting the front of a building for a sign.

    -- Posted by silverdollar on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 6:02 PM
  • Again, you answer just a small portion of my previous question and I thank you for that. However, I have already investigated that and am now more informed on the governmental practices of Australia.

    I must have some understanding of economics -- if my portfolio is an indicator. Or maybe I'm just a good guesser.

    news, did I use the word "promise"? I admitted to guilt for reading.... LOL

    Signing off for the night. You will have to be arrogant and condescending to someone else. I must admit, this has been fun and, btw, my steak was wonderful.


    -- Posted by missy08 on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 7:34 PM
  • newsacross,

    Enjoyed reading in The Scotsman about the replacement "Edinburgh Castle" backdrop that your Australian designers have come up in rapid order, though not cheaply, for the Tattoo's concerts in Sydney. High praise, indeed. Will you be attending one of the performances?

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 8:20 PM

    I'm wanting to acquire a GOOD video splitter-joiner software, but my Googling/Asking/Abouting have yielded little of value.

    Any suggestions?

    -- Posted by Slater on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 8:59 PM
  • Overheard in the Executive Washroom at Goldman-Sachs:


    -- Posted by Slater on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 9:14 PM
  • Slater,

    Howdy. I was just reading a NYTimes interview w/Jenny Sanford. Mark Sanford was at Goldman Sachs when he met Jenny. She was at Lazard Freres. A bright, classy lady.

    Do you have daffodils blooming in SA or is it too warm for them?

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 9:29 PM
  • Howdy Upsedaisy,

    The newspeople seem to be making Sanford out to be even more of a lout than first thought. She'll be well-rid of him.

    I do believe that daffodils will grow here, depending on the variety. I'm pretty ignorant about aspects of horticulture, so I wouldn't attempt to grow much of anything requiring focused care, and my wife never cultivated a green thumb. Once upon a time she place a freeze-dried fern in a corner near the fireplace, and under her care it died.

    -- Posted by Slater on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 10:08 PM
  • missy08 posted: "You will have to be arrogant and condescending to someone else."

    You hit that nail on the head.

    -- Posted by AF Brat on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 10:11 PM
  • ┐C--mo podemos juzgar cuando no podemos entenderlos?

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 11:27 PM
  • ┐Y c--mo pueden juzgar nosotros cuando no nos entienden?

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 11:43 PM
  • Alles ist verloren, alle decken die Ohren, weil Unter-Sprachen, die nicht ihre eigenen sind, ignoriert.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Fri, Feb 5, 2010, at 11:53 PM

    -- Posted by Jo on Sat, Feb 6, 2010, at 12:07 AM
  • I think the section where this website allows people to post comments under any story SHOULD be disabled!!! It doesn't matter if it is a positive or negative comment! All this does is cause turmoil in our town of Marshall! That is all that people talk about anymore is people's comments posted after stories on this website. Nobody could post stuff like this before the internet, back when citizens just received newspapers in their front yards! For the sake of the town I love, the town of Marshall, MO, Marshall Democrat, would you please disable this feature???? It is destroying people's lives, including my own!!!

    -- Posted by dwp on Sat, Feb 6, 2010, at 5:43 AM
  • newsacross.... lol I had to laugh at the NAACP saying that tancredo (spelling) somehow made a racist remark when he said what he did there not being a civics and literacy test before voting.

    I understand the historical context that the NAACP rep referred to, BUT the point was not to go back to not allowing blacks to vote, which is what the NAACP is accusing Tancredo of saying. That was NOT what he said nor inferred.

    In fact, not so long ago, NEWSACROSS, you were complaining about people in the US NOT being taught or learning about the US political system.

    THEN when they said that the usage of Obama's middle name was purely an attempt to get people to associate Obama with the Muslims is so stupid and ridiculous..... Obama uses his middle name for political purposes more than any other person or group of people do.

    But I expect this type of stuff from you

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Feb 6, 2010, at 5:54 AM
  • Allowing people to post comments to stories and in Speak Out is merely giving them a place to put in print what people are already thinking and saying all over town. You should not think that before this forum became available, nothing was being said about any of the subjects addressed here, because it WAS. You just didn't hear it unless you were in on the conversation.

    Posting comments to online stories is common at newspapers all over the U.S., not just here in Marshall, and in some places the comments are far more vicious (and unedited) than they are here.

    -- Posted by Miss Marple on Sat, Feb 6, 2010, at 7:03 AM
  • Has anyone voted in the online poll more than once?

    The numbers are quite unexpected; that is, I'm surprised by the large percentage disagreeing with the Supreme court decision. Do I have a misperception about the collective resolve of Marshall citizens, or have the same few people been voting again and again?

    I've voted four times - once for each choice. :)

    -- Posted by Slater on Sat, Feb 6, 2010, at 11:56 AM
  • I see that Latimer has gotten plenty of press by this job change, so I suppose I should believe there's a significance here.

    Would someone enlighten me? I know what a city administrator does, so I don't need a job description, but any other relevant points would be appreciated.

    -- Posted by Slater on Sat, Feb 6, 2010, at 5:39 PM
  • Jo Thanks for the link to Move to Amend. I noticed that Howard Zinn, OKR's favorite historian signed on before his death. Perhaps, they will have to take his name down. Bill Moyer also signed as did I. Thanks again for your common sense wisdom offered to readers of Speaking Out.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Sat, Feb 6, 2010, at 7:13 PM
  • This video link about Latimer up above here has pretty poor sound quality, Editor Crump.

    Should I conclude that Cape Girardeau has you on a tight budget? :(

    -- Posted by Slater on Sat, Feb 6, 2010, at 10:39 PM
    Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
    Sorry about the (lack of) audio quality! You could also assume (correctly) that your cameraman is still learning the trade and a) should have taken an external mic or, failing that b) gotten much closer to the speakers.

    I learn a little more every time, though I know that doesn't help much at the moment.

  • Jo: Me too.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Feb 7, 2010, at 1:13 AM
  • newsacross, only the twisted logic of someone as far left as you would have interpreted, or simply parroted what the NAACP did about those remarks.

    ANYONE with a reasoning brain, or less even, would understand that those remarks had NOTHING to do with race, but a stab at the uneducated public that YOU have also complained aboutl

    Wake up to your own prejudices.

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Feb 7, 2010, at 3:54 AM
  • news across...

    so you have a problem with Shelby holding up votes for appointees, but you dont have a problem with Obama and his minions working the Cornhusker kickback in the health care bill with Neb. Senator Nelsen and then denying that he (Obama) had anything to do with it?

    Sort of hypocritical, but not unexpected

    Bash the right for their actions but when the left does the same thing and HAS done the same things it is all in the name of the democratic process.

    NOTE: I have been saying all along that the WHOLE political realm is corrupt and problematic, not just one side like some of you. I know you will find that hard to believe Newsacross lol

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Feb 7, 2010, at 4:17 AM
  • Slater? Thoughts on Marshall City Government? I noticed you had replied on here about it with no responses, just the same back and forth.

    -- Posted by wheresthelove on Sun, Feb 7, 2010, at 8:07 AM
  • Those pesky Republicans, they do have a plan.

    "The plan ensures UNIVERSAL ACCESS to affordable health insurance by restructuring the tax code, allowing all Americans to secure an affordable health plan that best suits their needs, and shifting the control and ownership of health coverage away from the government and employers to individuals.

    "It provides a refundable tax credit--$2,300 for individuals and $5,700 for families--to purchase coverage (FROM ANOTHER STATE if they so choose) and KEEP IT WITH THEM if they move or change jobs. It establishes transparency in health-care price and quality data, so this critical information is readily available before someone needs health services.

    "State-based high risk pools will make affordable care available to those WITH PRE-EXISTING CONDITIONS. In addition to the tax credit, Medicaid will provide SUPPLEMENTAL payments to low-income recipients so they too can obtain the health coverage of their choice and no longer be consigned to the stigmatized, sclerotic care that Medicaid has come to represent."


    -- Posted by AF Brat on Sun, Feb 7, 2010, at 12:39 PM
  • Jeez, here I am confused again... I've read much of the transcripts from the "Tea Party" and I can't find any place that implies that a specific group would be unable to vote if a basic test was required. Not anywhere. That leads me to believe that "assuming" that a specific group not be able to pass the test is a very racist assumption to make.

    And, as with all groups, there are radicals amongst them. I don't "assume" that all liberals are adulterers just because of Bill Clinton, etc. I don't "assume" that all liberals are arrogant... and condescending...

    Ooops. Halftime show. Gotta go!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Sun, Feb 7, 2010, at 7:02 PM
  • "I guess if you don't want to see something, you won't."

    Right there.


    Have a great day!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 7:13 AM
  • A great political commercial. Especially about the $90 million to benefit his relatives.


    -- Posted by AF Brat on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 9:19 AM
  • Anybody notice that Quiznos has locked the doors!?

    -- Posted by yomomma on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 9:55 AM
  • yomomma poated: "Anybody notice that Quiznos has locked the doors!?"

    I guess they didn't cash their stimulus check.

    -- Posted by AF Brat on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 11:54 AM
  • Newsacross...

    I see you are purposefully echoing the liberal media in the distortion of the comments by the speaker at the Tea Party... NO where did he say that any race would be required to take the test while the other races would be exempt. LOL

    You are just proving what a hypocritically and biased person you are that cannot have intellectual discussions with someone who has opposing view points from you and that you get YOUR thoughts from the liberal media outlets.

    -- Posted by mrxray on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 2:29 PM
  • news across... regarding recess appointments... you continue over and over to point out the exact same flaws that anyone else has been in our political system. It is corrupt and not about the good of the nation and only about the politicians keeping their power while the citizens apathetically pay little attention.

    The only difference is that you have an extreme LEFT leaning and continually make statements that prove you do not have any semblance of an open mind, while you try to attribute things to me based on your hatred and biased beliefs.

    You will NEVER find a post that I have posted where I have said I am in total agreement or even agree with the Repub party the majority of the time. I, unlike YOU, can see the flaws in ALL politicians of both parties and in their actions and can take a realistic look at thinks.

    But to each their own... lol

    -- Posted by mrxray on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 2:34 PM
  • mrx and AF,

    I'm sure you read the exchange. Isn't it amazing that some are so busy trying to burn down the forest they can't see that they are a tree?

    Those posts regarding racism were hysterical and then just for fun, let's throw in a comment regarding sexual preference.

    And, if one isn't Democrat "enough", we'll just say they are conservative and toss him over.

    Too funny!!!!

    Hope y'all are having a great, though cold and snowy, day!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 4:14 PM
  • I don't understand why conservatives are depicted as racist when some of the biggest racist are people within there own race. For instance Rev Al Sharpton and Rev Jesse Jackson are some of the biggest racist that get media attention. They could care less about you or me all they care about is their money. The Republicans are often depicted as racist when over the years members of the Democratic party were against civil rights. They also have perpetuated the welfare or entitlements that have destroyed the black family and any other families that have 2 and 3 generations that don't produce anything but more kids to live on the hard earned dollar of the taxpayer. If racism and poverty was going to be fixed the Democratic Party should have fixed it by now because they have been in charge of our federal government for the majority of the last 50 years. If they would actually fix all of the problems that we have then they would lose their voter base because people should be independent instead of dependent on the hard earned resources of someone else. Instead of accusing people of being racist get off your duff and do something for yourself or better yet do something to help someone else because if you are not part of the solution you are part of the problem.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 7:53 PM
  • I'm glad to see news across is here to set the record straight about capitalism and civil rights. This TEA party is now advocating for a literacy test for voting, this is the same tactic the right wingers used in the past to supress the African-American in the past. Where have all the moderate republicans went? Most have abandoned their principles just to spread hate proganda against the current administration. I have noticed that a few posts show that a certain few have a Fox news education which can be noticed by empty hearted thoughts they post. Warning if someone suggest that social programs hurt the person they are trying to help they probably listen to the radical right wing news media. These people suggest we should just let them suffer and that will teach them. Go right wing crazies!

    -- Posted by Headshrinker on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 10:21 PM
  • Nicely done News.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 10:22 PM
  • Anyone realize when Ronald Reagan was president we had Johnny Cash and Bob Hope, now that Obama is president we have no cash or no hope just a bunch of change!!

    -- Posted by MyVoiceIsHeard on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 10:52 PM
  • Check this link for a great little comment as to how Joe Biden could end the congressional stalemate that is caused by the filibuster. Concise, and easily understandable it is worth a read by any who are scratching their heads as to why we have a do nothing congress.

    Maybe it is time we the people put some pressure on good old Joe to flip the switch that will end the people's frustration, and get America rolling again. http://papadablogger.blogspot.com/2010/02/we-have-crisis-mister-vice-president.h...

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 11:07 PM
  • And MyVoiceIsHeard do you realize that by the time Ronald Reagan was done the only Hope other than Bob remaining was false, and the only remaining Cash that belonged to the people was Johnny?

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 11:22 PM
  • HEADLINE: Toyota Recall Accelerates Unexpectedly. (Stolen from The Ironic Times)

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Feb 8, 2010, at 11:31 PM
  • Wheresthelove - Thanks for your response about the city administration.

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 9:53 AM
  • A couple of years ago I happened onto an article about the discovery of certain physiological changes occurring in the human brain which seem to indicate a shifting toward a greater degree of social isolationism.

    Well, this caught my eye since one essential need of humans is positive social interaction.

    If you have an interest in social psychology, you'll find some informative readings in this link:


    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 10:48 AM
  • Yes Slater...we got alot of things made oh so much clearer didn't we.....much like these organizations themselves. Have a great day!!

    -- Posted by wheresthelove on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 10:53 AM
  • Wheresthelove - Yep, we learned just what I expected.

    I've posted questions here from time to time, most seeking what I thought was useful information, and all but two or three have been ignored - you and John Q and Kathy Fairchild are the ones I can name who've taken the time to reply.

    I've been intrigued by the perceived need of some that Marshall needs a runway at its airport to accommodate jet aircraft. I believe the former mayor was a proponent of that expansion, along with the Saline County Development squad. Now, I recall that the city contributed approximately $350,000-$500,000 to the runway project, money which I feel could have been better spent (e.g., that would've paid for the courthouse renovation, without a sales tax increase, and yes I know it's a county project, for all of you who're poised to jump on my example).

    The craftiness employed by some of those installed in various governmental positions bears close scrutiny by the citizenry when their signals indicate they want us to believe they have all the answers for every question.

    One contradiction to their belief is apparent by taking a drive around the square any afternoon - you don't have to worry about pedestrians since there aren't any.

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 11:52 AM
  • Has anyone seen this? This is a FAQ to the MEC, I cross cehcked with what I could find on public sites on the internet and the only thing I could find was Wikapedia "not really a valid source" but it listed Marshall as a 4th class city which leads me to believe this law applies to Marshall. I'm still conducting research, will update when I have more information.

    Missouri Ethics Commission

    Conflict of Interest

    Frequently Asked Questions

    This is intended only as a guide to aid in understanding the duties and responsibilities of the Missouri Ethics

    Commission. For the Law's complete requirements, consult the law itself, codified in Chapter 105.450 through

    105.467 of the Revised Statutes of Missouri.

    Created: August 19, 2009

    5. Question: Can a Mayor of a 4th Class City also be employed as the City Administrator? (Missouri Ethics Commission Advisory Opinion 2008.09.CI.008)

    Answer: No, the Mayor could not retain his elected position and also be employed as City Administrator, and the Mayor is prohibited from assuming the position for one year from leaving office.

    -- Posted by alphadog on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 12:13 PM
    Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
    Marshall is a third-class city, according to the Official Manual of Missouri, 2009-2010 edition. Whether that makes any difference in terms of ethical expections, I don't know.
  • You're onto it now, Alphadog!

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 12:29 PM
  • is mr. harris really coming back?

    -- Posted by ballin on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 12:46 PM
  • Sec. 105-454 (M.E.C.)

    5) Perform any service for consideration, during one year after termination of his or her office or employment, by which performance he or she attempts to influence a decision of any agency of the state, or a decision of any political subdivision in which he or she was an officer or employee or over which he or she had supervisory power, except that this provision shall not be construed to prohibit any person from performing such service and receiving compensation therefor, in any adversary proceeding or in the preparation or filing of any public document or to prohibit an employee of the executive department from being employed by any other department, division or agency of the executive branch of state government. For purposes of this subdivision, within ninety days after assuming office, the governor shall by executive order designate those members of his or her staff who have supervisory authority over each department, division or agency of state government for purposes of application of this subdivision. The executive order shall be amended within ninety days of any change in the supervisory assignments of the governor's staff. The governor shall designate not less than three staff members pursuant to this subdivision; ( the intent of this one is probably in regard to lobbying, at least if viewed from a strict constructionist position)

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 3:04 PM
  • Some interesting research there alphadog regarding the MEC and the current Marshall mayor/city administrator fisaco. Though there appears to be a disconnect between the issue of third class versus fouth class city status, seems like resolving this item would be easy enough via an inquiry to the MEC with the corrected question. I wonder if Mr. Stouffer checked this aspect out last week when the Marshall-News asked for his comment on the whole affair?

    -- Posted by oceanlord49 on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 3:58 PM
  • After you've finished pondering whether your former mayor was legally entitled to the city administrator job, have a look at these photos which you may find interesting, or even somewhat remarkable:


    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 4:44 PM
  • http://www.mec.mo.gov/WebDocs/PDF/Complaint/ConflictofInterestFAQ.pdf

    It is a situation that the M.E.C. would likely have an interest, if the situation were to be called to their attention.

    Perhaps Ms. Latimer will be proactive, and alert the M.E.C. herself. Perhaps she contacted them prior to applying for her administrative position? In fact I bet she did.

    After all whether, or not there was a conflict of interest would have crossed her mind at the time she first contemplated applying for the position. She is a smart person, and she would have researched the question, and probably checked with M.E.C. before further pursuing the job.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 4:49 PM
  • Great pics Slater.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 5:16 PM
  • OKR - I didn't see any notification by the city that Latimer's move is legal, and that was my point in stirring up comment about it.

    Most likely it's legal, but the silence coupled with the perception makes for a questionable action.

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 5:22 PM
    Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
    The "silence" is due to the fact that we're trying to do necessary research and get comments and clarification from appropriate authorities. Takes time. I'm interested in getting the information right, even if it takes more time.
  • news across

    You didn't address or answer anything I was talking about so I am not going to waste my time.

    Like I said if you are not part of the solution you are part of the problem.

    As long as you feel you are contributing then that is what matters.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 5:39 PM
  • "OKR - I didn't see any notification by the city that Latimer's move is legal, and that was my point in stirring up comment about it.

    Most likely it's legal, but the silence coupled with the perception makes for a questionable action."

    -- (Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 5:22 PM)

    Slater I am sure that Ms. Latimer will address the issue forthwith. I think she knows it is in her interest to do so at this special time when citizens are outraged across the nation at the lack of governmental trasparency. I think she is also sensitive to the ramifications of the unusual circumstance she has created for herself, and hence will be the first to address it.

