[Masthead] Overcast ~ 50°F  
High: 60°F ~ Low: 50°F
Monday, May 2, 2016

Speak Out [politics] December 22, 2010, to January 31, 2011

Wednesday, December 22, 2010

This forum is for discussing political issues -- local, state, national or international. The same standards of behavior apply as are spelled out on our home page in the introduction to Speak Out.

Post a comment

Note: The nature of the Internet makes it impractical for our staff to review every comment. If you feel that a comment is offensive, please Login or Create an account first, and then you will be able to flag a comment as objectionable. Please also note that those who post comments on marshallnews.com may do so using a screen name, which may or may not reflect a website user's actual name. Readers should be careful not to assign comments to real people who may have names similar to screen names. Refrain from obscenity in your comments, and to keep discussions civil, don't say anything in a way your grandmother would be ashamed to read.

The movement against the Koch brothers and the wealthy trying to influence elections is starting up. Lets quarantine the Koch Brothers and the Supreme Court political activists and give the power back to the people.


-- Posted by cheesehead on Mon, Jan 31, 2011, at 10:01 PM

Forgive me, I turned to speak to my wife who had given me the book for Christmas, and cut short the identification, forgetting to tell you that the author is Norm Ledgin. My apologies.

I hope that your local library has a copy.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Jan 30, 2011, at 9:28 PM

As Jefferson seems to be the founding father that is most quoted on this blog, and more to that point the only such source that is regularly quoted by left, and right I thought I might give you a heads up why that may be so.

I have recently read a book entitled "Diagnosing Jefferson", "Evidence of a Condition that Guided His Beliefs, Behavior, and Personal Associations" which provides a compelling argument as to why so many of disparate views treasure the statements of this founding giant. I must say that left me with some "ah, I see" moments. Rated AFAPP (acceptable for all political persuasions).

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Jan 30, 2011, at 9:16 PM


Obama care and the MILLIONS of people who get waivers so they dont have to participate in this debacle... UNIONS and supporters of obama... to name a bunch.

Then there is the info that HHS Sec Sebilius hid from public consumption until after the vote on Obamacare that was from the Chief Actuary of Medicare and Medicaid saying that Obamacare would cost 311 BILLION more than promised and that 14 MILLION people would be displaced from their CURRENT, affordable insurance plans that the people were happy with.

Gotta love Obama's idea of transparency and honesty and open debate

-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jan 30, 2011, at 8:46 PM


The "Goverment big enough to supply everything you need" quote is probably not Jefferson. Some think it was Gerald Ford:


"Democracy will cease to exist" may be a paraphrase of Jefferson but there doesn't seem to be any record he used these words:


Likewise the "most bad government" quote.


-- Posted by taxedpayer on Sun, Jan 30, 2011, at 7:20 PM

Paul Harvey gave this speech in 1960 or 1961... it is long and but it is relevant as it discusses how nations in history have failed and been overtaken by other throughout history... like our history.


We are at the tipping point of becoming a failed nation because we are too lazy as a society to do the hard work it takes to be individually responsible and it is easier to attempt to have the government take care of all our needs and wants and much easier to blame someone else for our failings and much easier to blame the rich guy or the big businesses instead of doing the hard work and making the smart but tough choice. And as most people with any type of logic understand, when you take from someone to give to someone else, you are taking away the incentive to work hard because why bother working hard if they are going to keep taking more and more and more away from those that do work to give to those who do not work nor want to work.

Sure life sucks, and life is unfair and it would be wonderful to life in "Theoretical world" where all people got along and all people worked equally hard and all things were shared, like some hippie, pot-head utopian dream but life is not like that. Nothing in life guarantees that each person has the right to equal reward because not all people have the same abilities, nor the same intellect and each person has to use what they have to the best of their abilities, instead of looking for someone else to pay their way and instead of having the evil rich guy and the evil big corporation as the scape goat for your individual failings. And when you use the government to take from the rich and give to the poor, this is NOT charity but coercion and it builds resentment and it creates an atmosphere where people dont want to work hard if they are penalized by having more and more of their earnings removed by coercion.

-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jan 30, 2011, at 7:06 PM

News Just for you.. a source for one and a bunch more for you to look up for yourself.. LOL

Thomas Jefferson, letter to Shelton Gilliam, June 19, 1808

Still one thing more, fellow-citizens--a wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government, and this is necessary to close the circle of our felicities. First Inaugural Address, March 4, 1801 (NOTE Felicities means happiness)

The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not. -Thomas Jefferson

Most bad government has grown out of too much government.-Thomas Jefferson

What country can preserve its liberties if its rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance?-Thomas Jeff (One of my personal favorites...yeah you will say it is because I am a racist radical right winger)

I think myself that we have more machinery of government than is necessary, too many parasites living on the labor of the industrious.-Thomas Jefferson

Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have ... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases.

-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jan 30, 2011, at 6:56 PM

lol News... feel free to search for the quotes yourself and read for yourself the context... LOL

Here is another quote... anyone tell me who stated it?

What matters is to emphasize the fundamental idea in my party's economic program clearly--the idea of authority. I want the authority. I want everyone to keep the property he has acquired himself according to the principle: benefit to the community precedes benefit to the individual But the state should retain supervision and each property owner should consider himself appointed by the state. It is his duty not to use his property against the interest of others among his people. This is the crucial matter. The "government" will always retain its right to control the owners of property.?