    I can not imagine a rationale for remaining silent in the circumstance at hand.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 5:59 PM
    Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
    I talked with Connie Latimer and Don Stouffer today. Mr. Stouffer confirmed that the procedure followed by Mrs. Latimer to resign as mayor and accept the city manager job correctly followed city ordinances.

    Mrs. Latimer said if she thought the move violated any law she would not have accepted the position. Mr. Stouffer, likewise, said if he thought there were any legal problems with the move, he would have advised the mayor and council about them.

    City ordinances indicate the choice of city administrator is up to the council. The council is supposed to choose the person it deems best for the job, someone with public administration education or appropriate experience.

    We have not yet gotten clarification from the ethics commission and city officials have not had a chance to respond to the opinion posted here earlier. We hope to have more information Wednesday.

  • Slater and OK (I think),

    There has been a lot of posting regarding the appointment of the mayor to the CA job -- most of it is here. There is some from earlier stories when she was still "considering". These are listed from most recent to oldest....




    Have a great evening.


    -- Posted by missy08 on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 6:00 PM
  • Missy - thanks for the links. Yep, plenty of comments, but I didn't see any reporting by the prress that the move is legal.

    OKR - I was hopeful that my prior posts implying the questions of the ethical and legal aspects of the switch would have been addressed by the press.

    It's now 9 days later and still no statement? Certainly not my idea of the way to run a railroad.

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 6:45 PM
  • Slater,

    I do know that both the new CA and the new Mayor have responded to letters that have been received questioning the "process". Both defended the appointment.


    -- Posted by missy08 on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 6:51 PM
  • What is an Advisory Opinion?

    ä¤Issued by the Commission upon written request

    ä¤Made by any person who would be directly affected by the application of law

    ä¤Opinion can act as a defense against prosecution

    ä¤All identifying information about the requestor is redacted

    This is from the Missouri Ethics Commission web site. Ms. Latimer is savvy. As she is experienced it is likely she contacted them early on for an advisory opinion. Especially considering that their opinion, whether ultimately found to be valid, or not, could be used as a defense against prosecution. Also if she later had determined that she did not want to pursue the opportunity, "all identifying information about the requestor is redacted".

    I think we will be hearing from her shortly just so.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 6:57 PM
  • Missy - the city attorney said it doesn't violate city ordinance, but apparently no one bothered to ask the state people if it's okay. That's been my point.

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 6:58 PM
  • There's legal and there is ethical. The Latimer appointment may have been legal, but it looks unethical to me and many others. Latimer was still in office while being considered for the job, and she could have been involved in the screening of other applicants (if there really were any). The school district changed their policies in this area after the McCorkle fiasco. Too bad our city still allows these back room deals.

    -- Posted by raysfan on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 7:12 PM
  • News - I didn't apply for the job, nor did any of my family. :)

    As Commish said, the legal and ethical elements are distinct, and my view, based on reading the news accounts, is that this switch is unethical as it appears to anyone looking from the outside.

    When I first started following it, I was reminded of another Missourian (around 90 miles to the west) who favored backroom deals.

    No doubt Latimer is paper qualified to hold the position, but I can't see how this was fair to other potential applicants.

    Based on the way this matter has been handled, I'd urge the voters to dig into the details of the imminent school bond election. The property owner whose land a new school could occupy might just be handsomely rewarded for parting with it.

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 7:34 PM
  • news,

    at the risk of opening a can of "neocon" worms --

    The CA appointment is controversial because --

    1. as pointed out by commish -- yes, Mayor Latimer had access to the applications received

    2. no one is aware of any advertising for this position -- or at least they are not saying if they are

    3. the filing date for elected city positions had passed

    As I have stated in my other posts -- I like Connie. I think she will do the best job that she is capable of doing. I wish they had advertised, accepted applications, conducted interviews, and then if she was the best for the job, by all means, she should have the job.


    -- Posted by missy08 on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 7:42 PM
  • news across,

    I think normal "expectations" might be a better term. City ordinances don't prescribe a procedure for selecting a city administrator. Unless I'm missing something, there's no mention of advertising or interviewing or anything. Just: "The city administrator shall be employed by a majority of the members elected to the city council, with the approval of the mayor."

    It's pretty clear that some people expect a fairly specific procedure to be followed. Just wanted to note that the selection process did not violate the ordinance.

    -- Posted by Eric Crump on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 8:04 PM
  • Editor Crump - So, you're saying the city employs arbitrary methods for advertising job openings, and arbitrary methods when determining if interviews of qualified applicants will be conducted to select the person for a position?

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 8:16 PM
    Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
    I'm saying the city ordinances -- at least the ones posted online that refer to the city adminstrator position -- do not specify the detailed procedures some people expect. You could call it arbitrary or you could call it unspecific, whichever you prefer.

    The council appears to have complied with the ordinance's requirements but not with the unwritten requirements of the people. What many people expect is a procedure that is common in business and government -- not an unreasonable expectation, but not a specified requirement, either.

    Maybe the ordinance is in need of amendment!

  • Mayor Latimer Cartoon

    Ok, I know it's rough. I never bothered to do the finsihed version as I could not convince MDN to print it.


    -- Posted by What the f...... on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 9:04 PM
  • Ha! Ha! - Good one, WTF!

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 9:10 PM
  • Thanks Slater,

    I'll post more on local issues as ideas and time permits.

    -- Posted by What the f...... on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 9:16 PM
  • Thanks News,

    I really appreciate all comments good and bad.

    -- Posted by What the f...... on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 9:29 PM
  • Slater,

    Thanks for the link to the pictures of the frozen Mississippi. I remember pictures taken in a serious winter storm late 60s in Cleveland Ohio of Lake Erie. There had been high winds followed by rapidly falling temperatures. The pictures of the frozen waves looked like Japanese prints from the late 1800s.

    My mother born in Glasgow, MO in 1909 remembered the Missouri river freezing over allowing horse drawn sleighs and ice skating.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 9:29 PM
  • Eric-

    Thanks for visiting with Mr. Stouffer, as you said you would do. My problem with this is the matter of fact attitude that Ms. Latimer, Ms. Alexander and the council seem to have. According to your article Ms. Latimer resigns, Ms. Alexander is appointed Mayor and Ms. Latimer is appointed City Administrator after Mr. Duval's motion and subsequent unanimous council vote. Unbelievably, the only discussion on the matter was after the vote. By the way, how much are we going to pay her? How about 62,000 which is 93% of the salary budgeted for her predecessor. He had ONLY 25 years experience on the job.

    Let's face it. They held more discussion prior to their ridiculous vote to deny a perfectly legitimate request from the Saline County Fair Board for a liquor license than they did on this mundane piece of business. Then again, I'm sure that all of these discussions were held well prior to the meeting, outside of the chamber meeting room.

    -- Posted by Bcat on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 9:33 PM
  • Awesome WTF.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 9:41 PM
  • Gee so much being written...so little time. I just hurried back over from the discussion following the 'Kids Count' article that was published. By the way Mrxray I think I fully answered the questions you specifically addressed to me at that site.

    Thank you Mr. Crump for staying on the "Mayor/Administrator Caper".

    I am wondering if the reason that the more outspoken comments are coming from former Saline Countians is that they (we) feel insulated from blow back because of the absence of physical proximity to the local political establishment? Surely there are more locals interested than those at a distance from the fray.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 9, 2010, at 11:25 PM
  • WTF

    That is a great cartoon!!!!!!

    Come on MDN print this persons work!!!!!!!!!

    -- Posted by OldOwlFan on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 7:56 AM
  • news, SAY IT AIN'T SO! I actually voted for Paul in the primary.

    Have a great day!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 8:03 AM
  • Woops WTF know who you are now!!!!!!!!

    -- Posted by OldOwlFan on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 9:09 AM
  • Great cartoon WTF!!!!

    OldOwlFan I have a good idea also :-)

    -- Posted by Gal66 on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 9:14 AM
  • OldOwl, Gal66

    I don't know, you may be surprised.

    -- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 9:20 AM
  • Re: The mayor issue: We received a response from the Mo. Ethics Commission stating that they only provide opinions when a formal complaint has been filed. The spokesperson noted that the FAQ refers to 4th-class cities and in Marshall's case, the rules of 3rd-class cities would apply, but she didn't say whether that would make a difference in the outcome.

    -- Posted by Eric Crump on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 10:27 AM
  • OKR said this:

    "I am wondering if the reason that the more outspoken comments are coming from former Saline Countians is that they (we) feel insulated from blow back because of the absence of physical proximity to the local political establishment? Surely there are more locals interested than those at a distance from the fray."

    ME: You don't know me well enough to know that I can be outspoken when I feel the need, and this is one case where I've been in supporot of the local contingent who've already voiced their dissatisfaction with what's happened.

    I didn't speak out because I'm 800 miles from the epicenter. Wrong is wrong, regardless of where it occurs and under what circumstances. In this case, the result creates greater impact due to the size of the community. Think of it in terms of your dog, which, let's say, weighs 50 pounds and loses 10 pounds - 20% of its body weight, and compare that to a cow weighing 500 pounds and losing 10 pounds. Quite a substantial change for the dog, but not for the cow.

    If this "musical chairs" charade (as it was described by a reader) had occurred in, say, St. Louis or Kansas city, the majority of the public would most likely be unaware that anything irregular had even happened.

    I suspect that many Marshall residents have no quarrel with Latimer's qualifications, but, as Missy said, it's shameful that a fair process wasn't followed. Not only is it shameful, but unethical as well, and that kind of activity, no matter where it occurs, borders on being criminal in another light.

    What I've done here is no different from what I've done to describe my views on our federal government and some of its participants.

    I have no reason to be concerned about filling a job in the Marshall city government except that in this instance there's been a willful and open violation of equal rights for somebody - whoever may have applied for the job, if it had been advertised and a proper conduct had been followed.

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 10:33 AM
  • Yesterday I posted photos of a frozen Mississippi River, today it's music. Former church choir member Ruth Hockaday would be delighted by this one:


    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 12:43 PM
  • The Republican Establishment misread the tea leaves when gloating, and cheering about the recent turn of events in the Massachusetts senate race for the seat of liberal icon Ted Kennedy. They should have been as chagrined as the losing Democratic Establishment.

    The trend exhibited by the race had nothing to do with favoring Republicans over Democrats, nor vice versa.

    It had everything to do with incumbency, in that case the incumbency of party, and the people's frustration with a government that we perceive to be one that would rather fight among them selves than be about the people's business. Incumbency that when listening to anyone, listen to the K Street shills for powerful corporate interests, foreign and domestic, as our representatives continue their never ending rat race for money, more money each new election cycle. That is the real business of the members of congress.

    Many good long time members of congress, from each party, have over the years retired in disgust at this state of affairs.

    The mood of the citizenry has turned ugly. Incumbency, long the most important factor in the effort to be reelected, may now be a liability that many will not overcome. Veterans in congress long used to an absence of substantial primary challengers, now will be hard pressed to even become their parties' candidate in the general election.

    Both parties have become the Party of No. No solutions, no effective effort, and no agreement. They are responsible for we the people becoming the Citizenry of No. No repeat of what has been going on, no encores for those who have failed we the people.

    Perhaps the greater lesson, one we may not have learned, is that though we rail against our representatives we the people have allowed, even encouraged the current state of affairs. As we "turn the rascals out" we are as likely as not to just anoint a new group of rascals. Are we stupid or what?

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 1:33 PM
  • -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 1:53 PM
  • OKR - No, we're not stupid, we're lazy. Why would we expend the energy to find out some meaningful information about candidates when we can just accept their own self-promoting and distorted account of their qualifications?

    We go from being lazy to being apathetic, telling ourselves why bother since our vote doesn't count for anything, and turning our backs on all that's wrong, hoping the problems will disappear without affecting us directly.

    Many Americans have been directly affected because their backs have been turned, but their anger is prompted not by the fact that their countrymen have been bleeding them all along and haave now left them afloat in a leaky craft, but rather by their own indifference and self-absorption.

    As that famous poster of the first Earth Day declared, "We have met the enemy, and he is us."

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 2:16 PM
  • Well it's stupid to be so indifferent, lazy, etc. :)

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 2:44 PM
  • news across

    you need to quit getting your news from PMSNBC (no I did't accidentally add a letter). When you listen to one side you have one sided thinking.

    you have way tooooooooooooo much time on your hands.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 5:21 PM
  • -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 5:42 PM
  • Oh I forgot these links show the hypocrisy with hard, cold, indisputable facts.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 5:45 PM
  • Here's a disturbing article which adds to the reasons why a COMPREHENSIVE, EFFICIENT, and EFFECTIVE health-care system needs to be developed and implemented:


    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 7:49 PM
  • news across

    Hey you asked for cold hard facts and your still not happy maybe you need to read the book "Arguing with idiots".

    A comedian once said you can't fix stupid I think he is right.

    What is qualified or unqualified opinion? I think that's why it's called an OPINION. That would mean that my opinion is just as qualified as yours.


    1. a belief or judgement that rest on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty.

    2. a personal view, attitude, or appraisal.

    Thanks for the debate this is fun.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 8:58 PM
  • key word PROFESSIONAL on here we are all the same

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 9:15 PM
  • "...in an information-rich world, the wealth of information means a dearth of something else: a scarcity of whatever it is that information consumes. What information consumes is rather obvious: it consumes the attention of its recipients. Hence a wealth of information creates a poverty of attention and a need to allocate that attention efficiently among the overabundance of information sources that might consume it" (Simon 1971, p. 40-41)."

    ME: And, this is our dilemma - we must decide how much of our poverty-stricken attention should we allocate to absorbing the overabundant postings by NewsAcross, and to a lesser extent, the postings of MrXray.

    This is what Herbert Simon was talking about when he addressed the concept of Attention Economics. Sensory overload is the likely result, since humans lack the ability to determine how much of their attention resource shhould be focused on the subject (in this case posts by News and Xray) for the optimum benefit.

    I believe I'll save my meager fund for information containing greater substance.

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 9:21 PM
  • news across

    you are pretty wordy but you don't state cold hard facts like you demand from your opposition.

    Neoclassical has to do with art not economic polices and lower taxes have proved to spur the economy. Reagan doubled the amount of tax dollars the government was taking in but he couldn't reign in the spending of a Democratic congress.

    Told bold faced lies I don't know what you are referring to as a lie

    Gave "a little bit" of liberty away. I don't know what "a little bit" of liberty is.

    Spied on every American that has been going on for years they only think its OK for Democrats but not Republicans.

    Tortured and executed prisoners. WHO?

    Detained American citizens. WHO?

    Gave away our budget surplus. TO WHO?

    And who has set the record budget and the record deficit currently? Democrats

    Guess who they are blaming those rascally Republicans and as long as they think someone will believe them it will continue.

    They want to demonize the rich but I never worked for a poor person.

    Give the tax break to the employer to hire more workers than you have more workers who pay taxes.

    Tax the employer and they lay off workers who can't pay taxes and the tax cost is passed on in the price of consumer goods that the poor buy. Any way you slice it the poor and middle class will pay the taxes not directly to the government but in goods and services we buy.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 9:58 PM
  • rr3yv0

    Are you related to MrXray?

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 10:12 PM
  • No sir I don't even know MrXray. I don't get on here much but it is hard to resist a good debate with a liberal.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 10:22 PM
  • No, News, you do it better than any of the rest of us could.

    rr3yv0, did you ever see the Jay Leno skit he called Mr. Brain? That was actually NewsAcross.

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 10:31 PM
  • Upsedaisy,

    I'm glad you enjoyed those river ice photos. An old friend who lives in St. Charles sent the link to me.

    I expect Wib Myers would say the river was blocked, like it did at Miami so many times, and I'm guessing it was due to ice floes collecting to create the effect.

    Did you happen to see the Howard County history link on the MoDot Web site during the rebuilding of the auto bridge at Glasgow? That was a fascinating writeup, I thought. If you missed it, I may be able to figure out how to put it up on here for you.

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 10:40 PM
  • News, you're guilty of precisely what Simon warned against.

    Go argue with someone who has the inclination for idle chatter.

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 10:43 PM
  • Slater thanks for the link to the long term hospital story. Such things happen everyday.

    It seems kind of ironic that people clamor for tort reform when fear of law suits is about the only thing keeping those nests of negligence from being even worse than they are.

    I say tort reform if we must, but only when stiff criminal penalties for gross negligence by health care providers is in place.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 10:57 PM
  • I'm usually not one to get in the middle of a scrap, and I am not going to now...beyond stating that this is an open forum and I think that the etiquette on open forums is to ignore posts that are not homogenous with one's taste. One, of course, is always welcome to debate other posts.

    Butcha cain't tell sum buddy to shaddup.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 11:16 PM
  • News, I didn't say your arguments are erroneous. What I said is that I've grown weary of having to scroll through your prodigious posts to find the ones I want to read. I've already read everything you've had to say, so there's no point in reading any more of them.

    If you consider that to be a personal attack, that's your problem, not mine.

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 11:23 PM
  • Slater, Thanks I'll check for the Howard County history link. I had no idea growing up during the second world war how important that bridge was. Of course, I do remember the troop trains going through Slater, so it should have been obvious that the bridge did indeed need a 24 hour guard.

    Thanks also for the mention of the NY Times article on health care.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 11:25 PM
  • OKR - it's a one-sided squabble as far as I'm concerned. I merely expressed my opinion about the volume of posts which say the same things over and over.

    I'm entitled.

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 11:28 PM
  • News,

    I have no reason to attack you, so don't give me one.

    Maybe you've forgotten that Editor Crump has asked on more than one occasion that we not abuse the privilege of using this forum by posting lengthy and numerous comments.

    Consider my earlier post a request to reduce your volume some.

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 11:49 PM
  • Good night to you HootOwls. My feeble eyeballs need a break.

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 10, 2010, at 11:58 PM
  • An early happy St. Valentines Day to all the lady posters...you will love this one girls.


    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 1:13 AM
  • Slater I agree with you news across takes this waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay to seriosly.

    It does make for good entertainment though if you have time to read it all.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 6:31 AM
  • Slater said "News, I didn't say your arguments are erroneous. What I said is that I've grown weary of having to scroll through your prodigious posts to find the ones I want to read. I've already read everything you've had to say, so there's no point in reading any more of them.

    If you consider that to be a personal attack, that's your problem, not mine."

    And I say thats the best post on her in weeks!!!!!

    -- Posted by Gal66 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 8:17 AM
  • Okay, in regard to health care (chapter 1001?) -- It is so easy to become emotional when dealing with disease, dying, and death. That is the way we're "wired". It is excruciating when a child is involved.

    Is anyone familiar with the term "triage"? In the most basic sense, it means to take care of the sickest patient first. In the most extreme it means to let the sickest patient die because attempts to save them would "probably" be wasted and "resources" could be better utilized on other patients.

    I am not defending insurance companies. I am not saying we don't need a system overhaul. I am suggesting that there is usually more to the story than the headline.

    I am just offering a little bit of information.

    Have a great day!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 8:46 AM
  • Something to chew on.

    "A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject."

    ---Winston Churchill

    -- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 10:56 AM
  • News, remember this? "I don't have any reason to attack you, so don't give me one."