The word "government" I changed so I would not give away the person who stated this

-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jan 30, 2011, at 5:41 PM

news across,

Here's a source I found that gives more context to the quote:


-- Posted by taxedpayer on Sun, Jan 30, 2011, at 9:29 AM

But news forcing alternative energy upon us will only drive up the cost. Is alternative energy always better?

Electric Cars--How Much Does It Cost per Charge


Who in their right mind would buy a $40,000+ electric vehicle that only goes 40 miles per charge and cost more to operate? Why not utilize our current energy resources to be more efficient? Look at what we have done with cars from the 70,s to today. In California we have 4 times as many cars today and produce less than half the pollution. What's wrong with that? Oh and they found out long ago that it is not fossil fuel. If it was we would have ran out a long time ago. Why do you think God give us oil, coal, natural gas, etc. to use?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Jan 30, 2011, at 8:56 AM

So say you xray

Where are the citations...I would like to read Jefferson in context, thank you very much.

-- Posted by news across on Sun, Jan 30, 2011, at 8:44 AM

Thomas Jefferson observed:

To take from one, because it is thought that his own industry and that of his fathers has acquired too much, in order to spare to others, who, or whose fathers, have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, the guarantee to every one a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it.

And James Madison:

That is not a just government, nor is property secure under it, where the property which a man has in his personal safety and personal liberty, is violated by arbitrary seizures of one class of citizens for the service of the rest.

And Samuel Adams:

The Utopian schemes of leveling, and a community of goods, are as visionary and impractical, as those which vest all property in the Crown, are arbitrary, despotic, and in our government unconstitutional.

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 29, 2011, at 10:54 PM


I think all Americans share your concerns about our dependency on oil from multi-national oil companies -- which is all of them. That is who sells us our oil no matter what part of the World the oil was pumped from.

May I suggest that a vast investment of money, labor, and other resources be prioritized as top-of-the list for Federal Spending in the field of alternative fuels and public transportation. Such an investment of our tax dollars would reap a tremendous yield in terms of a pollution free, modern energy system no longer dependent upon fossil fuels. In addition, such a program could put to work many of the unemployed and jump-start the economy utilizing the Federal Spending Multiplier. The end result would be a boom of job creation in the private sector and new, increased consumption of durable goods, resulting in new sales growth in almost every market.

In addition, the entire investment could be paid out of the current military budget. We simply end our empire building, bring all our troops home from overseas, and move those ressources into our National push to establish a new alternative energy industry -- which may include new nuclear power plants (if they can be proven to be 100% safe under all conditions and a safe place to store the spent rods can be found), large solar farms, wind farms, river damns which don't adversely affect the environment, hydrogen cell technology, ect.

This approach would help solve our common concerns about our dependence on oil from multi-national oil companies and protect our environment and all while creating new jubs and new demand for goods and services which creates even more jobs, so on and so forth.

Alternative energy may very well be the answer our Nation is searching for mate.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 29, 2011, at 9:48 PM

I really hadn't give it much thought because of be busy with other things. I can see something like this coming to America, I'm just not sure what will cause it. One thing that could do it is our "No drill depend on foreign oil policy" because demand for energy is only going up and if we don't do what we can to increase supply then in the near future we may spend all we make just to survive. That means the end to discretionary spending and I think devastating to our economy. Are these uprisings really about being rich or poor? Or freedom?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sat, Jan 29, 2011, at 8:59 PM

Hey rr,

What do you think of the events in Tunisia and Egypt?

I think these may be signs of a crumbling empire. The World is a smaller place these days and perhaps the World's poor refuse to be shut out of the benefits of their societies by the very rich.

It would seem if nothing else, these Peoples' uprisings may be the signs of times to come in many places. No Party or individual can rule any Nation with out the consent of the masses -- and those masses in Egypt and Tunisia are all dirt-poor people. I really do wish the captialists would do a count of the Worlds' poor relative to the number of rich and middle class World-wide sometime.

Have you any thoughts on this buddy?

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 29, 2011, at 8:22 PM

I'm glad you liked it news and don't worry no offense taken.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sat, Jan 29, 2011, at 8:06 PM

Yeah WTF,

I never really understood the term "Pinko." I guess it is supposed to mean we progressives are "communist-light" lol lol lol...we aren't communists but the right wing sure want folks to think we are.

I like these oldy but goody terms, but I do have to admit "bleeding heart liberal" was my favorite.

rr's use of that expression was the only thing I could mention regarding his comment. I like rr and I didn't want to attack his argument because I didn't want to offend him lol lol lol...but doggone it, I had to say something about his comment lol lol lol...and that old expression had me laughing.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 29, 2011, at 4:19 PM


Don't forget "pinko".

-- Posted by What the f...... on Sat, Jan 29, 2011, at 11:54 AM


I noticed in your comment you used the expression "bleeding heart liberals." Lol...now there is an oldy but a goody...lol lol lol. I hadn't heard that expression used in a long time.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 29, 2011, at 3:40 AM

The Filibuster Is Preserved - Progressives Lose


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Fri, Jan 28, 2011, at 6:58 AM

Has an Obama Executive Order Put Federal Agencies Into Union Bosses' Hands?


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Fri, Jan 28, 2011, at 6:57 AM

One reason is that they are not taught to work when they are young. But they are indoctrinated by our public educational system to be a burden to society.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Fri, Jan 28, 2011, at 6:27 AM

I think you missed the whole point of this Nana. Why should child labor laws be so restrictive that the parent or grandparent becomes a criminal just for letting them work? Then we have the unions that will fight tooth and nail to get a job back for an employee that has been fired because they are worthless. Even if they should have been fired the union will never admit it. What happened to people taking pride in giving a fair days work for a fair days wage?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Fri, Jan 28, 2011, at 6:23 AM

The now notorious and apparently crazy liberal group ACORN was actually a black ops front organization, devised during the Nixon era to discredit the Left. Its greatest victory came in 2009 when conservative activists videoed ACORN employees advising on how best to run a child-prostitution ring while avoiding taxes. You don't think even a left-wing, "social justice" organization could be that dumb, do you? It was all part of the plan. The CIA's plan.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 27, 2011, at 11:11 PM

News I agree that America will fall from not only lack of faith in Washington but lack of faith period.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 27, 2011, at 11:06 PM

News why should someone that would employ a minor child be a criminal? There are lot of menial jobs that young teenagers are perfectly capable of doing especially on the farm. Cleaning out the barn, hog house, chicken house or helping in the garden or mowing the grass. Are you saying that is criminal?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 27, 2011, at 11:01 PM

News the mistake that has been made is when did we give the state the ultimate authority over our children? As parents we should have that. Someone letting their child or grandchild help with the family business is nobody's business unless they are abusing them. When I was a youngster my parents had the authority to whip my butt and gave the bus driver and school officials to do the same it I got out of line. Adults didn't abuse the privilege and guess what it didn't hurt us. Those of us that got disciplined didn't turn into bleeding heart liberals either! It shouldn't be illegal for a child to work. When I was 12-13 years old I worked 8-10 hours a day in the summer by choice because I wanted to make money. I cut weeds out of beans, hauled hay and mowed 12-13 yards. Used a push mower on all of the yards and some took 2-3 hours to mow. I didn't necessarily like it but now as an adult I don't mind work. As long as I am able to work I will not sit around and let the taxpayer support me.


One more question when did we have child sweat shops in America to prevent? Seems a law was made for a problem we didn't have.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 27, 2011, at 10:56 PM


The State has the ultimate authority regarding the welfare of all children.

The mistake was not on the part of the person who reported the violation of the law (the messenger) but rather the error belongs to the criminal who decided to make a profit by violating our laws.

Criminals who employ minor children in any form of labor are in direct violation of the law and they belong in prison.

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Jan 27, 2011, at 4:39 PM

"Exclusive: 'US empire' will fall due to lack of faith, not finances or war, author warns"


-- Posted by news across on Thu, Jan 27, 2011, at 4:30 PM

Without a minimum wage we could put some of these kids to work instead of sitting in front of a video game. Oh and repeal the child labor laws so they can work. One of our local businesses got in trouble because his grandson was helping him. Seems someone not minding their own business thought they knew what was better for his grandson then he did. You know it doesn't hurt us to work a low paying job 10-12 hours a day so we know what it is like. We don't have to stay there. Some jobs don't get done because they aren't worth paying minimum wage. Have you owned a business and had employees? You would have a different perspective if you had. Maybe. Maybe not. I answered your question Nana maybe you didn't understand the answer.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 27, 2011, at 2:32 PM

"I placed the economy among the first and most important virtues, and public debt as the greatest of dangers to be feared. To preserve our independence, we must not let our rulers load us with perpetual debt. If we run into such debts we must be taxed in our meat and drink in our necessities and in our comforts in our labor and in our amusements. If we can prevent the government from wasting the labor of the people, under the pretense of caring for them, they will be happy." Thomas Jefferson

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 27, 2011, at 10:31 AM

Obama's Clueless Energy Policy

The government can't fix this it happens in the private sector.


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 27, 2011, at 6:09 AM

I wonder exactly how we as a nation "invest" when we have NO CAPITAL, no REAL MONEY to invest with... sounds like a borrow borrow, borrow, and print imaginary money stimulus plan that Obama was talking about in his speech

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 27, 2011, at 6:07 AM

The US has a National Emergency Broadcast network where they can take over the TV and radio waves for an emergency. Why not use the same system to have our live political debates on a few set days with NO national media people conducting interviews with questions that the candidates can review? Why not make it completely and totally spontaeous, an event that prevents the candidates from having any knowledge of the questions being asked? This could occur at state and local levels as well. There is no need for the dog and pony show we currently have, nor the billions of dollars that are being spent on TV ads. I also agree that you should have an election day holiday. I think it should be posted in the local papers in weeks following the elections and they should name the NON-voters. maybe seeing their names in the paper for not voting would be peer pressure for future votes... lol

But the whole concept that dollars equals votes is stupid. BUT WE the People have allowed the government and corporations and special interest groups to gain the power they have because of our long history of apathy towards elections an our government, we dont hold them accountable at a local and state level, at least we have not in years past.