    Take it to heart and go your way, while I go mine.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 10:57 AM
  • Ha! Ha! - OKR, you're so ornery! :)

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 11:31 AM
  • My wife and I are going out to the Brasserie Pavil restaurant for dinner tomorrow evening with our next-door neighbors to celebrate Valentine's Day. We get out with them fairly often, and the neighbor lady say's we're "double dating." :)

    We're taking them to a new French restaurant, a Brasserie, as it's called, which we've been to once, so we're looking forward to some good food and good company.

    I recall several past comments about the lack of a good place to dine there in Marshall, and I was just remembering Sarley's. That's one advantage to living in a big city like this one - lots of good places to eat. A bit of trivia: at last count there are 756 Mexican food vendors alone here. :)

    However you choose to celebrate Valentine's Day, I hope it's enjoyable!

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 11:54 AM
  • One thing about news across is an equal opportunity attacker. He assumes your a conservative if you disagree with him. I've had better debates with far more important people.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 12:15 PM
  • Fun little game, Dock. Thanks! :)

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 12:29 PM
  • WTF.. great quote!

    news, exactly!

    Cold and snow.... cold and snow.... snow and cold....


    -- Posted by missy08 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 1:13 PM
  • Just noticed this article http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/MO_XGR_DRUG_TESTING_MOOL-?SITE=MOMAR&SECT...

    Over there on the right on our very own MDN...

    All I can say...it's about time!!

    -- Posted by Scarpetta on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 3:54 PM
  • Cosa Nostra,

    Apparently NewsAcross thinks the rest of us can't read and/or are incapable of searching out news articles IF and WHEN we have the desire to do so.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 5:04 PM
  • news across

    lets see the contents of my arguments define my position!!! Duh yeah you are right you win the prize.

    I don't recall asking for any apologies.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 5:19 PM
  • Scarpetta,

    I agree! It is about time! news, this is no different than an employer requiring drug testing to insure a safe and secure work place. These folks are also collecting a "paycheck".


    -- Posted by missy08 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 5:22 PM
  • Obama Wants to Track Cellphones; Also Flip-Flops on Iran, Tax Hikes

    He pledged to end Bush's "domestic spying." Now he says we have "no reasonable expectation of privacy." He said he wouldn't tolerate a nuclear Iran. And the man who promised not to raise taxes on those making less than $250K is now "agnostic" on the idea.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 5:26 PM
  • news across

    look at your own comment and you will understand maybe.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 5:31 PM
  • News, I was talking to Cosa Nostra, not to you. Mind your own business.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 5:43 PM
  • news,

    I'm not confused this time....


    -- Posted by missy08 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 5:55 PM
  • One of the parts of Democratic Socialism you conservatives might love is NO taxes. In a socialist economy there are no taxes...you keep what you earn...no income taxes, no sales taxes, no inheritance taxes, and no property taxes.

    NEWS I have a legitimate question. How is everything paid for such as health care and all the other services you mentioned?

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 5:55 PM
  • -- Posted by missy08 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 6:00 PM
  • rr3yv0,

    OMG! You found his rant confusing also! I got a major lecture on that one! The posting is still on here -- Friday.

    That rant came after the lecture that the US would have more doctors if we had fewer guns. When you figure that out, explain it to me.

    Apparently since I don't have an economics degree I can't understand these basic concepts. (And all this time I thought it was because I'm a blonde!) lol


    -- Posted by missy08 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 6:05 PM
  • News now believes he knows everything about everything and he's going to tell US, not our people in Washington who are there to figure it out, but US, as if Washington religiously reads the MDN Speak Out column.

    News, since you know everything and have all the answers, why not share that omnicience with our federal government? Just think of all the time and money you'd save the taxpayers.

    Why, you'd be a national hero, and you don't even live here!

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 7:16 PM
  • "Everyone who operates a motor vehicle in the state of Missouri is deemed to have given his or her consent to have his or her breath, blood, urine, or other bodily substances tested for alcohol and/or drugs. This is known as Missouri's "Implied Consent" law. You are presumed to know and understand your rights and responsibilities concerning the testing your breath or bodily fluids in relation to a DWI arrest."

    Maybe when somebody applies for "entitlement", something like this can be included in the application...

    Just a thought.


    -- Posted by missy08 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 7:34 PM
  • A fool does not delight in understanding,

    But only in revealing his own mind.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 7:49 PM
  • Missy,

    I'm trying to figure out why drug testing is implemented in some instances (one you've just pointed out) but not in other instances (like part of the qualification for public assistance).

    Lots of people who receive aid are genuinely in need and are grateful, and then there are those who live to work the system, making the entire process demeaning and humiliating for those who really need the help.

    While we're about fixing things...

    What do YOU think?

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 7:49 PM
  • News, I'll make a deal with you.

    You stop treating people in here like half-wits and I'll stop picking on you.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 7:55 PM
  • Missy, you can take his latest post to the bank, because God, Jr. has spoken.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 8:02 PM
  • Slater this is just too much fun.

    I looked in the bible and news kept coming up this is just one reference.

    Proverbs 18:2

    A fool does not delight in understanding,

    But only ain revealing his own 1mind.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 8:39 PM
  • Hey..hey..hey, it is getting far too nasty here. Everyone needs to lighten up.

    During the long time that I have posted on this blog there have been many people who posted very frequently, some of whom I debated, naw, I'll admit it, argued with. Many of them are gone from the blog. Guess what, I think about them, and wish they would drop by, say "hello in there" now, and then. Stir me up! If you are reading this even though you don't post any more you all know who you are. Betcha you also remember me. :)

    One other thing, most of those people I learned something from, all though there are a couple that all I learned was that people can be more pig headed than I thought one could be. Readers/no longer writers you do not know which couple of you left that impression. It might surprise some of you that say "that's me" that you are wrong.

    There are times when many of us go into a frenzy of posting. You know, it's therapeutic. It has been for me. I don't think that we should deny any of our fellow bloggers their therapy.

    There are times when many of us have felt a sense of urgency that we must share certain information with people in our community, our blog community. Where else could any of us communicate at our will with such a varied group from most facets of the social order. We are all blessed to have each other.

    I find News Across to be sincere, intelligent, and concerned. That is enough for me. I have learned from his comments, and the links he has provided. That is a bonus.

    I do not want him nor any other of you to ever not post a comment, nor provide a link, because of comments "stating you post too much". That one comment, or one link may be one that provided important information to me.

    On a lighter note this is my take as to who the most aggravating posters have been since the blog got going. Bear in mind that this is my opinion as to those who have offended the most people, not necessarily me. Drum roll please:

    1. JJ Gates, and his multitude of alter egos.

    2. Third World, Chicken Little with a brain.

    3. The anti-corn guy, not from here but really stirred things with his rants. Turned Speak Out readers on to a web site that showed what each farmer in Saline County had gotten in government subsidies. Marsha had some discussion with him, and may recall his name.

    4. Raytown Bill, so far to the right that I think he worried about falling off the edge of the flat earth he believed in. (It was fun Bill).


    Sorry News Across you weren't even close to making the cut, nor were you Mrxray.

    Watcha think? Anybody else got a better top five?

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 8:40 PM
  • By the way some of my top five have not posted in a long time. Newer readers should back to the early ones to catch JJ Gates at his best.

    You folks that think some of the posters now are irritating? You need to read JJ at his/her best. His/her is especially appropriate as one of the alter egos was Mrs. J J Gates. Secret Agent Michael Scarn another. They were one of a kind.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 8:57 PM
  • OKR, in good faith I offered to make a deal with News, that if he'd quit treating the posters in here like they have no brain, I'd quit picking on him, but he apparently chose to ignore my offer, so...

    I've had my fill of his overbearing and rude manner, and I know plenty of others have as well.

    For me it isn't so much about the volume but more about his attitude.

    As long as his arrogant tone persists, I'll be right here to remind him.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 9:28 PM
  • Come on News! Don't deprive your captive audience! Tell us more about the constitutionality of peeing in cups.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 9:47 PM
  • Ahhhhh!! Now we're getting somewhere! Keep talking, News.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 9:53 PM
  • I'll go along with that, News, as long as you agree to start speaking respectfully and with humility when addressing the other posters in here.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 10:03 PM
  • Slater & News across:

    Time to let it go, OK? This has become a spittin' match. Nobody wins but we all get wet.

    A reminder: These forums, especially Speak Out, best support brief comments and relatively few.

    A few people, burning with indignation, can spoil the fun for everybody.

    -- Posted by Eric Crump on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 10:11 PM
  • The party's over. Time for me to tend to the cat.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 10:12 PM
  • Ladies and Gentlemen,

    Remember "Please be respectful of others".

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 10:17 PM
  • Aaaah. Those were the days my friend, we thought they'd never end. Good evening NanaDot, and thank you my friend.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 10:57 PM
  • yawwwwwwwwwwwwwn. no wonder i check in here anymore only about every two or three weeks now and it's becoming less than that ... it's loaded with left-wing loons like news across who seems to think if he overburdens us with links and his idiotic comments and views then he is accomplishing something. i'd respect that view if he actually lived here in the states. but he is down under, understandedly, for his wife ... but if you're down there, don't pretend to understand what we need if you aren't close to it. you made your choice. live with it brotha. we are all TIRED of your rants and posts.

    -- Posted by aikman8 on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 11:00 PM
  • JODY... thats the blog name of the poster that ruffled the tassels of corn centered Saline County bloggers for a month or so. I believe it would be safe to label him/her a leftist environmentalist internet gypsy that went to small town blogs with an anticorporatist agriculture message. Town to town via the internet.

    Too bad you weren't in on that one AFBrat, and Mrxray. Ole Jody woulda made you gnash your teeth.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 11:32 PM
  • aikman8 if left wing lunatics exist from your perspective you must concede that there is a prportionate share of right wing lunatics who also drive some people crazy. Do you wish that they would shut up even though they do not personally bring out your ire?

    I hope that you only prefer some would shut up, not that they would be forced to shut up.

    Fair, and balanced.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 11:58 PM
  • The gist of the conversation in recent hours has predominately been animosity over attitude, and volume of individual posters.

    Flipping the coin here are some names from whom I would like to see more posts.

    From left to right: NanaDot, Upsedaisy, Jo, Ms. Marple, WTF, John Q. Public, Smokin Cheetah, ceh, Scarpetta, White Tornado, AFBrat. I am certain that I am forgetting others. Oh yes, and an occasional appearance from Paulie Walnuts with his critical eye. Some weren't mentioned because they are posting frequently.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 12:15 AM
  • G'day.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 12:25 AM
  • More snow;" Make it stop!" I say, in a whining voice.

    I am ready for spring, I have had enough snow and cold to last me until next year!

    -- Posted by litlmissme on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 6:00 AM
  • news across

    It's not that I hate your comments its that I don't agree with them and I have every right to comment about them. You have every right to be wrong.

    Seems like when someone makes a statement you can't dispute you want them to overlook yours wah wah!!

    I am a full fledged American citizen not sitting on the fence looking to see which side is greener.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 6:01 AM
  • I don't post here often but have read the blog every day for as long as the regular posters.

    Recently, the long posts, vast number of posts, continuous links, and condidering oneself as being the only person willing to see the correct facts has reminded me of Third Child. Different topic, but same general attitude. Actually worse attitude - Third Child never belittled the rest of us by claiming to have a degree that made him so superior that we needed to go back to school just to have an intelligent conversation.

    -- Posted by Philemon on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 6:33 AM
  • I never questioned your citizenship I believe you. I know you can't serve two masters.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 6:44 AM
  • unless you are a psychic you don't know how long I have been a citizen. I have been one my whole life. I bet my legs are as long as yours though they reach the ground.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 6:48 AM
  • Upsedaisy - thanks for the timely reminder to be respectful of others, and I'll add to that a quote from Thomas Jefferson: The most valuable of all talents is that of never using two words when one will do.

    -- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 7:21 AM
  • oh news, your post of Thu, Feb 11, 2010, at 6:48 PM, started out so great. I was sooo optimistic that we could all play in the sandbox together.

    But, then, came paragraph four.

    I too believe that we all want the same basic things. We want people to have food, shelter, medical care, education, a feeling of safety, and worth, etc. My belief is that everyone should accept at least *some* personal responsibility for these things and not depend on the government to provide for them.

    I also do not believe that just because we don't believe or agree with something that it is not necessarily "wrong".

    In regard to your citizenship not being the business of others -- you put it out there. You've made it the business of everybody on here.

    At the risk of getting "voted off the island", can we all play fair and be reasonable?

    Respectfully yours,


    -- Posted by missy08 on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 8:37 AM
  • The cops chased a guy for about 3 hours the other night didnt know if it would hit the paper or not any word on that editor


    -- Posted by honest opinion on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 9:04 AM
    Response by Kathy Fairchild/Staff writer:
    As of this morning, charges have not been filed in the incident you mentioned.

    I'm taking this time to apologize to all of you for my behavior toward another poster over the past couple of days. Everyone knows what prompted it, so I won't drag that through the coals.

    I'll do my best to be a nice person.

    -- Posted by Slater on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 9:34 AM
  • Slater,

    No apology necessary, as far as I am concerned. When you post, it is 99.9% (cause no one is perfect) respectful, brief, yet knowledgeable, insightful and entertaining. Never boastful, condescending or arrogant! So maybe you slipped into that .1% for a short amount of time. We all do from time to time.

    -- Posted by nouveaublogger on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 10:28 AM
  • oops,

    I believe my double negative created a positive.

    I also believe that just because we don't agree with something that it is "wrong".

    -- Posted by missy08 on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 11:14 AM
  • I screwed up again! I am so worried about being politically correct.....

    Just because our opinions differ, doesn't mean that either opinion is wrong!



    -- Posted by missy08 on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 11:16 AM
  • Slater - Just be yourself. You are a nice person.

    -- Posted by broke-n-busted on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 11:22 AM
  • You said: 'More snow;" Make it stop!" I say, in a whining voice.

    I am ready for spring, I have had enough snow and cold to last me until next year!'

    -- Posted by litlmissme on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 6:00 AM

    I say:LOL What she said. I don't think I have seen the sun for weeks. We have set an all time record for one winter's total snow fall, and winter is not even over. Every time I venture out I am hit in the face with a biting wind, and sub freezing temperatures. Make it stop!

    Gee LMM maybe we all ought to switch to the weather as a topic. Betcha we would all get along. ;)

    Seriously, The root problem with an open site such as Speak Out is that politics, and religion will pop up.

    Imagine that we all walked into a huge room each day, and began to speak the same words that we do on the blog. Imagine that as we spoke to those folks we looked em in the eye, and the passion of our words that now leap from the page, would instead roar from our mouths. Half of us would be dead in a week.

    I think it is healthy that this forum allows us to voice our disparate views, pretty much as we wish to express them. Then as we meet people on the street we can exchange pleasantries...and well be pleasant. Maybe we could all get tees that say "I'm Smiling Because I've Been To The Blog!"

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 11:25 AM
  • Thanks You Kathy i was wondering if that wasnt the case but just had to ask.

    Thanks again

    Honest opinion

    -- Posted by honest opinion on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 11:56 AM
  • -- Posted by What the f...... on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 12:22 PM
  • Thanks for your understanding and support. :)

    How much snow is on the ground there? One of your former residents who now lives in New Jersey told me this morning they have around 18" of new snow, and he's about to wear out his snow thrower.

    Here in San Antonio we've gone from record drought to record rainfall, or near-record. Since September we've had 30.7", and the record for the period Sept-Mar is 31.7" so we're closing in on it.

    B-N-B, keep that shovel handy and I'll be along!

    -- Posted by Slater on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 12:36 PM
  • Thanks Cheetah for providing my chuckle for the day.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 2:01 PM
  • Slater, we've got maybe an inch or two right now. Nothing compared to DC and other points east!

    -- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 3:38 PM
  • Oaklahoma and Smokin'

    I say right on, or is it "write on"! In the words of another "that is funny right there I don't care who you are".

    -- Posted by litlmissme on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 4:04 PM
  • Cheetah once again you are as fleet with the pen as your namesake is at running. I feel, somehow, as if I have been summarily scooped up and thrown over your shoulder into a heap of... snowflakes. Great story.

    -- Posted by broke-n-busted on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 5:50 PM
  • Slater your shovel is sitting in the corner waiting patiently. (It seems to have developed a slight coat of rust - couple of spider webs hanging on it...) I might suggest that on your way up I35 you stop by and help dig out OKR. OKR sounds to be much more buried in snow than I am and it would be good practice for you. I am afraid you might be a touch out of practice. I lived in Texas for a bit and I have to think for awhile to recall why I left but I do recall being totally out of practice at scooping snow.

    -- Posted by broke-n-busted on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 6:03 PM
  • Sounds like tomorrow may be bringing MORE snow. I must admit, it was beautiful this morning. Slick. But, beautiful.


    -- Posted by missy08 on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 6:07 PM
  • I always think it is quite sad to see various contributors jumping on the band wagon to attack another contributor whose writings pose intelligent and well researched facts and opinions. If you do not agree with what has been posted then devote the same amount of research to debunk what you object to and respond in a mature manner. Remember this, you have lost the argument when you stoop to personal attacks, especially when those attacks include xenophobic comments about 'being American'. We have great people in this country, but just being born here does not make you 'great'.

    -- Posted by Divergent Thinker on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 7:46 PM
  • Clinton Should Thank God We Don't Have Obamacare

    We want to send out our best wishes to President Clinton who's back home resting comfortably after a couple stints placed in a blocked coronary artery yesterday at the hospital in New York. All of us need to be thankful we don't yet have Obamacare otherwise somebody on the death panel might have assumed that he's old and retired and might not be worth the expense. You never know. You just never know.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 8:54 PM
  • rr3, take a look at this ominous report about individual insurance rate increases:


    -- Posted by Slater on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 9:07 PM
  • I've had this link for quite a while, and I may have posted it before. It's a page of various optical illusions, the sort of stuff I enjoyed once upon a time when I had eyes that worked better. Maybe some of you will enjoy them:


    -- Posted by Slater on Fri, Feb 12, 2010, at 11:20 PM
  • You know, sometimes the stacks get sooo deep you have no choice. Cleaning the office today. The sun looks great outside the window. John, George, Ringo, and Paul are providing the entertainment.

    Have a great day y'all!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Sat, Feb 13, 2010, at 10:01 AM
  • Slater thanks for the link it was my Saturday morning entertainment.

    -- Posted by litlmissme on Sat, Feb 13, 2010, at 11:01 AM
  • newsacross... dont drool too much. Being hynoticaly blinded by the OOOOOOO bama light is not becoming.

    Obama's idea of spending cuts is to cut spending or freeze spending on what, about 1/8th of the budget? lol His own budget projections continue to increase exponentially every year for the remainder of his first, hopefully only, term and even further down the road.