I am finding it interestint the ways in which states are fighting back against this current Admin's desire to control more and more of our freedoms and rights and choices and decisions

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 27, 2011, at 6:01 AM

Nanadot... I actually agree with you about big corporations having only an allegiance to their selves and to making profit. The FIRST person that should get out of any sort of political position is the newly appointed GE CEO, Jeff Immelt. He and GE have been getting tons of specific inside deals for green energy and for deals over seas every since Obama got elected and now he REALLY has the inside track on any other corporation... with GE's NBC ties and the new Comcast Deal there is a HUGE TV media Obama propaganda network now.

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 27, 2011, at 5:53 AM

I agree. Too much time rasing money than doing our business. Taxpayers would be money ahead.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Jan 26, 2011, at 6:19 PM

As for campaign finance reform do away with it. You are campaigning to work for the taxpayer we will pay for your campaign. Once each recognized political party picks a candidate whether it be Dem, Repub, Green, Tea or whatever. Then 6 months before the election each candidate would receive XXXX amount of dollars and that is all they can spend. Then election day we pick the best candidate. That would also end the perpetual campaign mode most politicians are in. The rest of the time they could actually work and be productive.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 26, 2011, at 4:30 PM


Good answer. I would also like to add campaign finance reform.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Jan 26, 2011, at 4:00 PM

Wtf do you think it would really take 2 years? Some things could be done right away:

1.)Cut the federal government by 50%(employees and spending) we don't need to keep supporting a bloated bureacracy. They keep taking out money with very little return. We keep all the taxes in place for national security, infrastructure, roads, bridges, etc.

2.)Do away with the job killing minimum wage.

3.)Make unions compete with the private sector for wages and benefits. Give everyone the right to work with or without joining a union.

4.)Put the oil drillers back to work so we will have more oil on the market and lower prices at the pump. I bet they never thought of that.

5.)Give people the choice of private or public school, fund education equally.

6.)Do away with affirmative action because it is racist and promotes racism. Put everyone on equal terms no matter the race, color or creed.

7.)Help people that need help when they need it but if they refuse to help themselves then quit.

If you need some more wtf just ask I will be happy to help you out there buddy.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 26, 2011, at 2:55 PM


Please tell us, specifically, what you would do to solve all of our problems? Keep in mind you only have two years.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Jan 26, 2011, at 2:05 PM

Name one village Nana? Just one.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 26, 2011, at 11:37 AM

Gosh I'm surprised at you Nana quoting Ayn Rand! Not really. Who do we look out for if not ourself?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 26, 2011, at 11:35 AM

Cheese you might check out the graph in the following link. It only shows the Iraq war and supposedly the numbers are from the CBO. I won't accept them as gospel but there is quite a discrepancy from the general figures in your statement.


The following link will substantiate your claim but has no reference to where they get their numbers. They also claim that we need a second stimulus after we have seen that the first one only put us farther in debt almost as much as a war. Depends on who you want to believe.


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 26, 2011, at 11:32 AM

Sorry, I misspoke. My research includes television also. There is a vast conservative majority on the radio, but the opposite holds true on television. I've also downloaded several news/political apps to my phone. I'm trying to look at this from a totally neutral perspective. I am expecting to get slammed by both sides, which would mean I've done a good job.

-- Posted by Philemon on Wed, Jan 26, 2011, at 7:39 AM

The Bachmann Speech



-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 26, 2011, at 6:29 AM

The Sputnik Moment


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 26, 2011, at 5:28 AM

"If capitalism never existed, any honest humanitarian should have been struggling to invent it. But when you see men struggling to evade its existence, to misrepresent its nature, and to destroy its last remnants-you may be sure that whatever their motives, love for man is not one of them." ------Ayn Rand

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 26, 2011, at 5:21 AM


I'm glad to see some agreement and no I wouldn't listen to what someone else said about my church, but especially not Mr.Beck.

I believe that a person's faith should come before ones political beliefs and they should actually conincide with each other. There are many self righteous christians and this would make me question Glenn Becks faith if I were a normal viewer of his program.

-- Posted by miss october on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 10:39 PM

Miss O ok I disagree with Beck telling people to leave the church based on his opinion and he may influence a few. Would you quit going to your church based on what someone said that is not affiliated with your church?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 9:47 PM

Nana there are no national liberal radio shows because NOBODY LISTENS TO THEM!

What would America be without corporations?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 9:39 PM

Glenn Beck is at it again by urging churchgoers to leave their church if they have pastors who talk about social or economic justice because its a perversion of the gospel and it represents communism.

Now Christians are fighting back stating that social justice is not a perversion of the gospel, but the heart of the gospel. Is it possible that Glenn Beck is the "Antichrist". The good news is that most Christians now that their fellow man and women are important.


-- Posted by miss october on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 8:50 PM


Its pretty obvious that you havent watched both Olbermin and Beck because there is no comparison as Beck is one of the craziest if not the craziest of political pundits on tv. Have you ever seen his puppet show? Here is a short clip .


-- Posted by miss october on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 7:33 PM

I agree with you Zeke but you got to remember depending on your political stand different rules apply.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 4:25 PM

can anyone honestly - with good conscious and integrity - that keith olberman wasn't (or isn't) just as bad or worse than beck when it comes to hateful speech? by the way - what happened to old olberman anyway?