    You are going to be just like Obama and blame Bush for everything that goes wrong the entire time he is president, either 4 or 8 years.... it is funny to watch the lack of backbone that this president has and the inability to stand up and take responsibility for what he is doing. EVERY president has bad things to overcome from the previous one. AND you try to blame Bush for all the economic problems but forget that Dems started the ball rolling with the CRA and all that went with it until the entire US and world economy was tied into the Fannie/Freddie/Housing debacle that BUSH warned about in 2001, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007 and all the Dems called him a fear mongerer....... strange how easily you deny reality

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Feb 13, 2010, at 2:38 PM
  • To go along with the whole Obama debacle... he shows his immaturity with every thing that he makes 'decisions' on. You know things like closing Gitmo, when reality dictated that there was no where else to go with the detainees and Congress opposed the idea. Or what about the whole holding terrorist trials in NY but did not first find out what NY and the public thought about it, or the cost to the tax payer to actually have the court cases heard in this setting... and now probably having to eat some crow and change back to the Military tribunals... Obama has a major disconnect with reality and with the citizens to which he is employeed by

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Feb 13, 2010, at 2:40 PM
  • VISIT: www.ameritianity.com

    Millions of Americans, doing their small but significant part in the governance of our nation, are in the process of ending years of "Minority Rule" by the most liberal, humanistic, five percent of our population. Great job....keep it up....give God the Glory.

    We must accept the facts a deal with them:

    Must-See Video by Former Muslim & Black Pastor - Added 2/3/10

    (1) There is a battle taking place around the world and it amounts to the SLAVERY of Islam vs. the Freedom of Christianity. The USA being the base and stronghold of Christian Freedom.

    (2) Islam will not coexist in Christian America. Islam cannot accept our Constitution, our Rights, our Freedoms, including Freedom of Religion. If America falls, the world falls. And they know it.

    (3) Obama is not a friend to Christians nor American traditions. He does not see the USA as deserving of world leadership.

    (4) Obama is a Narcissist, a racist, a Socialist. He respects Dictators.

    (5) As seen in his "State of the Union" - he loathes our Constitution and the Supreme Court. He has stated that in his own words in audio and video viewable at www.ameritianity.com.

    (6) We are witnessing a setback for Socialism because "THE PEOPLE" have awakened

    (7) The Role of Religion - Now we need to remove the Tax Threat from the IRS against ministers speaking the truth from the pulpit in the same way that the Supreme Court has said the Right to Free Speech does not stop a the front door of Corporations.

    (8) Obama wants to control where the power lies in America. The power lies where the wealth is. He wants the POWER to lie in the Unions (now own 2 car companies) and the Federal Govt.

    (9) Haiti - look where the AID is coming from, the CAPITALIST NATIONS

    (10) Healthcare - WILL REMAIN PRIVATE

    (11) Waterboarding & Freedom

    "In the same way, let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven." Matthew 5:16 (NIV)

    Join us in discussing these and other topics from the Christian perspective at:


    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sat, Feb 13, 2010, at 3:13 PM
  • rr3yv0,

    This christian perspective of which you speak. Is that old testement, new testement or your testement?

    -- Posted by What the f...... on Sat, Feb 13, 2010, at 3:29 PM
  • What the f... Wow, I'm not sure there's any testament involved at that website. The stuff that's there is so far right you'd need a Hubble telescope to see it from the middle of the road.

    I'm a firm believer in free speech, but things like this really test me.

    -- Posted by Miss Marple on Sat, Feb 13, 2010, at 5:49 PM
  • Upsedaisy, here's the link to the Glasgow bridge project. Included is a sub link to the bridge history, which also talks about Howard County. My post of the other day was misleading when I asked if you'd seen the Howard County history page on the MoDot Glasgow bridge site.

    Although the focus of the article is about the bridge and how it influenced commerce, it's a general conversation which I found to be very good reading.


    -- Posted by Slater on Sat, Feb 13, 2010, at 8:46 PM
  • Mr. Crump, I was wondering why the childrens Valentine pictures listing grandparents were not in the Friday paper, I thought that was the date for them to be published when I purchased one.

    -- Posted by fresh air on Sun, Feb 14, 2010, at 8:51 AM
  • NewsAcross,

    I've been to Australia a few times. Very enjoyable. Have explored Sydney, Melbourne and Perth. Still lots to see.

    Each trip, met someone who was emigrating. You didn't mention the considerable financial assets immigrants are required to have.

    What is the current figure?

    Of interest to OKR, met a couple from Oklahoma who went out every year for six weeks to avoid OK winters.

    Flies and snakes are a downer though.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Sun, Feb 14, 2010, at 10:11 AM
  • Eric,

    I realize that the issue is getting old, but could you get some answers from the City Council regarding some basic questions of the hiring of the current city administrator?

    * I would like to know just where and how they advertised the position. From the comments and statements frankly it is not clear they actually took this action; the various comments in the press about the mayor/council getting resumes (that were subsequently deemed unqualified) begs the question. It would be doubly nice to actually see a copy of the job announcement.

    * The follow-up with the Missouri Ethics Commission is great work. The response from the person you talked you begged some further questions. First off, what is the difference between a class 3 and class 4 city? From the lay person, it is difficult to believe that the opinion would be valid for one classification and not valid for the other, but I could be wrong. Where can we get that answer? And the obvious follow-up question then would be...assuming that there is truly no difference between class 3 and class 4 for the purpose of the MEC opinion, then what happens next? Who within the city organization raises this issue for resolution? Certainly they would not want to be operating in conflict with state ethics opinions? This is one of those questions where the answer seems to be obvious, but how does it get asked? And if the answer in the Marshall CA situation is truly similar as noted in the Missouri Ethics Commission opinion number 2008.09.CI.008 that "the mayor is prohibited from assuming the position for one year from leaving office" ... then what is the next step?

    My experience is mainly with federal and military departments where there are the Inspector General functional organizations that deal with these sorts of things. As the city charter does not have anything I can see which has this function in it its job description, not sure how the policing action occurs within the city. I guess citizens submit a formal complaint to the MEC directly? Seems the issue should be resolved somehow and not by being ignored.

    Thank you.

    -- Posted by oceanlord49 on Sun, Feb 14, 2010, at 9:18 PM
  • Oceanlord49 - I can answer at least one question for you. According to Missouri Revised Statutes, a 3rd class city is one with 3,000 up to 29,999 population; a 4th class city is one with at least 500, but less than 3,000 population. The rest, with some exceptions for older cities under legislative charter, are under a constitutional charter form of government.

    -- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Sun, Feb 14, 2010, at 9:56 PM
  • Oceanlord - What I saw when I read the complaint form is that one or two of the requirements make submission troublesome for some - like it has to be printed and hand delivered, and it cautions the complainant that the accused has the right to bring legal action against the filer if the charge is unsubstantiated (something along that line).

    The issue has gone silent, which I'm sure the city is happy about. I'd be glad to file the complaint, but I'm not a resident of Marshall, nor would I expect to be able to obtain evidence to supporot a complaint. I didn't see any reference regarding residency requirements, but I'd guess one would need to be living there.

    I, too, thought it was odd that Editor Crump didn't ask any questions when told the rules may differ for a Class 3 city, or maybe he didn't disclose everything he learned from the MEC person.

    -- Posted by Slater on Sun, Feb 14, 2010, at 10:41 PM
    Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
    I asked whether the MEC opinion would apply to a third class city, but the spokesperson did not directly address that question. I haven't had time to explore the statutes yet.
  • I had an out-of -town visitor last week who had grown up in Marshall. While driving around to look at the sites in Marshall during the evening, we both commented about the new lighting on the courthouse. I told her, I would raise the issue on the blog. I think I brought it up once before, and I believe the response was that the new color-changing lights are more energy efficient. I thought one of the objectives of the restoration was to maintain the historical look. Granted, the electric lights that once outlined the top of the courthouse were not original, but they were there for many decades before they were replaced by spotlights. I vaguely remember the spotlights were used because it was too dangerous to replace the individual bulbs that outlined the top. The spotlights looked great, I thought. I think I saw spotlights below the clocks the other night. Will those be turned on eventually? Is what we have now what we will be stuck with? How will they be replaced when they burn out? If so, I guess I'll have to continue to cringe when the courthouse outline turns pink...then green...then, well you get my point. Eric, if you haven't already, how about making this a poll question? Any info you can find out about this and pass along, would be appreciated. I'm sorry if this has already been addressed, and I just missed it.

    -- Posted by oneofmany on Sun, Feb 14, 2010, at 10:46 PM
    Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
    You raise some good questions. I don't think all of them have been addressed yet, so we'll check. We did run an online poll about the new lights last fall. Here's the result:

    "New fiber-optic lights were added to the dome of the Saline County Courthouse during roof renovations. If you've seen the lights after dark, what's your reaction?"

    * They look great: 39.9% (81 votes)

    * Not as good as the old lights, but not bad: 13.3% (27 votes)

    * They are terrible: 27.6% (56 votes)

    * No opinion: 19.2% (39 votes)

    203 votes cast

  • -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 1:56 AM
  • Lest we forget. http://www.icasualties.org/

    I wonder how often it crosses the minds of citizens, you, me, all of us, that our brothers, and sisters are still being blown up in Iraq, and Afghanistan?

    Earlier in the current period of war I know it was on my mind all the time. Not so much anymore. It may be that recently I have gone as long as a full day without recalling on a conscious level that maddening, saddening tragedy.

    That has caused me to consider why. My first response to that self addressed question was that there are fewer reminders of the wars than before. No doubt that is true. My paranoiac inner self tells me that is because the Corporatists are very near achieving their objective of having us brainwashed to the point that we can all just go on our way accepting wars as a normal part of things with out further thought. Then I think could that be my rational inner self? At that point I really do get paranoid. My mind races, just when did I last see the wars as the lead story, covered in detail on mainstream television news, how often do the whining dogs making the rounds of the Sunday morning kennels howl about the wars? Do I need to check to see if the yellow ribbons on the cars of we patriotic citizens are raveled, and faded, or completely gone? Will they at last disappear? I don't think the manufacturers guaranteed that they would last as long as the wars. If that single symbol of the meager depth of our patriotism, sacrifice, and support for our troops nearly disappears we will have truly forgotten down to the last hypocritical vestige of caring.

    My apologies for making this bitter comment to those of you who have, or have had family, or friends in harms way. I am of you so I know you will never forget. I fear though that to the others "the wars" are becoming just something that is a constant, something dismissed with a slight shrug of the shoulders, and a weary "that is just how things are".

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 3:14 AM
  • oceanlord: There is a link to the text of the fourth-class city question about mayors and city administrators:


    This is a very specific question with a very specific answer, and in my opinion, does not answer the question being posed here in Marshall.

    -- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 5:29 AM
  • news: Please refrain from using the phrase "all Americans" when you talk about killing brown skinned people. Not all of us feel that way and I for one resent the accusation. However, I am all for protecting our homeland, our freedoms, and our rights. I'm not looking for a debate with you just asking that you use the term "some" rather than "all".

    -- Posted by Air Force Wife on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 8:48 AM
  • AFW, thanks for that.

    Also, I doubt that ANY of us have all the FACTS regarding some of what goes on in these great United States. So, statements like "this war began based on outright, intentional lies" is an assumption or opinion.

    Oh to live in a perfect world.... then what would we post about?

    Have a great day!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 9:49 AM
  • missy08,

    As far as the Iraq war goes I think we have plenty of info regarding the frenzy to go to war.

    The outing of Valerie Plame comes to mind because her husband wouldn't lie about Saddam's aquisition ( or non-aquisition) of yellow cake uranium from South Africa comes to mind. How about Rupert Murdoch, the owner of FOX "news" admitting in a tv interview that he "slanted" his news in favor of invading Iraq? I wonder what prompted him to do that? I don't know about you but that's enough for me.

    -- Posted by What the f...... on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 1:15 PM
  • Has anybody read the info regarding the Denver Airport "conspiracy"? Underground bunkers? Those pesky masonic symbols? Interesting....

    Flurries continue......


    -- Posted by missy08 on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 3:59 PM
  • Just say we Know what go's on in our Government,(and what we think), is just a take over of other Countries! What would we do? I think we would do, just what we've been doing through all these Years, ABSOLUTLY NOTHING! Because, i think most of the American People have lost any sense of controlling how we should be treated! we have turned into a bunch of sleepy little sheep , that lets our Employees do as they please! we should rise up and take back ,what they have taken away, OUR GUTS! If it takes the American People get off their cans, and go March in their face and make them resign, not vote them out, run them out! Voting don't seem to do it! When they start fearing the People they Represent thing may start to change in this Country! The Civilized method don't seem to work anymore! That's my thought! It may be Neanderthal, but, the other don't work! What do you think?

    -- Posted by Jo on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 5:36 PM
  • News, I'm not a big fan of Bush, but you've got to come up with something better than that. From the 1st paragraph of the article you linked to:

    "Bush dismissed as worthless this information from the Iraqi foreign minister, a member of Saddam's inner circle,"

    So let me get this straight, Bush was supposed to believe this intelligence simply because a member of Saddam's inner circle claimed it was true. I know I would have ignored it too.

    The more compelling evidence to me at the time that he did have WMD's was simply the fact that he had the inspectors kicked out in 1998 and wouldn't let them back in, even with the threat of invasion.

    -- Posted by Philemon on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 6:55 PM
  • To Slater: Found out today the Slater Senior Class trip will be heading your way! Hoorah for San Antonio!

    -- Posted by nouveaublogger on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 7:46 PM
  • NB, thanks for the tip, and what an unusual choice! If I may impose upon you, perhaps you'll pass along additional details as they become available.

    They should have a good time here, but maybe on the warm side by trip time.

    -- Posted by Slater on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 7:55 PM
  • A reminder - our standards for posting here extend to any links you post, too.

    -- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 9:44 PM
  • Today is the 190th birthday of Susan B. Anthony whoo said among many other things, "I always distrust people who know so much about what God wants them to do to their fellows."

    To read more, and to get a larger picture of this great American cliclk on the link. http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2010/2/15/837216/-Happy-Birthday,-Susan-B.-Ant...

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 11:00 PM
  • Nice to see several of my progressive friends on the blog. Hi y'all.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 11:16 PM
  • Slater,

    I would be glad to send you more information, I'll do some thorough questioning of the kids tomorrow. Saddens me to think that I only have 3 months left with some of them, at least on a daily basis! The Slater Main Street News is doing an article on the Little Store, I'm not sure that it will be in this week or next! We are now serving Sunday dinner, a fantastic meal for a fair price! I'm trying to get a time frame to start serving dinner every night, but the hubs has to have surgery and I know that will keep me busy all day working downstairs and trying to take care of him also, so I keep putting it off. We can now seat approximately 40-45 people.

    -- Posted by nouveaublogger on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 11:28 PM
  • Thanks for the "Common Dreams" link Nana Dot. I also found it interesting. I wonder whether, or not any of the theocrats dared to peek at it. Naw, I know better than that for if they had that much curiosity they would not be theocrats.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 11:36 PM
  • News said:

    "I think you are well aware of this and I believe you want to intentionally re-write history out of a misplaced and partisan loyalty to party...but you will have to do a better job than that if you want to overturn all the factual evidence. It never ceases to shock me how Bush supporters and warmongers will defend Bush wrongs no matter how much factual evidence is placed before them. It kinda makes one believe that maybe you have a hidden agenda that isn't very well hidden."

    Wow, I'm such a supporter of Bush that my first words to you were that I don't like the man. All I said was that you needed better evidence to call him a liar than that article, and I did read the whole thing, where the intelligence comes from a member of Saddam's inner circle. Considering the source and his and Bush's pre-established beliefs, I can understand why he would dismiss that intelligence.

    Now, I want to make sure you know exactly what I'm saying. I believe Bush was totally wrong. I also think he totally believed that Saddam had WMD's. I'd be willing to bet that he still believes there were and maybe even are WMD's in Iraq. This doesn't make him a liar, just pathetically wrong, which is still unacceptable in a president. If this makes you think I'm a warmongering Bush supporter with misplaced party loyalties and a hidden agenda, then maybe you are even worse at deciphering intelligence than he was.

    -- Posted by Philemon on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 11:39 PM
  • Thanks for the "Common Dreams" link Nana Dot. I also found it interesting. I wonder whether, or not any of the theocrats dared to peek at it. Naw, I know better than that for if they had that much curiosity they would not be theocrats.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 11:39 PM
  • So Philemon will ye not also accept News Across as your brother?

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Feb 15, 2010, at 11:49 PM
  • I'll accept anyone as a brother if that is what they desire, although I'm not quite sure where you are coming from with that. If it is just that Philemon is also a book of the Bible then I can guarantee that I won't try to convert anyone.

    -- Posted by Philemon on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 12:14 AM
  • An idle thought as I wait to see if anyone else posts this evening. I am wondering if secession from our union was put to a vote in Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana, and Oklahoma, whether or not a slim majority would vote to withdraw from the current union.

    I believe that there is a distinct possibility that they would. The mere thought of slabs popping up on every county court house lawn proclaiming the ten commandments would be far too delicious for the majority in those states to resist. Further, I think that the Southern Baptists would fervently support it because they would have the theocracy in place that they not so subtly push for with some success in each of those states.

    The four states are homogenous in many ways. Check any social statistics, for teen pregnancy, incarceration rates, child abuse, spousal abuse, health, obesity, illiteracy, etc., and they are all four lumped together at the bottom. I can see them as The United Christian Confederacy.

    I would expect New Orleans to petition for free port status. ;)


    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 12:22 AM
  • Philemon my apologies if I offended. It was a rather ham handed response on my part to Paul's message of brotherhood in the book of Philemon. I should probably hasten to add that I am not a Paulist.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 12:26 AM
  • New Across: I agree with everything you said (EXCEPT) Bush didn't have the Brains to figure that out! The Republican Party put him there, to be their yes Man! Their "Mortimer Snerd". I called them Criminals at the time, and nothing has changed. They should be charged with Treason & Murder, and be in a Federal Prison buy now, for life! But,how do we carry out the Law, when they are the Law? If this is not Carried out, the entire World, should hate us! Yes, because most of us let it happen,and are still Complicit in this thing for not putting them away, or Hanging them like we did to Hitler's Regime at Nurnberg Trials! There is NO difference? We should see that this is done for our Brave Men & Women who are Dead now, for an unnecessary War! This Burn's me up!!!

    -- Posted by Jo on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 3:27 AM
  • OKR

    No offense taken and I didn't think any was implied. I thought you were probably referring to Paul.

    Yes, I was up way too late to have to be up this early.

    -- Posted by Philemon on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 5:46 AM
  • Philemon said, "The more compelling evidence to me at the time that he did have WMD's was simply the fact that he had the inspectors kicked out in 1998 and wouldn't let them back in, even with the threat of invasion."

    This is a point Mr. Bush made late in his presidency, a fairly blatant bit of history revision. Inspectors DID return to Iraq prior to the 2003 US invasion, over the objection of the Bush administration, which by then cleared prefered war because it wouldn't trust Saddam to disarm, regardless what the inspectors found (or didn't).

    The inspectors were having a hard time getting cooperation from Iraq, but they were not given time to complete their task before the invasion began.


    -- Posted by taxedpayer on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 6:51 AM
  • Who can tell me anything about the Chicken Tree or the Cob Factory?