-- Posted by zeke on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 3:38 PM

Phil I haven't listened to his show for some time now because I can't tune in the right station. The last time I listened though he was on 680 and 1050 AM. One was 11:00am-2:00pm and the other had him on from 2:00pm-5:00pm but that was about 4 years ago.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 2:55 PM

I read that article earlier, good stuff. I can just imagine those anonymous posters panic when they answered the phone and found out they weren't as anonymous as they thought.

Maybe this is a good time to mention a personal project I've been working on lately. I travel quite a bit and have been making an effort to listen to as much talk radio as possible, both conservative and liberal. I'm going to make a series of posts later about what I've found.

Maybe rr3 can help me here. When and what station is Rush on? I've been doing this kind of randomly and haven't come across him yet. I suppose I'll have to make a special trip of it so to speak if I want to hear him. Then again, maybe I've just been lucky so far.

-- Posted by Philemon on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 1:58 PM


You quote me correctly, but misread the meaning.

They aren't saying Beck threatened her, but that anonymous posters replying to his rhetoric said threatening things in their posts. The other threats you mention weren't brought up in this particular article.

What I said about Rawstory getting even, tongue planted firmly in cheek, was referring to the threats made against Beck in the anonymous postings following the Rawstory article. The threats were just as bad, and maybe rightly so.

My post was meant to be a statement more about the bravado that a cloak of anonymity provides rather than a political statement of any kind for or against either side in the debate over what words are currently allowed to be used in debate.

-- Posted by Philemon on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 1:32 PM


Just to add to some of your posts. The Surpreme court justice Scalia has broken the law(canon 5,conduct for U.S. judges) by attending a closed door Tea party session. I think his partiality has affected by such sessions.


-- Posted by miss october on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 10:33 AM


I read the article you posted about the 77 year old lady getting death threats. I agree that the vast majority of what Beck says isn't worth listening to. The death threats cited in the article were anonymous posts from readers on his website.

I also read the anonymous posts following the article. I'm sure Rawstory will be satisfied that they have gotten even for the lady since there were numerous similar threats made against Beck by their own anonymous posters.

Note, this post was not meant to be any kind of statement as to who is right or wrong, just an observation on the poor state of the anonymous rhetoric from both sides.

Keep up the good work Eric. I know it wouldn't be allowed to go that far here.

-- Posted by Philemon on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 8:32 AM

so News... YOu just proved exactly who you are..."QUOTING YOU they have "better benefits, pay, and its real easy duty lol."

so.. UNLESS they serve in the military theh NO ONE IS WORTH ANYTHING... lol

-- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 1:07 AM

nanadot... so ............... wow.... so Until NOW, after Obamaeconomics YOU are finally understanding that take from the rich and give to the poor DOES NOT WORK... wow, what a concept.

-- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Jan 25, 2011, at 1:04 AM

Now here is an issue that most who participate in this forum will not like regardless of ideology.

Most Americans want public financed elections instead of corporate funded elections yet the GOP has planned on rushing a bill that will kill public financing. They wish to eliminate all transparency with THIS BILL.


-- Posted by Back in the day on Mon, Jan 24, 2011, at 10:50 PM

Yeah OKR,

I have to admit that I am really looking forward to being a grandfather. We don't know if the babie is a girl or a boy yet because you can't tell much from the ultrasound, but my Son says his gut feeling is that its a girl. If it is a girl then he and his lovely wife plan to name the child after my Mom. So I have my fingers crossed and am hoping for a girl.

I am currently planning out her whole life.

My son is currently serving in the Armed Forces and when his enlistment ends he will be applying for his Australian citizenship (he has the right to Aussie citizenship because I am a citizen) and he plans to finish out his career in the Australaian Armed Forces. They have better benefits, pay, and its real easy duty lol. But the best part is that I will then have easy spoiling access to my grandchild, and I can make sure that she follows the "Grandpa's Roadmap to Success" plan I am currently putting together for her life lol lol lol...

Of course I am just kidding about that. Planning out someone else's life is full of pitfalls.

However, I do plan to spoil him or her as much as I possibly can...and so does my wife lol lol lol...

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Jan 24, 2011, at 8:00 PM

Aw Gee News, say it ain't so. Things won't be the same without you.

ROTFLMAO at your response.

Congratulations on your first Grand Child. Enjoy intensely, for they do grow up, and are on with life far too soon.


-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Jan 24, 2011, at 5:56 PM


Uh...do you mind if I not participate in the big babyboomer die off?

Its not that I am afraid of an eternity of nothingness, but rather I still have a few things to do before I take that trip.

For one thing, I am going to be a Grandfather for the first time next Summer. I would kinda like to get to know my Grandbaby a bit before I check out.

Also, my Mom and Dad are still alive. It would not be fair to them for me to die before them, and I can assure you they have no plan to die anytime soon. I am sure if you asked them to join the Great Old Person Die Off, they would point out that they already did their act of patriotism...during WW2.

In addition, my lovely wife and I have been discussing the possibility of moving to the Loop in Chicago. Specifically, we are interested in purchasing a condo in Marina Towers. The view in that luxury skyscraper is incredible no matter what side of the building one is on and the views include a panoramic view of Lake Michigan and a view of the beautiful Chicago river. There are only 2 things preventing us from moving there right now. 1.) My Mother-in-law, a widow, has only one offspring -- my wife -- so we can't leave until she passes which probably won't be for many, many years from now. 2.) My wife refuses to live in any country that does not have socialized medicine -- and I agree.

I would like to point out that I did ask my wife for her permission for me to join in on all the fun you have suggested, but she said no. Sorry mate.

So there ya are mate. I am really with ya on this Big Patriotic Die Off thing in spirit, and I can't tell you just how disapointed I am that I won't be able to participate. However, as you can see, I just can't go yet as I still have some things to do. I know I should have been prepared to join the big die off and I appologize for my irresponsibility, but never the less...I will have to respectfully decline the invitation to participate in the Big Patriotic Die Off.

...ya'll just go ahead without me and have a good time.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Jan 24, 2011, at 4:48 PM

"78-year-old woman gets death threats after Beck shouts conspiracy"


-- Posted by news across on Mon, Jan 24, 2011, at 4:24 PM

After thoughts. I realize that such a massive undertaking as I have just proposed will need a few slogans to rally the troops. How about:

(For liberals) "You've got our back Jack, and the rest of us too". They should have used this tactic anyway in their support for the position they have taken along side Jack Kervorkian, but I know of no one who gave their ultimate to support Dr. Jack. Weak willed wishywashy liberals.

(For conservatives) "If you can't earn your keep. we'll put you to sleep." They should be comfortable with that one because they have been bantering similar phrases, and thoughts for some time now.

(For centrists) "If that's what most want to do, I'm for it too".

(For the remainder) "None of my business." Why bother trying to get their attention. Just let em keep saying what they say now.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Jan 24, 2011, at 1:42 AM

The real problem with our economy is us. I mean all we "old people" who post here, and the millions of geriatrics, and near geriatrics who do not. If we would just quietly disappear our nation would be back on a sound economic footing.

Far too much is spent on sustaining us. We are the real bane of this country, whether our politics are left or right. If we have any guts we shall, in a final burst of patriotism, die.

I think that in the final analysis, those that remain will be much relieved, at the least from a material stand point.

There should be no problem getting others on board with us in such a splendid solution. There is something in it for conservatives, centrists, and liberals. Beyond those categories no one notices us any way, and as they notice nothing else that is going on with our country, probably would not notice we were gone, excepting perhaps, in a few cases, those who were members of their immediate families.

For liberals we would, at last, have an immediate redistribution of wealth, on a grander scale than in any other circumstance we could ever imagine. They would also win, in a big time way, the hard fought battle to make legal the Kervorkian solution. At the end, for all, it would be that other liberal chestnut, true equality, whether brown, black, or white, whether rich, average, or poor, all treated the same.

The conservatives would have their dreams fulfilled to an even greater extent. That is what really makes this the perfect answer, because no conservative worth his/her salt would ever agree to anything, unless they got more than any other group. What more could they wish for than the end to social security, and the end to medicare, with no residue of starving, and ill old human rubbish lying in the streets tweaking their miniscule vestiges of concern?

For the centrists it should be an easy sell. If liberals, and conservatives are both on board, they will find it easy to go along to get along, and frankly, there will be no other way that they can maintain their secure warm place in the middle.

Oh what a great Final Celebration I envision! Californians Kumbayaing in masses as they march toward the sunset, and tumble over cliffs into the ocean, holding hands all the while, and of course enjoying that last high. Alaskans following the tradition of their indigenous brothers, gathering stoically on ice floes, Kumbaya optional. Wisconsinites plopping down in easy chairs to gorge, and drink themselves to death with beer, brats, and cheese. Kumbaya between belches. On, and on. You take it from there.

So, there is no reason for anything else to be said on this political blog by we Geezers. We all now know the answer. Time for us to shut up, and get er done.

Category: dark humor, satire

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Jan 24, 2011, at 1:01 AM

W the f... you dont have to like Michelle Malkin... I was only using her research about the violent rhetoric and actions and attacks by the LEFTISTS against people.... you know the ones not reported on and not classified as anything important enough to report on?

-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 11:13 PM

As the "successful" suicide bomber approached the gates to heaven, expecting his reward for "serving Allah", he was suddenly punched in the jaw by Benjamin Franklin, after which he was subsequently beaten and kicked by Thomas Jefferson, Joh...n Adams, George Washington, and 68 other members of the Continental Congress. After several minutes he was able to crawl to St. Peter.

"This isn't what I was promised!" He shouted angrily.

"What? Don't like your 72 Virginians?" Peter replied

-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 11:09 PM


What weve all been waiting for has happened. According to polls the distrust for Fox News has risen amongst Democrats, Indepedents, and REPUBLICANS. I guess you cant sling mud and spread falsehoods forever without your image taking a big hit.

Now that PBS is the most trusted the Republicans have no choice, but to defund them as they dont want the truth to be heard.


-- Posted by cheesehead on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 10:44 PM

mrxray: Again - it's you who's pushing the racist commentary, not me. There is nothing at all in my comment that talks about race, absolutely nothing. On the other hand, if the shoe fits, by all means wear it.