    -- Posted by red dog on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 8:36 AM
  • news, thanks for the definitions. I have a handy dandy little gadget on my desktop that is a dictionary...... My point -- we (me and you) are not privy to all the details and discussions that go on behind the doors. We only KNOW what is reported to us and we only KNOW what is revealed. Do you trust the media 100%? Any of it? This is not an invitation to label any as "liberal" or "neocon" or any of the other pet names. Do you really believe that you have ALL the facts?

    Have a great day!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 9:40 AM
  • Missy08,

    I agree with what you are saying but now that we do know about the run-up to the invasion of Iraq, do you think we should have done it?

    -- Posted by What the f...... on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 10:31 AM
  • I don't KNOW that I have all the facts. I, like you, only have the information that has been released to us. I don't believe for a second that the media does not "spin".

    I don't want war -- ever. I hate to think that young men and women are dying because of arrogance and greed.

    I don't believe we should impose our values and beliefs on others. I do believe we were attacked in 2001 and I do believe there is still a threat.

    I believe that our President deserves respect -- no matter who it is or his party.

    I am sick to death of "tolerance" when it poses a risk to us.

    Does anyone else find it ironic that one on this board has complained about the war and violence yet he was quick to threaten violence? "...so I think anyone who would choose to assault me for my opinions would quickly find themselves both in the hospital and ...." just a silly little statment that has bugged me......


    -- Posted by missy08 on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 11:17 AM
  • missyo8,

    you are going to get raked over the coals for your last post.

    betcha! :D>

    -- Posted by pressman on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 11:40 AM
  • Keeps life interesting!!!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 11:45 AM
  • WARNING:The following contains no truth or cold hard facts. It is only for entertainment purposes.

    Heaviest Element Yet Known to Science Discovered

    Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory in California has now identified with certainty the heaviest element known to science.

    The new element, Pelosium (PL), has one neutron, 25 assistant neutrons, 88 deputy neutrons, and 198 assistant deputy neutrons, giving it an atomic mass of 312.

    These 312 particles are held together by forces called morons, which are surrounded by vast quantities of lepton-like particles called peons.

    Pelosium is inert, and has no charge and no magnetism. Nevertheless, it can be detected because it impedes every reaction with which it comes into contact. A tiny amount of Pelosium can cause a reaction that would normally take less than a second, to take from 4 days to 4 years to complete.

    Pelosium has a normal half-life of 2 years. It does not decay, but instead undergoes a biennial reorganization in which a portion of the assistant neutrons and deputy neutrons exchange places.

    Pelosium mass will increase over time, since each reorganization will promote many morons to become isodopes.

    This characteristic of moron promotion leads some scientists to believe that Pelosium is formed whenever morons reach a critical concentration. This hypothetical quantity is referred to as critical morass.

    When catalyzed with money, Pelosium becomes Senatorium, an element that radiates just as much energy as Pelosium since it has half as many peons but twice as many morons.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 11:57 AM
  • Missy said this:

    "Does anyone else find it ironic that one on this board has complained about the war and violence yet he was quick to threaten violence?"

    ME: Missy, not only ironic, but a tad hypocritical.

    Pressman, she does a right fair job of defending herself, so I would expect that she's not particularly concerned about being attacked.

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 12:07 PM
  • rr3 - sorry, but that's not a new element. someone has given you a bum steer. that element is known as bushisium, but i don't see why the two can't share it. :)

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 12:12 PM
  • Salty Dawg - COLD SWEAT http://www.fox4kc.com/videobeta/?watchId=60ac2935-6342-47a6-8e1b-14fb134a005e link likely won't work. "salty dog" formerly from marshall

    -- Posted by wheresthelove on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 12:20 PM
  • Yep, the link worked. Pretty good stuff. Thanks for sharing.

    regarding the new element -- an equal opportunity funny!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 12:28 PM
  • News wrote: If there are any apologies necessary, I suggest they be directed to our African-American brothers and Sisters who have worked hard, suffered greatly, and yet are still able to find enough love in there big and generous hearts to forgive us white folk for our sins.

    I have never imposed any suffering on African-American's so don't need any forgiveness from them. Why play the race card here? When can White America quit making apologies for things their ancestors did? Does this also mean any ancestor of a nation who has declared war on the US should apologize to those living here now? Germans, Russians, Japanese, the list goes on. When is enough enough? How about "move on" or "get over it"? BTW, you have no idea of my color or nationality so don't make any assumptions here.

    Later news posted: If people want to keep getting sucked into every new war that comes along, that is fine with me. I don't have to live in America and I don't have to live with the consequences.

    Since you don't have to live in America, why keep harping to us about what "we Americans" as you like to phrase are doing? I know you are still a US citizen, blah blah blah. But then you make comments such as this one? I don't get it.

    -- Posted by Air Force Wife on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 12:49 PM
  • AFW - about all you can do is to just consider the source and go about your business. Right? :)

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 1:07 PM
  • NB - I'm pleased that your mealtime expansion efforts are moving forward. I know you've been working hard to generate the interest and encourage patronage. :)

    Sorry to learn about your husband's difficulty. Hope all goes well for him.

    I gave up subscribing to the SMSN a few years ago, but maybe I'll holler at Jean and see if she has an extra copy of the issue with your story in it. Have to see if it measures up to the MDN story about your venture. :)

    Yep, only a few months before a new crop of grads are turned out to face the cruel world. Some of the best years of their lives are behind them.

    I'm still reading the Wilbert Myers story - I've rationed it to a month every few days - now up to May 1895.

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 1:21 PM
  • Slater,

    Yes, Missyo8 handles herself very well I agree.

    -- Posted by pressman on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 2:00 PM
  • rr3yvo: How about staying with the protocol on this blog. "Your" Pelosium comment is on right wing web sites all over the net. Protocol is to give an introductury comment then provide a link. It is not blog protocol to just plunk borrowed material down without acknowlegement. It is also plagiarism.


    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 2:39 PM
  • Thank you Slater. I hadn't been here for quite some time, took a while to catch up but some things I just can't let go. You stood your ground well last week!

    -- Posted by Air Force Wife on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 2:54 PM
  • -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 3:25 PM
  • Kathy,

    Thank you for the research with the MEC in actually obtaining a copy of the specific State Ethics Commission opinion (2008.09.CI.008). Providing the distinction between a class 3 and class 4 city is also very helpful. I think that the info provided regarding the city size definition would answer the address the issue of whether this should have a bearing on the MECs answer. I would opine that in this case size does not matter and class 3 versus 4 would be moot given the question raised to the MEC. I would say though that I think the specific opinion does provide a very valuable template as to whether it applies in the Marshall situation in that the city who asked the question of the MEC provided 4 specific scenarios of the MEC and asked the MEC which one they could proceed with. The first scenario is the exact case as it occurred in Marshall where the mayor resigns his/her position and is immediately appointed by the city administrator with pay and benefits. [For other interested readers, please go to Kathy Fairchild's comment down the blog with the complete web address for the opinion. The other scenarios provided in the request including the mayor being appointed the CA position without pay and two scenarios where the mayor retains the position and just assumes the CA position.] And in their response I think the MEC adequately answered the scenario that was similar to one that unfolded in Marshall and that is where they provide the comment that "Section 105.454(5), RSMo prohibits the performance of any service for consideration, during one year after termination of his office, by which performance the mayor attempts to influence a decision of the political subdivision in which he or she was an officer to over which he had supervisory power. Assuming the City Administrator is a position of influence, the statute precludes the mayor from assuming this position for one year after termination of his office. See Commission Opinions 2008.CI.001, 2003.01.101 and 1993.05.102. AS stated above, the prohibition includes the payment of any consideration."

    So after reading the MECs opinion and thinking of the Marshall situation where the scenario was the former mayor resigning her position and then being appointed to a paid position of CA (which wields influence over the political subdivision of Marshall), I am wondering how Marshall got itself into the situation it did with this action. I would recommend the City Attorney should review this prior applicable CA opinions in some detail and that the city council take up the issue in the correct light of the facts. They should seriously consider stepping back and re-doing the CA hiring, including conducting an open advertisement, interviews, etc. As such if Ms. Latimer truly loves Marshall as she states many times in the papers, she should resign the CA position to allow the council the needed latitude to extricate themselves from this ethical misstep.

    Though there has been blogger comment that would indicate that we should sweep this under the rug and go forward with the former mayor in the new position because "she'll do a great job." That is a moot point here. I am under the impression that the council is operating counter to state direction; in this case there is specific written direction from the state detailing the correct course of action.

    Thank you slater for the pertinent details and info. And Kathy Fairchild, very good homework as well. Thank you.

    -- Posted by oceanlord49 on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 3:26 PM
  • The Marshall City Council meeting is going to be held in a couple of hours. Wonder if anyone is planning to attend? I hear (gossip, rumor) that everyone has settled into their new positions quite well. Let's keep our fingers crossed.....


    -- Posted by missy08 on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 3:29 PM
  • oceanlord: I am still not sure that I agree with the MEC.

    Section 105.454(5)reads in full:" Perform any service for consideration, during one year after termination of his or her office or employment, by which performance he or she attempts to influence a decision of any agency of the state, or a decision of any political subdivision in which he or she was an officer or employee or over which he or she had supervisory power, except that this provision shall not be construed to prohibit any person from performing such service and receiving compensation therefor, in any adversary proceeding or in the preparation or filing of any public document **or to prohibit an employee of the executive department from being employed by any other department, division or agency of the executive branch of state government.**

    Note the portion between the asterisks, regarding what this section is NOT intended to prohibit. It makes me wonder if the MEC might have missed that particular phrase in delivering its opinion.

    But that's just my view, sitting here in the cheap seats.

    -- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 4:21 PM
  • I swear I think this town becomes more and more like a cult every day. Before too much longer it won't be the City of Marshall it will be the Compound of Marshall.

    -- Posted by Scarpetta on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 4:27 PM
  • AFW - Last week I had this tune running through my head:



    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 5:47 PM
  • One more view from the cheap seats,(the really, really nose bleed cheap seats here in Oklahoma) Kathy and Ocean lord is that the intent of 105.454 is essentially to prohibit lobbying the government, or sales efforts directed toward the government, on the behalf of some other entity for one year after leaving office. I think that if the M. E. C. based their fourth class city ruling solely on 105.454 they misinterpreted their own rule.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 7:42 PM
  • That's how I read it, too, OKR. Just for clarity - it's not the MEC's rule. Their reference is to Missouri Revised Statutes.

    -- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 8:06 PM
  • I think that it is about time that piling on News Across should stop. The sniping continues both directly, and by innuendo. I think that demeans those parties more than it does News Across. I also think that some (not all) of the sniping is done because he has the ability to point out the fallacies in other's statements which is frustrating, and drives some to anger.

    A better tactic would be to better support one's own positions, or give them up for another if they can not be better supported.

    Obviously people resist change, particularly changing their own views. Sometimes that resistance leads to irrational response for we hold our convictions close to our hearts.

    A dispassionate rational consideration of anothers ideas, and statements better serves discourse, and allows one to ignore another's personal quirks that are irksome.

    Enough with the congratulatory verbal high fives to each other about how we got News Across.

    This has caused self reflection on my part so I too will try to do a better job of challenging ideas rather than personal quirks of various posters.


    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 8:15 PM
  • OKR,

    Isn't it odd how the shoes can change feet. I distinctly recall how you bristled up at Third Child on several occasions for being much like News has been, but now you're defending his behavior.

    I believe News got what he asked for, but, as NouveauBlogger said, what he got was on the same lever as what he was giving out, and I put myself on his level by doing that; however, as we've seen since, it wasn't a case of one person's distorted perception. I'm not picking on him anymore, nor am I insinuating anything about him or encouraging others to "snipe" at him; the kinds of comments being made back and forth are no different from what I've seen since I've been looking in on this blog.

    I no longer read his posts so I have no idea if what he's now saying is objectionable to others, but I'd say that's between News and anyone who might take exception to his opinions.

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 9:48 PM
  • Eric, thanks for looking into the courthouse lights. I really miss seeing them as I come into town at night, but I guess I'll have to get used to it. Maybe the lights on the clock would help. I'll look forward to your response.

    -- Posted by oneofmany on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 10:00 PM
  • OKR - you see what I mean?

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 10:09 PM
  • Whew! It's hot in here!

    -- Posted by What the f...... on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 10:11 PM
  • Yes, I stated that I believed Third Child posted too often, and at unnecessary length. My reason was that he was in my opinion a parrot repeating the Alex Jones (is that his last name?) mantra ad nauseam, seldom linking to any other site than Jones'. I could have gotten his entire message from Alex Jones.

    News is different in that his comments are original, and tied to various links that I often find interesting. His points are supported by disparate links.

    Having said all that I was probably wrong to have asked Third Child to curtail. I have reflected on that since he left the blog, and it is part of the reason I have risen to the defense of News Across.

    By the way any others that for whatever reason enter a period of frequent posts will at the least be ignored by me, and at last defended.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Feb 16, 2010, at 11:32 PM
  • The following link is to a thought provoking essay regarding human kind, and civilization. I think that it is the sort of thing that ND, and Cheetah as well as others would find interesting.


    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 1:36 AM
  • Toyota bashing! It's everywhere. Ironically Government Motors (GM) may gain market share. Driving many brands over many years tells me recalls and safety issues are not uniquely unAmerican. Remember also that Toyota brought manufacturing to the U.S., providing jobs, at a time U.S. based factories closed, sending jobs to China. U.S. Toyotas are assembled here and U.S. subcontractors provide a significant amount of parts. The infamous gas pedal subject to recall was manufactured in Indiana, and a U.S. company holds the patent. Remember, Toyota exported jobs to the U.S., and we need jobs when so many U.S. based companies prefer to send jobs to China and other countries that send us not only cheap products but extra amounts of pollution. We have simply off-shored carbon pollution when making the same product in the U.S. is much cleaner.

    -- Posted by Cat13 on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 7:06 AM
  • Cat13 - thanks for providing the reminder that auto quality issues can happen to the best of them.

    I wasn't aware that the gas pedal is made here, and I suspect most people don't know that, either.

    I was just thinking about Firestone's exploding tires and Ford's top-heavy Explorer, and the countless other flaws ending in recall after recall and/or lawsuit after lawsuit.

    This isn't to say that Toyota's problems should be minimized, but our "news" services should try learning all the facts of the matter before jumping to conclusions.

    Thanks for your post.

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 9:36 AM
  • I have a gripe to air to whomever will listen.

    My family is a two income household with 2 kids. We work average jobs and do not qualify for any public assistance etc. when it comes to tax time we usually balance zero on what we owe for state versus what we get back on federal

    Here is the gripe :

    I am seeing people making less than me hourly and so they qualify for food stamps, medicaid, wic, YMCA memberships (note which I can't afford). and then at the end of the year they get a HUGE federal tax refund that if were divided by number of hours they work would put their hourly rate higher than mine---- this system is messed up-- I beginning to think that I should take a lower paying job so I can come out ahead, get gov't assistance, and end up with more than those making more per hour.

    I am just fuming about this as my family struggles to make ends meet others are coming out better for not getting an education and working lower end jobs.

    -- Posted by workingmom on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 10:23 AM
  • Right on Workingmom!!

    It is called "working the system", these people are professions at using the system to get ahead. Which is why in my personal opinion the world is as messed up as it is. As far as the big refunds go, Uncle Sam has the "earned income credit" which is where these big refunds come in. If you know how to fall in just the right place, you can rake in the bucks.

    Then add: medicade - food stamps - help with bills - Y memberships - lowered rent - these people are living the life. They don't work or do so very little, they do their drugs get their nails done plop out kids and drink and smoke.

    Then they get busted for drugs, get a slap on the wrist and keep soaking off the tax payers. While others of us are set to watch as they screw the government. It is called assistance for a reason people, they are assisting you...not a means for living. The system needs an overhaul. [/rant]

    -- Posted by Scarpetta on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 10:37 AM
  • News

    I hesitate to continue this since our disagreement is only minor, but I was rather annoyed by your method of argument, which I will get to in a moment. Basically, you maintain that Bush is an out and out liar while I tend to think he is just too stupid and stubborn to see the obvious truth. Either way, we agree that he was a poor leader. I'm not defending Bush, just attacking him in a different manner.

    What I take exception to you more than anything is your quick dismissal that it was "painfully clear" that I hadn't read the entire article and made my conclusions early on, I suppose because I only quoted something from the first paragraph. Let me assure you, I read the whole thing, more than once actually.

    Your article actually supports not only my position, but my method of presenting it, if you actually read the whole thing. In paragraph 13 it says, "The first paragraph of an intelligence report is the most important and most read and colors the rest of the report." Same can be said for a well written article, thus my quote being only from the first paragraph.

    Another important part of a memo, or in this case an article, is the last paragraph, which states what conclusions can be drawn from the whole. Quoting the last paragraph, "While one Iraqi source told the CIA that there were no WMD, information that was true but distorted to probe the opposite, another Iraqi source was a fabricator whose lies were eagerly embraced. 'The real tragedy is that they had a good source that they misused,' said one of the former CIA officers. "The fact is there was nothing there, no threat. But Bush wanted to hear what he wanted to hear."

    Notice that the article calls one of the sources a liar, but not the president himself. I won't go so far as to say that he couldn't have been an out and out liar, just that this doesn't prove it. All it proves is like I said, he was too stupid and stupid and stubborn to see the obvious truth. This is probably why the current administration won't try to prosecute Bush or his cronies. Like I said before, I think he still believes there were and maybe even are WMD's in Iraq, and expects evidence to be found someday to vindicate him. I also thing that if they were blatantly lying, Bush or at least Cheney would have been smart enough to get some evidence planted in Iraq to support their lies better.

    -- Posted by Philemon on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 11:49 AM
  • -- Posted by missy08 on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 12:00 PM
  • Loved it Missy08...unless you were referring to me as the....OMG ;).^...$

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 12:33 PM
  • OKR,

    No, that wasn't directed at you. It just came to mine while reading one of your earlier posts....

    Have a great day!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 12:48 PM
  • OKR,

    It just came to MIND... I need some coffee.


    -- Posted by missy08 on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 12:56 PM
  • Smart Dog,

    Everything you have said is exactly why there is no change in this town...and why there will never be.

    -- Posted by Scarpetta on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 1:00 PM
  • smart dog.... From my understanding Mr. Wright didn't even apply for the job... Only applicant within was Mr. Duesenberry is the word on the street..

    -- Posted by local-A-rod on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 1:03 PM
  • Glad you enjoyed it News.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 1:18 PM
  • workingmom: I'm not an expert on tax matters (far from it!) but the way I understand it, refunds are based on the difference between money withheld and amount of tax due, so the size of refund only means you paid in more than you needed to. How much is withheld is determined by the number of deductions you claim on your W-4 form filed with your employer.

    -- Posted by Eric Crump on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 1:25 PM
  • Working Mom I sympathize with your plight.I wish you would consider directing some of your anger toward our economic system that has allowed the erosion of the value of real wages for over thirty years. The real wealth has shifted to the rich as never before. They delight that your anger is directed toward the poor.

    Incidentally a majority of welfare recipients are single moms with kids. What job around now pays enough to cover child care with enough left over to raise three kids alone? Yes it has gotten harder, and harder to make ends meet.

    Just saying.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 1:30 PM
  • EIC (Earned Income Credit) is the big factor in big refunds, this is from the IRS. http://www.irs.gov/publications/p596/apa.html

    With the tax overhaul before Obama, you get more money per check. Which they did by lowering the amount of federal tax, which in turn lowers your refund.

    When it comes to filling out the W4 (as Eric noted) you make a determination to get your money now (on your paycheck) or at the end of the year (tax refund). With 2 children I can opt to pay a single rate (which is higher) and pick my kids up at the end of the year, which helps me get a refund. I pay more in I get more back.

    -- Posted by Scarpetta on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 1:55 PM
  • HickoryDickoryDock, two things (as to what you said, not directed to you or anyone for that matter)...

    1) People on the hunt for jobs limit themselves, by their own doing. They won't want this job or that job...they must have THAT job. Well when you pass up 3 jobs...well don't be so **** picky.

    2) What some people mistake for the high cost of living, is actually the cost of living high...

    -- Posted by Scarpetta on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 2:33 PM
  • Local-A-rod: The problem with listening to, and believing, the "word on the street" is that it is usually WRONG.

    -- Posted by Miss Marple on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 3:20 PM
  • Here's an article from the Washington Post about the effect of the stimulus bill which gives me one of those feelings like, can I believe this or not?:


    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 3:21 PM
  • Slater - Why not go out on an unfashionable limb and believe it? It's good news. Are we so accustomed to bad news that we can't rejoice in good news when we hear it?

    Despite the latest rantings of Palin and her pals, the "hopey/changey" thing she dismissed out of hand might just be getting a foothold and how can that be bad?

    -- Posted by Miss Marple on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 4:51 PM
  • Slater,

    Hey there! Thanks for the well wishes. I hear the kids are going to have a fun-packed 3 days down there. Going to Corpus Christi, to the beach; the Alamo; one of the many malls; the (?)Riverwalk...the trip is planned for March.

    -- Posted by nouveaublogger on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 4:59 PM
  • Miss Marple, I suppose I should describe my reaction as that of surprise more than believability, particularly when listening to our news readers.

    It is heartening alright, but in my case I've probably been focusing too much on individual testimony and not enough on general conditions.

    Yep, you've caught me being less optimistic, unlike an earlier statement I made about viewing the tank as being half full rather than half empty.

    Thanks for the reminder. :)

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 5:01 PM
  • NB, March should be a good time for their visit. By then the weather is usually very spring-like.

    My! Sounds like they could use a good tour guide. :) Tell them to be sure and ask to see the basement at the Alamo. (heh heh)

    I hope they plan to work in the missions, and the Riverwalk will be a novelty.

    Thanks for the update!

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 5:09 PM
  • Here's a report I won't have to ponder about the poll showing that the vast majority of Americans disagree with the Supreme Court decision on campaign finance:


    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 5:53 PM
  • By the way, NB, maybe you should pass along to someone involved in the trip plan that the Corpus beach is less than desirable and so, too, might be the water, since a lot of jellyfish seem to be active down there during March. I'd advise staying out of the water (which is polluted anyhow).

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 6:07 PM
  • As long as we have lobbyist in Washington then we might as well give free reign to corporations.

    Get rid of lobbyist then limit corporations.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 9:43 PM
  • I recently heard someone say that there's been conversation about doing something with rule 22, but I'd be greatly amazed if it were to happen. If it was voted out, I believe that would be a good sign that the stalemate could be loosening.

    I'm hoping the fall elections will improve things, but I'll not be holding my breath.

    If action could return to the days of "loyal opposition," we might be a whole lot better off.

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 9:55 PM
  • Smartdog, I think you would be well-advised to talk to any school personnel about why Mr. Blakely is no longer with the district. The comment about Dr. Gordon confuses me. The reasons for his dismissal have been well-documented, and he wasn't replaced by anyone local. I'm sure I don't know why Mr. Latham resigned, but I sometimes wonder how Marshall can find anyone to coach. You couldn't pay me enough to go through what they have to endure.

    -- Posted by oneofmany on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 10:57 PM
  • Thank, for the Link on Beck ! That guy is a lying Clown ! How can anyone take that guy Serious ! I had no idea he had that kind of following! I try to watch all News Commatater ,but i can't stomach FOX ! Thanks Again!

    -- Posted by Jo on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 10:59 PM
  • -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 11:00 PM
  • Slater,

    Will do! One of the teachers told me they were going there. When I asked a couple of the seniors that I knew would be going (this is a privilege they earn, I think, having to keep up their grades and be on their best behavior during the year)they said they wanted to go to Sea World and Six Flags, but neither will be open in March. However, I will pass along the news about the jellyfish! I got into a mess of them (the non-stinging type when I was 18 at Virginia Beach. My first and last trip into the ocean water! YUK! The rest of that vacation was spent around the pool! True story, was reading the book, "Jaws"! :P

    -- Posted by nouveaublogger on Wed, Feb 17, 2010, at 11:01 PM
  • HickoryDickoryDock---

    No we are not living above our means-- yes we do make it and have assets-- I am just discouraged and not blaming others. It does seem that the system is a little wrong-- I never stated that those on assistance are living "high off the hog", as I am not either. I stated that they seem to come out with a little boost for making less hrly -- as when all the assistance is added in it helps.

    Another thing, I am trying not to take your comment as a jab -- rather a misunderstanding-- we do not live beyond our means-- rather we have many other expenses that those who are on assistance don't have-- health insurance premiums and copays (those on medicaid don't have these), food which we don't have food stamps or wic for, utilities (which we don't get assistance on), and house payment (we don't get section 8 for rent assistance) so no we are not living beyond our means we are simply living simply with basic needs met-- granted we are planning for our future like retirement plans, life insurance etc.. but we are unable to save for our kids' college-- we are making it but can't afford a lot of luxuries-- especially after daycare is paid (which we don't get assistance for either) -- what we are paying out of pocket is what others with less hrly wages are getting assistance for so they are coming out the same as those in my situation--- that is my point-- not that the don't need it -- but the system is a little warped

    I am recognizing my full potential etc--- I was griping-- not stating anything but OPINION--


    I don't -- so please don't make a personal attack on me when I was talking in general terms-- I am happy with my life-- just a little disgruntled

    -- Posted by workingmom on Thu, Feb 18, 2010, at 8:43 AM
  • And one more thing--I was airing a gripe at the system -- not those who receive the assistance as they needed it--and I am glad that their children are able to eat etc... but I am saying the current system is jaded-- anyway--- HickoryDickoryDock-- if I give you my budget -- maybe you can see where I have extra-- because I don't, and note the basics are covered but no extra.

    -- Posted by workingmom on Thu, Feb 18, 2010, at 8:50 AM
  • Here's a list of legislators who'll be vacating their chairs this fall, either for retirement or for another job:


    And if the American people do their job, the list should grow to monumental proportions.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 18, 2010, at 9:04 AM
  • NB, the parks maintain some kind of schedule year-round, so it'll depend on which weekdays they'll be here. All someone had to do was go online and look at the park calendars.

    I hope they have a good time and aren't too disappointed with the beach at Corpus. It doesn't look a thing like the one's in the movies. :)

    You were reading Jaws, eh? (heh heh) Actually, I believe Great Whites have been spotted in that area.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 18, 2010, at 9:24 AM
  • I personally feel the system is broken, actually I think it is FUBARed.

    In addition my issues are with those who don't actually need assistance...or forget what assistance means. There are hard working people out there who could use a little help from time to time. Rather than help prevent pregnancy and more people feeding off an already broken system, they encourage people to have more kids to keep their claws in the ever loving tax payer dollar...for little or nothing.

    -- Posted by Scarpetta on Thu, Feb 18, 2010, at 10:28 AM
  • notgvnasht,

    If you truly "would work anywhere at the moment" then check the classifieds section of this very news paper. The one job I have seen pop up at least three times. A few of the others have been there a while.

    My theory of limiting ones own job category is proven when you said "Now if i wanted to spend hours a day driving and fighting traffic in all kinds of weather than im sure i could go to KC and work just about anywhere."

    -- Posted by Scarpetta on Thu, Feb 18, 2010, at 2:22 PM
  • Get real people...have you forgotten that we are still in the midst of THE GREAT RECESSION? A recession that will likely result in a "jobless recovery" per many of those that professionally read the economic tea leaves. I will be strained to call it a recovery if there aren't jobs with it. A recovery for who? Oh, the rich, and especially the very rich...how grand. :(

    My utmost sympathy to all of you who are struggling in this sad time.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 18, 2010, at 2:41 PM
  • Oklahoma: Thanks for the link. Makes you wonder why the New York Time's or Washington Post don't run stories like that on their Front Page? And why are Bush & Cheney and the rest , running loose? How could any American put the Republican Party back in office after their last 8 Year's? They have shown their credibility and Ideology don't work! Their entire Governance is a lie! All the other Parties were lead into it with Lie's? How long will we exist based on lie?

    -- Posted by Jo on Thu, Feb 18, 2010, at 3:49 PM
  • Most trusted name in news?

    or Fox


    or Jon Stewart


    Have a great evening!

    BTW, did anybody hear the weather forecast for Sunday? 8-12 inches of snow? Gads!!!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Thu, Feb 18, 2010, at 7:11 PM
  • Just a thought--has the Marshall school board ever thought of building a new high school and using the old one for middle school and/or grade school--would it hold that many students??? They have the nice sports complex there but there seems to be too little parking for the crowds so was wondering what if they would build a new high school on the ground they propose to purchase--

    -- Posted by farmerwife on Thu, Feb 18, 2010, at 8:14 PM
    Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
    That option has not been brought up at any meeting I've attended. From what I understand, building new elementary schools has highest priority because those buildings, collectively, are most difficult to maintain and most overcrowded. BMS is also becoming a serious maintenance problem, but because the district's bonding capacity won't allow it to build more than one school at a time, the board chose to start with elementary and go from there. Moving BMS students into the high school might work, but it wouldn't address the elementary school problems.
  • Frankly, I also had thought about the option of moving the middle school to the high school and building a new high school instead. However, after thinking about it, I decided there were a few problems with the concept. First, many students attend both the career center (and Saline County High School) as well as the high school, so there is much running back and forth. That would create a huge busing issue. Also, many kids who participate in sports would not have rides to practice if the high school were not in the same location as the athletic facilities. The buses are, of course, tied up after school to transport kids home, so they would be unavailable to provide transportation for kids from the new location back to the facilities that are already built at the high school. Also, I don't think you're going to want to have one or two elementary buildings at the Gieringer property (if we can pass the bond issue) next to a new high school. You would be releasing many young teenage drivers at the same time you were releasing grade school children, some of whom will be walking. Not a good combination. If I remember correctly, our high school was built in 76-77, making it the newest facility in our district.

    -- Posted by oneofmany on Thu, Feb 18, 2010, at 10:51 PM
  • Is the high school still on South Odell?

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 18, 2010, at 10:59 PM
    Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
    The old high school is now Bueker Middle School. The new high school is located on Miami Avenue just south of Vest Street.
  • Evenin all.

    Slater the S. Odell location has been the middle school for some time. The "new" high school is on the west side of town (a nice complex).

    Jo you are welcome my friend.

    News I was aware that there is little technical difference between a bad so called recession, and depression defined. I have read several definitions of both, and agree that on the bottom line we are in a depression. I chose to not use "depression" in my statement because I thought some might see it as a strident, alarmist polemic, and turn away from reading it. Also Great Recession (capitalized) distinguishes it from our last great depression. Do you think a great panic has manifested itself? ;)

    Thanks though, I never fail to read a good source of information.

    Good night everybody. Peace

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 18, 2010, at 11:49 PM
  • Didn't intend to confuse...

    news, you just explained my point.

    Polls allow the participant to choose an option provided by the creator of the poll. If PBS isn't an option.....

    And, the pendulum swings, the world turns, etc.

    Have a great day! Clouds, rain, a little sleet. No snow, yet!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Fri, Feb 19, 2010, at 7:00 AM
  • I have a question...I really hate to break up the current convo...but I have to ask...

    Does this article http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/MO_XGR_BUILDING_BONDS_MOOL-?SITE=MOMAR&SE...

    Reference the very school bond issue this town is trying to pass? Is this where the money would come from if it passes? Or is it a different bond?

    -- Posted by Scarpetta on Fri, Feb 19, 2010, at 8:33 AM
  • News,

    Maybe I am not making it clear as to who the gripe is against. I am not upset with those who are in need of the government needed assistance. I am very aware of the need for such programs and am grateful that they exist to help those in need and do my part to help those in need everyday. However, my gripe is against the pure structure of the system that seems to give assistance to those who on paper make less hourly, but with all assistance received, have the same things that I have worked and sacrificed to provide to my family, given to them, and at sometimes receive things that I cannot provide my family-- like a YMCA membership, because I cannot afford that luxury.

    I am frustrated that I worked for years, to pay for my college so in turn did not qualify financial grants, only scholarships, and wound up getting college debt to obtain a "better" paying job when I could possibly be in the same position financially without the years of sacrifice.

    Don't get me wrong, I love my life, my job, and my family and would not trade my life or circumstances.

    I was airing frustration at the structure of the welfare system----NOT WELFARE RECIPIENTS THEMSELVES-- as I am probably 2 paychecks away from the welfare office myself-- so please don't take away from my gripe-- remember it is just a gripe--- that I am condemning the people who need the assistance--

    Those who are in my same boat, such as Nanadot, can see and possibly feel the same frustrations.

    -- Posted by workingmom on Fri, Feb 19, 2010, at 8:42 AM
  • News Across,

    A friend is teaching this semester at E Cowan University in Perth. He reports unemployment is only 5% there and a boom in construction. So in addition to sunny skies, Australia's economy looks quite good.

    Not so good in other parts of the world. Greece, etc.

    "It's a recession if your neighbor has lost his/her employment, it's a depression if you have lost your job."

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Fri, Feb 19, 2010, at 9:29 AM
  • ND said this:

    "The multi-nationals, the military-corporate complex and mega corporations are going to kill us off, kill the planet, and starve everyone else in the name of profit IMO..."

    ME: I couldn't agree more. I keep remembering the Eisenhower campaign? commercial when he said something along the line of, "...we must beware of the military-industrial complex becoming too powerful..."

    We have no reason to believe those on that side of the street would ever play fair, and there's far from enough honest and well-intentioned members of Congress to keep the other side in check.

    I believe the Fall elections will indicate one of two possibilities - either the public will be too reactionary, or the public will continue to be apathetic, but I'd much rather have to deal with with over reaction than no reaction.

    -- Posted by Slater on Fri, Feb 19, 2010, at 10:40 AM
  • I came across this highlight reel of the MU-Texas game Wednesday night, if anyone is interested:


    -- Posted by Slater on Fri, Feb 19, 2010, at 12:39 PM
  • Thanks for the victory news Slater. Mizzou 82-TX 77, brought joy.

    There was much unhappiness when Mack Brown left the Tarheel football program for TX. Rick Barnes and Dean Smith had a few run ins, so when Rick Barnes left Clemson for TX, it meant Carolina fans had a double shot of angst about the two dominant sports at TX.

    Not much to cheer about for the Tarheels. "It's a rebuilding year", we softly sob into our carolina blue "lucky" gear.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Fri, Feb 19, 2010, at 8:49 PM
  • OKR

    Book TV (C-span) will have a Tribute to Howard Zinn on (Sunday at 4 PM ET) You had mentioned Zinn's writings in your postings.

    Note the time is Eastern, so you might want to check your local schedule.

    Friends of Howard Zinn gathered at Busboys and Poets in Washington, DC, to pay tribute to the historian and political activist who died on January 27, 2010. The speakers include Ralph Nader, Marian Wright Edelman, Amy Goodman, Dave Zirin, Bernice Johnson Reagon, Phyllis Bennis, Geoffrey Millard, Richard Rubenstein, and Busboys and Poets' owner Andy Shallal. The program also includes music by Bernice Johnson Reagon and Emma's Revolution and readings from Howard Zinn's books.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Fri, Feb 19, 2010, at 11:06 PM
  • slater: If you think the corporations are going to kill us off, who in the world is going to employ you and provide you with a pay check every week or month so that you can take care of your family and needs and wants?

    It is the lazy person's arguement to blame big corporations or any businesss for that matter.

    OHhhhh I know.... you want all people to be government employees and all industries nationalized and ran by the government and then the government can control what you eat, drive, drink and where you live and what job you can have and when or if you can go on vacation. And they will control what goods and services are provided and in what quantities and the prices, including your salary and benefits.

    Exactly what group of people do you trust to do this for you without allowing the greed and power to just make all the "common citizens" serfs?

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Feb 20, 2010, at 3:11 AM
  • Here are a couple of poems I wrote at the start of the Iraq war. I am a lot older now, a lot more tired now, but still, still, the war goes on.

    Seeking Saddam

    Part building, part rubble in the morning sun.

    testament to last night's bombing run.

    It was no different anywhere in the city

    for smart bombs can not show pity.

    Those who remained inside lay prostrate with fear

    awed by the silence for they could not hear.

    The sound had roared, a thousand claps of thunder

    designed to assure morale was quickly torn asunder.

    Inside one room, one woman lay frozen

    with fear of a fate that she had not chosen.

    She feared for her life, she feared for her soul,

    what god had felt it necessary to exact such a toll?

    All over Baghdad a similar scene played out.

    Some could hear the screams but no one heard a shout

    of "we are here to rescue you, we are here to save,

    we did not mean to kill you, to put you in your grave.

    We came to kill Saddam and to set you free,

    our motives are pure, as you can surely see".


    Three Men In A Sandbox

    Rub a dub dubya

    words were garbled

    as oil leaked

    then spewed

    from their mouths

    hands caked with blood

    they caressed their faces

    smearing blood and oil

    camouflaged to match

    a mosaic in the sand

    meanwhile shovel and bucket

    were untouched

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sat, Feb 20, 2010, at 3:27 AM
  • Oh...one more thing...

    I actually do like and respect some of my opponents on the other side of the aisle...such as mrxray. Xray often times makes challenging arguments and he is capable of articulating his arguments rather well. I may disagree with xray on most the issues, but personally I have a lot of respect for the guy's intelligence, wit, and ability to present a logical argument.

    I have been away for a while..... I might just cry... lol Thanks for the nice words

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Feb 20, 2010, at 3:34 AM
  • Have a look at this short news video to see what's special about some humans:


    -- Posted by Slater on Sat, Feb 20, 2010, at 9:46 AM
  • Xray, you miss the point. I'm not opposed to corporations, I'm opposed to the crooks who run them. The head knockers are driven by their own greed and the greed of the investors. Are you one of the investors?

    Watch the video I posted and you'll know what I'm talking about. Maybe.

    -- Posted by Slater on Sat, Feb 20, 2010, at 9:57 AM
  • Good show on the Poem, Oklahoma! Hope your Son's well! He's home i hope?