-- Posted by Miss Marple on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 10:11 PM

Does he frighten you Eric?

Better to go along with the big boys than do any real journalism...eh Eric?

-- Posted by news across on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 8:33 PM

"Murdoch paper's phone hacking targeted ex-prime minister: reports"


-- Posted by news across on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 8:31 PM

One of the potential Republican candidates that is owned by Fox news invokes race during a discussion involving abortion.

I only knew this guy by name but know we have a face, but now I know enough to know this wont go across very well.

Mr. Romeny is looking better in this Presidential run because the rest of the Republicans are making fools of themselves.


-- Posted by miss october on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 3:37 PM

I know conservatives do it too but why do liberals have to assassinate the character and the intelligence of someone they disagree with instead of taking their own stand and simply disagree?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 11:57 AM

I guess I could ask the same question of wtf.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 11:54 AM

Just one question cheesehead why is it that anyone you disagree with is dumb? Just wonderin'

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 11:52 AM


Mike Huckabee is a few branches short of a tree. He is just a little smarter than Sarah Palin. The most important thing we have found out about him is that Huckabee is a Communist right because a Communist govt doesnt believe in free speech.

-- Posted by cheesehead on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 11:02 AM

What was really funny was Huckabee saying that Editor Assange should be "tried for treason and executed"...all for doing exactly what a news organization should do -- posting the news.

But the worst part is it demonstrates that Huckabee is...well...not very bright...

because apparently Huckabee does not realize that American treason and sedition laws only apply to Americans -- not Australians.

Huckabee's statement illustrates one of the symptoms of "empire building" -- he believes the whole World's population owes the Unted States their loyalty -- they don't -- but Huckabee was stuck in empire mode at the time -- and still is.

I often wonder if my fellow Americans realize just how ignorant some of their politicians sound to the rest of the World and just what effect that has on World opinion of Americans.

-- Posted by news across on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 8:06 AM

Michelle Malkin? Really?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 6:41 AM

Here is another link that is important but not being investigated or reported by the rabid, anti-republican, anti-conservative, anti-tea party, anti-palin liberal progressive main stream media outlets...

This outlines a little more detail about the interactions that Loughner had with the pima County Sheriff BEFORE he shot all those people.

Here is one quote from the article about those interactions prior to the actual shooting.

"When Pima County Sheriff's Office was informed, his deputies assured the victims that he was being well managed by the mental health system. It was also suggested that further pressing of charges would be unnecessary and probably cause more problems than it solved as Jared Loughner has a family member that works for Pima County."


Do we still wonder why the Sheriff was so quick to jump to blaming the right wing extremists without waiting for even an initial investigation?

-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 2:20 AM

hey speaking of the "new tone of civility" and how we are not supposed to use symbols and words that convey analogies for war or violence or anything similar, I guess the BOONE COUNTY DEMOCRATS in Missouri did not get the message...

The baby in the middle of the target is cute though... lol and they placed their words in a set up that makes them look like a pistol... lol

I think there is too much reading into this whole add for the Boone County Dems. BUT it is the DEMS after all that are saying that symbols are evil and make people become zombies and act out in violence....


Oh yeah How about DEM Tennessee Steve Cohen calling and comparing Republicans to Nazis?

If you dare look at another Michelle Malkin link here are a bunch of images that Dems and lefties used to advocate for violence against Palin and Bush and other Republicans and or conservatives. But when Liberals and Dems do things like this, it is art or ok because they are making a point or some other justification. Even though if you scroll down to the middle and bottom of the page you will see examples of Obama supports being violent, and other leftist organizations being violent and breaking laws....but it is ok and the media is not calling for their punishment... or attempting to villify those leftists... and you claim there is no hypocrisy from the left


-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 2:14 AM

Obamacare kills jobs... errr destroys... err whatever you want to call it... more lay offs DUE TO Obama care




-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 2:04 AM

news and nanadot... besides your apparent Palin hate syndrome can you point to the EXACT quote from Palin along with a link to HER source? Can you find where she stated anything about Assange being killed or executed?

I was looking for that the other day and all I can find is where she made a statement on Facebook. Here is the link to her statement, at least the one that the talking heads and the leftist media outlets are referring to.


"He is an anti-American operative with blood on his hands. His past posting of classified documents revealed the identity of more than 100 Afghan sources to the Taliban. Why was he not pursued with the same urgency we pursue al Qaeda and Taliban leaders?"

In context this comment was made in asking questions about what steps were taken to prevent more wiki type leaks from occuring because wiki leaks did put the lives of people working with the US at risk in Iraq and Afghanistan. I think they were valid questions as well.

So how do you twist something that asks why we were not pursuing someone into asking for his execution and death?

But more to the point, you are basically saying that Australia is a nation that is willing to punish for a simple statement of opinion, much as if I read a story about a criminal in Australia accused of a crime and then I stated that they should be tried and if convicted, then be put to death... Again, someone stating they thought someone committed a crime and should be punished is NOT inciting violence, merely stating an opinion regarding a situation or incident.

Based on what you are telling me I could never go to Australia because I would voice my opinion that might not agree with the governments....