    -- Posted by Jo on Sat, Feb 20, 2010, at 2:12 PM
  • Thank you Jo. Fortunately my son is home, and though he was in the middle of combat, and got "blown up" once he is better off than others who were in his unit some of whom were killed, and others grievously wounded. He does suffer from PTSD, and some hearing loss. We shall see what long term medical problems crop up due to exposure to environmental hazards of the dirty weapons. Lousy stinkin war. I shall hate Dick Cheney, and his band of miscreants the remainder of my days. I would welcome the opportunity to spit in his evil leering face.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sat, Feb 20, 2010, at 7:25 PM
  • Slater, I saw the ABC News about Bob giving the company to his employees. Nice man. I purchased Bob's Whole Grain Oatmeal earlier this year. It was highly rated by Cooks Illustrated. Has proven to be a winner. I have it every other day. Does require more cooking than the instant variety, but I can handle that.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Sat, Feb 20, 2010, at 7:41 PM
  • NanaDot thanks for the real Repub link.

    Slater I wish all businesses were owned by the people who make them successful.

    UpseDaisy I appreciate the Howard Zinn heads up. I'm afraid I am going to miss it.

    Guess I will check in later to see who has pulled up chairs to visit on the big front porch.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sat, Feb 20, 2010, at 7:59 PM
  • OKR, I admire your poetry. I allow a young Marine, who served three tours of duty in Iraq, to bow hunt on my land. He enlisted after 9/11. He too, has a hearing loss serious enough to require hearing aids. Job hunting has been difficult, part time at a sporting goods emporium. He was glad to harvest four deer last year, only two this year. Smart critters.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Sat, Feb 20, 2010, at 8:21 PM
  • nandot: Just by YOU saying that Americans are working longer and harder and etc does not make it so. I dont see any stats to prove that... in fact, more people are not working at all or are just accepting part time jobs.

    Based on your words, lets just shut down EVERY big business and big corporation. Shut them down and ship out the millions of jobs that they provide to other nations. What then?

    Dont forget in your list the big Music corporations, Sports and entertainment corporations. The HUGE GE Corp that spews out Leftist biased news and prevents honest reporting on the most important issue of the day, the Presidency and the campaign leading up to it and whose CEO is in bed with Obama getting all those perks like green jobs money without any competition from any other business.

    Oh..how easily and lazily you forget about the corruption and high competition killing overhead costs that Unions cause to the big businesses.

    I am game. I know how to farm the land and hunt for food and protect my land and my family. Lets go back to the days where we do not have ANY big businesses... but wait, the BIGGEST business of all, the Government would then have ALL the power.

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Feb 20, 2010, at 10:09 PM
  • Hmmmm doesnt the consumer have the OPTION of purchasing from ONLY employee owned businesses or cooperatives if the consumer was truly concerned about this? Does not the private individual have the ability to learn which companies treat the employees the best in this regard and then reward those businesses with their .... business?

    If you dont like it, do as you said with the oatmeal, educate yourself and others as to the business model that makes you 'happy' and then drive the other businesses out of business....

    Or... sit back and play the blame game.

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Feb 20, 2010, at 10:12 PM
  • Slater: how is the greed of corporations any worse than the greed of the political class? Or how is the greed of corporation owners any worse than the individual greed of each person who only looks out for their own on a daily basis instead of making decisions based on what is best for the most?

    Is not our problem with what you call greed at the corporation level just a symptom of the overall state of our society? Look at the 'hollywood' effect and how the people who influence our next generations continuously fail to uphold morals and ethics and show disregard for laws and etc. it is NOT a problem just with owners of corporations.

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Feb 20, 2010, at 10:16 PM
  • Too late on my midnight walk to catch anyone remaining on the front porch?

    Upsedaisy thank you for the compliment.

    I can not not write poetry. It is how I sing. Given the voice of a frog the words rise from the page only in my mind.

    Thank you for your service to our country (the young marine you allow to hunt).


    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 12:38 AM
  • Mrxray: Raw greed to me is the basic, and necessary instinct for survival gone awry. Those other instincts that tend to naturally contain it are weaker; altruism is on a lonely patrol, love too often links arms with greed, and is an often fickle companion in any case.

    Hence the struggle to contain it, or when it is at its most powerful, at the least to channel it is never ending. We are at a tipping point. The quality of civilization is eroding. Time will tell.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 1:07 AM
  • OKR - I'm very sorry to learn about your son's difficulties. It seems we're never fully aware of the horrors of war until someone close to us has to deal with its long-term effects.

    Cheney is definitely an evil so-and-so, and he'll get his just reward in the end.

    -- Posted by Slater on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 10:59 AM
  • ND - It would be interesting to know the number of successful employee-owned businesses.

    As I watched that video I was reminded of the Harley Davidson motorcycle company and how it was on the verge of distinction when the owners offered the company to the employees, and now look at it.

    I'm sure other like stories can be told, but I'm equally sure that number would be minimal.

    -- Posted by Slater on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 11:04 AM
  • MrXray -

    You're right when you say that greed is more a national symptom. The question is, how did our society come to this point and can it be remedied?

    Greed is the selfish and excessive desire to have more than is necessary (dictionary).

    The individual who desires to have enough for a decent life without taking advantage of others is distinct from the individual who will resort to every tactic to acquire as much wealth as possible, regardless of who's disadvantaged in the process. Robber barons, they were once called.

    As OKR pointed out once upon a time, the working class in America has been co-opted by these modern-day robber barons and made to believe that they're getting their part of the "American Dream." when, in fact, they're insuring the continued position of those on top.

    Our government is as guilty of these violations as the private sector, since the lobbyists have seen to it that they're part of the crowd who's been suckered.

    Our present-day dilemma can be traced to the beginning of settlement in this country by the Anglo-Saxon Eurpoeans whose belief was that they were carrying out God's manifest destiny to take whatever they wanted from the inhabitants of North Americaa, and that same mindset continues, as strong as ever.

    I believe that's a primary reason why racial prejudice will always exist. Human attitude can't be legislated, but behaviors can, but only to the extent that white male domination will permit.

    MrXray, the problem us commoners face is that the power brokers will always be creating illusions to keep us baffled and in line while doing their bidding. If this were not the case, we wouldn't be seeing the kind of economic problems we're facing. EVERYone COULD be enjoying a comfortable life under a form of capitalizm where people recognize the value of a cooperative spirit and teamwork.

    Some would say I'm talking about Socialism, but they'd be wrong. We don't need a socialist economy or government; all we need is for people to agree that a minority of the population doesn't need a 90% control.

    However, all of these points will be moot, since China will own 90% of America unless our bunch in Washington stops acting like spoiled brats and starts working together to solve the problems. That will require a unified America, of course, but we've come together as a nation in the past and I see no reason why it can't happen again.

    -- Posted by Slater on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 12:18 PM
  • RO (Right On) Slater, or maybe I should say FO (far out)? Better yet, ROFO.

    I see no reason why our antique catch words should not join the current lexicon. LOL

    Wht u thnk?

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 2:02 PM
  • Eloquently said ND....also ROFO.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 2:21 PM
  • OKR said this:

    "RO (Right On) Slater, or maybe I should say FO (far out)? Better yet, ROFO.

    I see no reason why our antique catch words should not join the current lexicon. LOL

    Wht u thnk?"

    ME: Ain't nuthin' to it, Bro!

    (Maybe I should refer myself to the jive talkin' scene in Airplane for a little educating.) :)

    -- Posted by Slater on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 2:29 PM
  • ND - I second OKR's comment. :)

    -- Posted by Slater on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 2:31 PM
  • I believe Yoo is sociopathic.

    -- Posted by Slater on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 4:07 PM
  • -- Posted by Slater on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 5:57 PM
  • Now here's a little puzzler that's plagued me most of my natural life:


    -- Posted by Slater on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 6:15 PM
  • News, I mean sociopath in the clinical sense. I'd like to have a look at his EEG made while he's being questioned.

    -- Posted by Slater on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 7:37 PM
  • Here's a story which I'm guessing will have an unhappy ending (claim DENIED!):


    -- Posted by Slater on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 8:49 PM
  • Here's another story about mothers who sign up for various kinds of classes advertised to "make then look and feel sexy."

    I wholeheartedly agree with the woman professor cited in the article who believes these activities not only fail to empower women, as they're loosely advertised to do, but end up reinforcing age-old male fantasies:


    -- Posted by Slater on Sun, Feb 21, 2010, at 9:10 PM
  • Here's one to sink your teeth into, but be forewarned you may be gnashing those same teeth when you finish reading it. Think you are getting shafted now? Just you wait.


    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Feb 22, 2010, at 12:14 AM

    -- Posted by Slater on Mon, Feb 22, 2010, at 10:34 AM
  • Thanks Slater for the link to the St. Louis PD article about mothers taking up pole dancing. Women can strengthen their bodies by lifting weights while wearing yoga pants. I hope everyone who followed your lead to the article also read the adjoining link to:

    Ida Stack, who taught generations of area families Jewish traditions and customs, died Saturday (Feb. 20, 2010.) She was 88 and lived in University City. Her picture accompanies a description of a well lived life.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Mon, Feb 22, 2010, at 1:10 PM
  • I hope everyone who read my post about the Harley Davidson company once being near "distinction" got a good laugh, as I did.

    I really should proof my comments before posting. :)

    -- Posted by Slater on Mon, Feb 22, 2010, at 1:37 PM
  • Upsedaisy, you make a good point. I believe it's pretty sad how some people, both female and male, can go through life without ever having a sense of self that promotes a more positive interaction with their environment.

    -- Posted by Slater on Mon, Feb 22, 2010, at 1:46 PM
  • I noticed Slater, but didn't want anyone to think I was picking on you. After all, I've always considered you a man of "distinction."

    -- Posted by Philemon on Mon, Feb 22, 2010, at 3:36 PM
  • ha ha...good one, Phileman. :)

    -- Posted by Slater on Mon, Feb 22, 2010, at 3:57 PM
  • heh heh...did I, or did I not?

    -- Posted by Slater on Mon, Feb 22, 2010, at 4:02 PM
  • Eric, how about an update on the Court House?


    -- Posted by Nonnymus on Mon, Feb 22, 2010, at 10:59 PM
    Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
    The Preservation Committee meets tonight with the construction manager, so look for an update Wednesday morning.
  • Slater,

    Well the kids are not going to the beach, seems they already got the scoop about the jellyfish and less than desireable conditions! They are going to the Alamo (told one of the teachers to tell the kids to ask to see the basement). She asked me if I was serious, or was that a joke. Guess I just don't have a very good poker face! :). The rest of their time will be spent in and around the Riverwalk and will be staying at the Drury Inn. The trip is during Spring break, which is in March around the 3rd or 4th week. I don't know for sure cause they haven't put up the March activity calander yet, but you can go the school's website and check it, should be posted the first day of March.

    -- Posted by nouveaublogger on Mon, Feb 22, 2010, at 11:14 PM
  • Mr. Crump,

    How about a new poll question? Thanks!

    -- Posted by nouveaublogger on Mon, Feb 22, 2010, at 11:16 PM
  • Slater: Greed.... governments should NOT be the entity that attempts to legislate anti-greed rules. It should be society and which is made up of individuals. UNTIL the individuals as a group decide ON THEIR OWN, to willingly put other people and their feelings on the same level as their own personal feelings, then NOTHING will be solved. No economic set up or governmental rules can EVER legislate this. UNTIL the people realize their power that they have over the government AND their power as consumers to check the corporations, then nothing will change.

    Socialist policies will NEVER change what is happening in our nation.

    -- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 12:48 AM
  • Newsacross.... again, I say this... lets just shut down EVERY corporation and big business.... just shut them down. Because as you liberals keep saying they are just plain evil and serve NO purpose.. Shut them all down. Who needs a person with the wealth to provide start up money for a small business. Who needs a big corporation who provides jobs. THEY ARE ALL EVIL... (rolls eyes)

    -- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 12:50 AM
  • Newsacross.... It does not matter if the small businesses are the backbone of this nation. BIG corporations do provide millions of jobs. BUT you leftists so quickly forget that GE is one of the biggest corporations BUT since they own major leftist media outlets they do not fall into the same class as the big oil or big insurance companies..... (AGAIN rolling eyes)

    -- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 12:52 AM
  • MrXray said this:

    "Slater: Greed.... governments should NOT be the entity that attempts to legislate anti-greed rules. It should be society and which is made up of individuals. UNTIL the individuals as a group decide ON THEIR OWN, to willingly put other people and their feelings on the same level as their own personal feelings, then NOTHING will be solved..."

    ME: MrXray, your thinking is on the same path that Karl Marx was on as he sought his "Utopia." Ideally, if people could pursue the common good in unison, we'd be better off as a nation, but we're well aware of the contrasts between humans, and for that reason we'll always have a need for government regulation in some form. This is the very reason why Marx was deluding himself, but he shouldn't be faulted for his idealism.

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 9:46 AM
  • Cheetah,

    They can also buy:

    Rubber Cement,

    Spray Paint,

    Paint Thinner

    Model Glue, etc, etc, etc.

    This is just another example of government hysteria. Not to mention maybe a new law that can potentially generate revenue. Just look @ Sedalia,

    How many of you even heard of this stuff before they made a huge deal out of this and blew it way out of proportion. Show of hands. Anyone? Hello?

    -- Posted by What the f...... on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 12:51 PM
  • K2 must be perfectly safe. This is posted on a mail-order site --

    "K2****** products are novelty herbal blends and are not for consumption. K2****** and its affiliates are not responsible in any way for misuse of the products and we take no responsibility for damage or bodily harm that might occur from consumption."



    -- Posted by missy08 on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 1:27 PM
  • NB - I got a good laugh from your comment about the teacher's reaction to asking to see the Alamo basement. :)

    Tell the kids the parks (Sea World & Fiesta Texas) are open from 3/12 through 3/21, beginning at 10am and closing as late as 10pm. This schedule generally coincides with spring break in this area.

    While they're hanging around the Riverwalk and looking for something worthwhile to do, suggest that they walk down the street to the Institute of Texan Cultures.

    Thanks for the updates!

    Can't offer any tips on the hotel accommodations but will snoop and see what I can learn for them.

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 6:35 PM
  • Slater,

    They checked the schedules for both parks, I think they are coming around the 24th. Anyway, teach said they were closed during their trip. Will pass along the info about Institute of Texan Cultures, that sounds interesting! They might already have a list of suggestions, as she told me the Superintedent is from that area. He told them about the beach. Maybe he's coming with them.....you should drop by the Inn and say hello!

    -- Posted by nouveaublogger on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 6:51 PM
  • Slater,

    p.s.....teach said she has lived her entire life in Slater, maybe she knows you.

    -- Posted by nouveaublogger on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 6:53 PM
  • NB - sounds as if their superintendent will have things under control, being from this area. However, I expect that (s)he'll see a few things new.

    Speaking of the Institute of Texan Cultures, I believe it currently has on loan from the Smithsonian Institution an exhibition of Mexican art. If you ever come to San Antonio, I'd hope you'd be able to have a look in there.

    As to the teacher knowing me, she'd have to be nearly the age of dirt. (heh heh) Well, as you know, it's a small town and anything's possible. What's her last name?

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 7:11 PM
  • Slater,

    Don't know her maiden name, married name is Jacobsen.

    -- Posted by nouveaublogger on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 7:39 PM
  • Don't recognize that name, NB, but I most likely would know her family.

    My class trip was to Washington, DC, and was it ever fun! The class behind mine was squabbling about where to go (they were arguing about Colorado vs New Orleans). Then-principal George Kendrick (little Hitler) told them, "The way I see it, you have three choices. You can go to Colorado, you can go to New Orleans, or you can go to Saline City." He always thought he was a comedian.

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 7:58 PM
  • LOL, Saline City, huh? My daughter asked me if I would send her to Paris for a graduation present...I told her sure, then I gave her some gas money and showed her the road map to Paris, MO. :P. I got one of those Ah, Moooooommmmmm's, my kids are so famous for!

    -- Posted by nouveaublogger on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 8:34 PM
  • My class didn't get a senior trip, a few years before ours, class of '69' didn't behave very well...so class trips were out of the question for quite a few years. Oh boy...the 60s & 70's. Was wild, was it not?

    -- Posted by nouveaublogger on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 8:37 PM
  • No trip, eh? :( Shame on that '69 class for wrecking your fun!

    Yep, I noticed a pretty big attitude shift from my high school days to my college days which began after a hitch in the Army. By the '70s it seemed as if the piqued senses of the '60s had given in to the traditional view of what constituted a more responsible adulthood. At least that's the way it was for me and many of my friends.

    -- Posted by Slater on Tue, Feb 23, 2010, at 10:23 PM
  • We don't need a public option and this whole health care bill is not about better health care it is about control. It tells we the people are too stupid to make decisions for ourselves but those in the government are smart so they need to make decisions for us. Health care may need reform but this is not the one we need nor can we afford it.

    Liberal policies for the last 40 years have brought us to the financial mess we are in now.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Feb 24, 2010, at 6:10 AM
  • Is the dog in the ad for Lighthouse Shelter available for adoption?

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Wed, Feb 24, 2010, at 9:58 AM
    Response by Jessica Wise:
    Isn't he cute? Unfortunately, it's a stock photo.
  • HDD,

    Funny you should mention Darwin. An article in Wall Street Journal 2/23/10 titled "Obesity? Big Feet? Blame Darwin." is informative. (Personal Journal section front page)

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Wed, Feb 24, 2010, at 10:07 AM
  • rr3,

    A few months back I posted a link to the federal bedget department's archive of deficit spending since 1948. If you care to have a look you'll see that during every Republican presidency deficit spending increased, and during every Democratic presidency (except for LBJ maintaining the Vietnam conflict) the deficit was reduced, substantially in most cases.

    It puzzles me how the GOP can claim to be the "party of fiscal responsibility" when historically it's spent more than the Democrats, culminating in the record spending during the Bush Jr. reign.

    My brother voted for "Dubya" in 2000, and I told him at that time - based on Bush's fiscal irresponsibility while governor of Texas - that the country would be fortunate if it survived his lack of money management skill. When he became governor of TX there was a $400 million surplus in the state treasury, and when he moved to Washington, he left behind an $8 BILLION deficit.

    So much for GOP fiscal responsibility.

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 24, 2010, at 10:32 AM
  • Could someone please tell me when the Democrat News is ever going to put in the paper the pictures and story from the Blue and Gold banquet for the Boy Scouts that was on Feb.15th. This is scouting's 100th year and it would really be great to see those pics in there--not just the ones submitted by other people that ran in the Feb3rd paper. Scouting is such a great thing for boys now days. Let's reconize the great achivements of our boys.

    -- Posted by old&cranky on Wed, Feb 24, 2010, at 1:27 PM
  • I said this:

    "...the federal bedget department's..."

    Is a "bedget" a kind of widget, or could it be a type of badge?

    Humphrey Bogart: "Show me your badge."

    Alfonso Bedoya: "I don't got no badge. We don't got no badges! WE DON'T NEED NO STINKIN' BADGES!!"

    Proofreading is not my strong suit, obviously (nor is comedy, you would add). :)

    -- Posted by Slater on Wed, Feb 24, 2010, at 2:55 PM
  • The Lighthouse feller looks as if he hasn't had a decent meal for sometime. He won my heart. Adopting another would be difficult, since I have an alpha dog, inherited when grandson #4 left for college.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Wed, Feb 24, 2010, at 7:34 PM
  • I stated liberal policies have gotten us into this mess I didn't attach that comment to a particular party because they have come from both sides of the aisle. It boils down to out of control spending.

    It will be hard to starve the pig when we have so many feeding at the trough. We need to make the trough smaller.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Feb 24, 2010, at 9:22 PM
  • Alright rr3 I'll bite who are those liberal Republicans? I thought that any that could even remotely claim that title were long dead.

    Another question for you: based strictly on his words as recorded in the Bible was Jesus a liberal? If not, which of his words dissuade you of that notion?

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 12:05 AM
  • From Jim Hightower's column: Since the thirteenth amendment bans slavery, which is the ownership of a person, the newly born corporate "persons" can not legally be bought, and sold. Thus Wall Street--now a slave market must be shut down! Let us all join hands and march for this new civil rights cause, chanting, "Free the Corporate Slaves". http://www.creators.com/opinion/jim-hightower/fighting-the-subversion-of-our-peo...

    Yes it is a stretch, but no more preposterous than the act of the five "Justices" who committed the treasonous act that evoked the comment.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 12:54 AM
  • Senators Dodd, and Udall have introduced legislation leading to a constitutional amendment to overturn the Supreme Court decision allowing our elections to be controlled by unfettered corporate money.

    My first question to any candidate for the United States Senate would be whether, or not that candidate supports such a constitutional amendment. If not that candidate is a corporatist, and not deserving of the vote of a human whether Republican, Democrat, or otherwise.


    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 1:07 AM
  • Finally (TG you say)...read what Warren Buffet's partner has to say about where we are going. This one will, or should scare the Bejeesus out of you. http://www.marketwatch.com/story/death-of-us-capitalism-the-final-10-scenes-2010...

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 1:38 AM
  • The link in the comment below this one takes you to page two of the "Wall Street Journal" "Market Watch" article. This link takes you to page one which is more convenient though I doubt that anyone with the smarts to desire to read it would have any trouble establishing that there was a preceding page. ;) http://www.marketwatch.com/story/death-of-us-capitalism-the-final-10-scenes-2010...

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 1:57 AM
  • You think Jesus was a liberal? Really

    That was pulled out of thin air.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 6:52 AM
  • Jesus a liberal? Why not? Google "Was Jesus a communist?" and you'll find a wealth of utterly bogus information about Jesus as a liberal, a socialist, a communist, a Muslim...you name it, someone's asserted it.

    We know only one thing for certain about Jesus - he was a Jew. Everything else is just speculation.

    -- Posted by Miss Marple on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 7:39 AM
  • I suppose I confused you rr3. You answered a question I did not ask, and failed to answer the two I did ask. Would you like to try again?

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 11:17 AM
  • Thank you MissMarple for engaging in the discussion. I think that the central message of Jesus, the universal one, love each other, give of yourself to others as you recognize their needs, is so strong that it is appropriated by all manner of religions, political systems, and philosophies.

    Whether that is bogus, or not is another question. Following your line of thinking one might ask the question whether, or not the Jesus message is bogus since that message was a tenant of other's message before Jesus.

    Could it be an a priori message? One that springs from human instinctual altruism, an early survival mechanism?

    My apology to you for being question rich, and answer poor. Cain't hep it. Watcha think?

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 11:52 AM
  • I KNEW I wasn't crazy... I am trying to watch this but the endless examples of heartache are not solving the problems.....



    -- Posted by missy08 on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 1:44 PM
  • Missy, the video snip epitomizes a major problem with our government, in my opinion. I wonder how many of the 55 minutes were wasted, like this example shows.

    One party blabbing while the other pouts.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 3:18 PM
  • OK Reader, I see that I sent something of a mixed message.

    In my heart of hearts, I know the message that Jesus brings (and is/was brought by many others both before and after him) is a very simple one. It's so simple, in fact, that it gets lost in the all the rhetoric and all the artificial rules humans can't help imposing.

    It doesn't get any simpler than "Love thy neighbor as thyself." Keep that in the forefront and everything else gets pretty simple, too, doesn't it?

    Making war on your neighbor isn't loving him. Stealing from your neighbor isn't loving him. Cruelty in any form to your neighbor isn't loving him. Taking his food, his oil, his anything, especially by cheating him, isn't loving him.

    I could go on but it gets kinda boring. It's the KISS principle in action. "Keep It Simple, Stupid."

    Love thy neighbor as thyself.

    -- Posted by Miss Marple on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 3:42 PM
  • Slater,

    I didn't watch the video, but was trying to watch the discussion. It seemed like the Democrats were citing example after example of hardluck stories. I am not trying to make light of them. I know there are sad situations out there. But, that doesn't "fix" the problem. Let's get on with the solution. When the Republicans would talk, they were told to limit their comments.

    So frustrating!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 4:25 PM
  • I agree, Missy. The rules of exchange needed to be better defined. Yes, it's sad about the plight of many people, but if the content is only testimonial in nature, that doesn't do much for solving the problems.

    I'm for taking that moronic "political etiquette" book and tossing it in the stove.

    All the more reason for rebellion.

    Right Jo?

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 4:41 PM
  • okr I will try to keep this simple I never mentioned any liberal republican you did and you asking if Jesus was a liberal came out of left field. You did not state why you feel like he is a liberal so I don't know how to answer your question. Be specific and I will be also. Thank you.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 5:25 PM
  • Recommended reading: This week's New Yorker has a long profile of Paul Krugman. Available on line as well.

    From today's New York Times, an article talks about Goldman-Sachs efforts to prop up Greece. "Greece has suffered from large deficits for years, and until now it seemed as if big banks would always be there to bail it out. As far back as 2000 and 2001, Goldman helped Athens quietly borrow billions to mask its poor finances by creating derivatives that essentially transformed loans into currency trades that Greece did not have to disclose under European rules."

    Has anyone read Paulsen's book?

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 8:55 PM
  • Tonight I was sifting through a few videos on the weird universe site and decided to post these two "music" videos which I think are a little unusual:

    Video.avi - This one is performed by a group of finches:


    video-1.avi - This one features a jam session using the Theremin, the instrument that made all those eerie sounds in the old science fiction and horror movies:


    I converted the originals to avi format and uploaded them to a web hosting service, so, if you want to be entertained by them, these links will take you directly to the download page. :)

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 10:23 PM
  • The finch video - I needed to be more descriptive and say the finches make their music by "playing" electric guitars.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 10:28 PM
  • Ah yes. Third Man theme. Joseph Cotton starred?

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 10:31 PM
  • Yep. Joseph Cotton, Orson Welles, and other notables.

    -- Posted by Slater on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 10:47 PM
  • Yes Slater , Political Etiquette makes you a you little sick after a while! You know, i think they should go back to Duelling. It would stop a lot of this Lying. People are wondering why our Kid's are cheaters,liar,s ,thieves,rebelious. Maybe they could look at our Leader's in Washington, that could be part of it! the more i read about our Political System the more i want to join News Across in Australia! ha

    -- Posted by Jo on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 11:27 PM
  • "okr I will try to keep this simple I never mentioned any liberal republican you did and you asking if Jesus was a liberal came out of left field. You did not state why you feel like he is a liberal so I don't know how to answer your question. Be specific and I will be also. Thank you." Thank you rr3 for continuing the conversation.

    Your words that stimulated my primary question were: "I stated liberal policies have gotten us into this mess I didn't attach that comment to a particular party because they have come from both sides of the aisle." So you did state that liberal policies have come from both sides of the aisle. Using the "if it walks like a duck" line of reasoning those on the other side of the aisle would also be liberals. My question remains. Who?

    Now I know that some conservatives love to throw out the word liberal as an invective, when another word not tied to a particular political persuasion would have better suited. I didn't think you were that way, that you were more into economic debate than labeling. Hence my question remains.

    If you were really saying that both Republicans, and Democrats have been spendthrifts, both liberals, and conservatives have bankrupted our nation that is all well, and good. Still, if that is the case I don't know why you tossed in the word liberal. That confuses the issue. See what I mean?

    This is getting too long, and it is late. I will address the "Jesus" part another time.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 11:36 PM
  • Howdy Jo, howdy Slater. I'm wore slick. See y'all later.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Feb 25, 2010, at 11:51 PM
  • okr I was referring to the word liberal as lenient. Lenient spending policies has got us into this mess.

    But while researching liberal vs. conservative I came across this site that ranks the Senate and the House members as to how they vote. Just interesting not gospel.


    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Fri, Feb 26, 2010, at 8:53 PM
  • rr3, interesting and thought-provoking link. Thanks for posting it.

    -- Posted by Slater on Fri, Feb 26, 2010, at 9:50 PM
  • Jo, I like your suggestion about bringing back dueling.

    -- Posted by Slater on Fri, Feb 26, 2010, at 9:54 PM
  • NanaDot: to your robber baron comment....

    So, if as you try to claim capitalism is bad and evile, you seem to willingly ignore the SOCIALIST policy of the LIBERAL LEFT that tried to force the idea that ALL people have the right to home ownership led to the destruction of our economy by the mechanism of the DEMOCRAT policy initiated by Carter and pushed hard by Clinton and updated by leading Democrats. Local banks were coerced and boycotted and harassed by ACORN and the like all in the name of forcing the banks to make risky loans to people who could not afford a traditional home loan so ARMS and other harmful loans were 'made up' and provided to the people who could not nor should not own their own home. THEN when the Repubs and other economists warned of the dire economic risk that would involve our entire economy those same Dems called them fear mongerers.... I agree that unfettered capitalism is harmful, but no more harmful than the liberal agenda and a big government that takes away freedoms and liberties.

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Feb 27, 2010, at 1:36 AM
  • Here is a link that is likely to be enjoyed by those that are not concerned about staying up late, nor getting to church on Sunday morning.


    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sat, Feb 27, 2010, at 2:02 AM
  • sorry I was slow to this part of the thread....

    If a Taliban militant/terrorist is captured and is to be granted protection under a UN treaty, does this not imply that the taliban militant/terrorist would have to be a representative or solider of some specific nation?

    If this is true, then someone would have to use some inventive mechanisms of logic to argue that the taliban are fighting for a specific government or nation, especially since they are NOT representing Pakistan or Afghanistan.

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Feb 27, 2010, at 2:05 AM
  • I would be interested in seeing what you all write about Jesus being liberal or conservative... would make for an interesting conversatino to watch.

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Feb 27, 2010, at 2:17 AM
  • Any opinions on SNAP?? Trying to decide on there or the Y. But I've heard weird things about SNAP...

    Just curious

    -- Posted by valleygirl01 on Sat, Feb 27, 2010, at 5:59 AM
  • In Smithfield, NC an evangelist and pastor has opened a gun shop. His wife dreamt that God told her to name it after the Second Amendment - the constitutional right to bear arms - but to call it the Second Amen-ment Gun Shop.

    When her husband is not preaching, he can be found at the shooting range with his son, Blake, who manages the new store.

    He was quoted as saying, "A lot of people make fun of me - a Bible in one hand, a .44 in the other," Eddie Jordan said. "I sort of turned a hobby into a business."

    "One comment: 'What or who would Jesus shoot?'"

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Sat, Feb 27, 2010, at 9:27 AM
  • Jesus had/has powers that us mere mortals don't have. He could/does accomplish things that we can't. So, I doubt that Jesus would shoot anything or anybody. But, I don't know.....

    Have a great day!

    The sun is shining!!!


    -- Posted by missy08 on Sat, Feb 27, 2010, at 10:34 AM
  • I liked SNAP. Mostly because I keep some wierd hours, and the 24-hour part was awesome. I liked having the place to my self. I didn't have to share the tv's or the radio! Only reason I dropped my membership was that I got out of the habit of going.

    -- Posted by thebirdman on Sat, Feb 27, 2010, at 11:38 AM
  • upsedaisy.... Not sure of the purpose of your posting of that story about the preacher/gun store owner or the comment you made at the end.

    Why is it that YOU make the assumption that this preacher/gun store owner is going to shoot somebody or something? OR are you suggesting that guns are bad somehow and should be banned? lol

    -- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Feb 27, 2010, at 5:35 PM
  • I posted the article about the minister and his gun store, since there has been a discussion on whether Jesus was liberal or conservative. NA had this morning commented that Jesus flouted Judaic rules and might have been "shot" by a "loan" assassin.

    Of course, guns hadn't been invented 2010 years ago. The quotes on "loan" are NA's. Perhaps referencing the frequency w/which guns are purchased at pawnshops.

    The comment at the end was not mine, but by a poster. I thought it was food for thought.

    I own a gun. I allow bow hunting on my acreage, which is inside town limits, so guns are prohibited.

    We need more careful screening and waiting periods. Thirtytwo students killed at VA Tech, the murders at Ft. Hood, Columbine, all by unhinged individuals.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Sat, Feb 27, 2010, at 8:19 PM
  • NA,

    No disagreement w/your views. X-Ray asked why I had posted the article. It was prompted by the debate over Jesus. The comment at the end was by someone else and I put it in quotes to indicate that.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Sat, Feb 27, 2010, at 8:42 PM
  • Back in the day we used to keep shotguns, and rifles in the car trunks in the school parking lot. Not so many drove pickups back then. We would hunt before, and after school. I don't recall anyone ever having a pistol in their car. We also carried pocket knives, many of which would be considered lethal weapons today. There was never a problem to my knowlege.

    Times have changed as has available weaponry. Not wanting to be cynical, but unable to help it I suspect that Glocks, and AK-47s might be the weapons of choice today, even in rural America.

    Times change, and with that a pragmatic response demands change that assures that our youth don't kill each other.

    Yet it saddens me that the youth of today don't have the same freedoms we enjoyed.

    It makes me think that if only the same weapons were available today, that were practically attainable by us, such sport could still be enjoyed on school days. It was great fun to go duck hunt on the river at the crack of dawn.

    Thank you arms industry for shutting down the fun. Sure a kid can get his hands on a Glock, but what practical use is it? That possibility has curtailed the relatively innocent sporting of a lot of kids. Bet you can't even have a tackle box in your trunk with a filet knife present.

    Would that be true if there was not a proliferation of available fire arms with the primary purpose of manufacture being to kill people?

    So, we scream for liberty, for the right to bear arms of our choice not realizing that to do so we must give up other liberties. There are no free lunches. It seems paradoxically ironic to me.

    -- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Feb 28, 2010, at 12:56 AM
  • news

    NEWS QUOTE:Judging by what the Bible says, the mainstream, average Jew of that time would have likely regarded Jesus as blasphemous and Anti-Jewish Religious Law.

    If you believe the bible you don't judge it. It is a literal document that has only one interpretation but can have several applications. I may conclude that it has to be taken in context we can't pluck a scripture or quote out of the bible and say it means something that it doesn't.

    NEWS QUOTE:here is no question that he regularly violated God's Laws for the Jews as given by God to the Prophet Leviticus. Jesus turning the tables in the Temple, and his failure to follow or observe many of the Jewish religious Holidays, were all reasons to stone him to death under their law.

    Jesus did not come to abolish the law but to fulfill it.


    As for the prophet Leviticus please share because I have overlooked or missed any information on him.

    NEWS QUOTE:In fact, I believe if the mainstream Christian establishment had Jesus walking around contradicting them, braking the rules of the faith, and accusing the Christian establishment of heresy...as he did the Jewish establishment of his day...he probably would juat happen to be shot by some "loan" assassin...by coincidence.

    You may be right about that.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Feb 28, 2010, at 1:25 AM
  • I made a big part of my living carrying a Gun, and still do! I have nothing against Gun's, but i do have a problem with the people who steals Guns, and uses them on innocent people! White Tornado: Hope everything's ok with you, my friend!

    -- Posted by Jo on Sun, Feb 28, 2010, at 1:31 AM
  • White Tornado, Jo is right. It has been a long time since you posted.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Sun, Feb 28, 2010, at 9:38 AM
  • news


    The moneychangers were in violation of God's law because they were using the house of God for their own personal gain. God is angry when we sin and demonstrated this through Jesus.

    I am not sure if you are speaking about the people wanting to stone Jesus or the woman who committed adultery. To reference the woman that committed adultery Jesus asked those without sin to cast the first stone and they all departed leaving only Jesus and the woman. Since no one was there to condemn her then Jesus said he would not condemn her either and to go forth and sin no more.

    Jesus statement did not stop them from stoning her it was their own sin that convicted them that they were just as guilty as the woman.

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Feb 28, 2010, at 10:56 AM
  • notgvnasht

    Why do you believe that?

    -- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Feb 28, 2010, at 4:46 PM
  • Watching the closing ceremonies of the Olympics: Was anyone else reminded of "The Prisoner" when the promotion piece for the 2014 winter Olympics in Russia had people in bubbles? "The Prisoner" would always be recaptured by a bubble, when he attempted an escape.

    -- Posted by upsedaisy on Sun, Feb 28, 2010, at 10:31 PM
  • Newsacross.... that was a pretty pathetic attempt to disparage right wingers as some how being militant and all of them members of some militia and therefore right wingers are dangerous... sounds like you have been reading and absorbing the Pelosi propaganda rather well.

    -- Posted by mrxray on Mon, Mar 1, 2010, at 4:45 AM
  • OKR... get a grip. Making gun ownership EVEN more restrictive will never make guns less available. If a crazy person wants to take out a bunch of people he or she does NOT need a gun. They can just make some sort of bomb or posion the water supply or whatever other demented means they come up with. The fallacy of this type of argument comes when you try to say that you can legislate common sense or that some how a law will stop people from killing each other.

    -- Posted by mrxray on Mon, Mar 1, 2010, at 4:49 AM
  • If memory serves, Jesus overturned the tables in the temple out of righteous anger at the distortion and opression of the poor by selling the sacrificial animals at a profit and the house of the Lord was not to be used for financial gain of the individual money changers.

    It had nothing to do with IF the money changers were supposed to be there or not, but all to do with the corruption of taking from the poor to pad their own pockets by charging higher than necessary prices when in fact the endeavor was to allow ALL people to worship and offer sacrifices regardless of how rich or poor they were....

    STILL interested in hearing how you try to claim that Jesus was liberal or conservative... lol

    -- Posted by mrxray on Mon, Mar 1, 2010, at 4:58 AM
  • "The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money."

    -- Alexis de Tocqueville

    -- Posted by mrxray on Mon, Mar 1, 2010, at 4:58 AM
  • I can't speak to the fact of whether Jesus was a liberal or conserverative or to wheter or not this is to be considered based on our current definition of either. I will say that organized religion, any and all of them are a business. Nothing more, nothing less.

    -- Posted by What the f...... on Mon, Mar 1, 2010, at 5:52 AM
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