-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 1:16 AM

It is amazing how fast that the Democrats and Obama have gone from saying; "It is our way or the highway" to the Republicans or anyone who disagrees with them by claiming that the election of Obama was a direction changer for America, to now saying "The Nov 2010 elections are a time for bipartisanship"

They went from calling out the Repubs as the party of No to claiming they want to work together... they went from claiming the Repubs were the party of No to BEING the party of No...LOL

LOL Politics is awesome to watch.

-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 12:57 AM

and no, Biden did not say Assange should be executed and he was wrong about the terrorist statement.

You would do well to remember that Australia is a soverign Nation with its own laws -- laws that all the outrage in the USA by conservatives won't change.

-- Posted by news across on Sun, Jan 23, 2011, at 12:02 AM


Palin said Assange should be hunted down and executed.

He has committed no crime in posting the news (see NYT V USA and the 1st Ammendment for more on this), and even if it were a crime to post the news, it certainly would not carry the death penalty. Nor has Assange been charged with a crime -- including the civil (non-criminal) potential charges (punishible by a maximum of a $700 fine) the Swedes want to question him with regard to.

The simple fact is that she blurted out her threats before she had checked the facts -- such as the fact that Assange has committed no crime and owes no allegience what-so-ever to the United States.

...and rest assured xray, if she ever comes to Australia she will be arrested, tried, convicted, and sentenced to prison.

Nobody is above the law in Australia. Not even our Queen is above the law here. If Palin ever comes here, she will be here a long time -- in our prisons learning to speak Aboriginal -- the hard way.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 11:59 PM

I think Biden stated that Assange was a terrorist and needed to be executed as well... a high tech terrorist... since Biden is the VP of the US is he not a more appropriate example than Palin who is not a current elected politician?

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 11:13 PM

exactly how is someone stating that Assange needs to be tried and excuted as a terrorist or whatever the term was used a crime>

Is that not someone's opinion about a current news story in the United States about a serious situation where possibly this person could cause our military and diplomat personnel to be killed or attacked. Are opinions now crimes?

If Palin would have said, I LOVE what Assange did and think he should be left alone and allowed to continue with his activities, is this not the exact same situation.... an opinion?

can we no longer have opinions about a person who commits a crime and state in public that we think he or she needs the death penalty?

Opinions are crimes... this is a Great nation you libbies want!

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 11:01 PM

Mrs Marples... below is YOUR quote. AND I stick my statement that says you are attempting to claim that calling Obamacare by the name obama care is somehow derisively and the ONLY means in which this can be construed as derisive is if it is intended as being racist because we disagree with Obama only because he is "black"

ANY claim that the term Obama care is somehow derisive is silly because Democrats use it, media outlets from fox, to NPR to MSNBC use the same term. LOL so your argument that the term Obamacare is somehow offensive or derisive is a NON argument. The ONLY person that can be offended by using the term Obama care is Obama... and since he joined the Democrat Cartel where they had the power in the House the Senate and the Executive office, and since he is the President who is pushing this bill then the knickname is fitting and cannot be claimed to be anything other than a simplified name, many bills are named or knicknamed after the pusher of the bill.. LOL

Heck we had Hillary care and Kennedy care and other types of bills that were knicknamed....

I find it arrogant that you can speak for Obama and claim that the term obama care is offensive or derisive...

Or back to my real point... it is a NON argument... lol a false argument

"mrxray and others: The health care bill is H.R.3590 - the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act. If you wanted to have a calm and rational discussion about it, you could refer to it as HR3590, or the PPAC Act, or Health Care Reform Act, or the Rangel Act. Any of those would be fine. It's ridiculous to think that anyone would be confused about what you're referring to. It's not as if we've been innundated with health care reform bills in the recent past, now is it?

Continually referring to the bill derisively as Obamacare is, as you well know, offensive. That's why you use the term. But you know that, too. Name-calling like this is for children."

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 10:57 PM

and I wonder why the main stream national Obama media did not run with this story from KC and start accusing the left of inciting violence when the guy tried to kill THE GOVERNOR.

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 10:49 PM

Hey... I mentioned this guy but did not post a link....

Right here in our very own back yard a radical extreme leftist attacked someone who he thought was the governor of Missouri... read the list of groups he associated with and his favorite quote.... a VIOLENT leftist I thought those did not exist

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 10:41 PM

news... first, congrats on the the grand kid.

My question about your comments about the paul/nader alliance...

Is not a balanced budget bill being purposed by the Republicans?

Are they not already demanding that we fix the deficit?

And is not the concept of paying for a program or policy only if you have the available funds a conservative ideal?

Now, I am not saying that Republicans of the Bush era have wanted or attempted to acheive these things, but the current influx of conservative (Supposedly) H of R congress people have been saying this is something we need to do...

They have been saying that if they are going to vote to increase the debt ceiling that we need serious long term attitude adjustments on spending and the debt and deficit?

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 10:40 PM

Here is an interesting read


-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 10:29 PM

I have been thinking about the Libetarian/Progresive alliance proposed by Congressman Ron Paul and Mr. Ralph Nader.

I know it may be crazy, but...well if for nothing more than curiosity at the very least...I wonder if there are things we on the left and the right can agree on.

I know one area we probably would all agree and that is that we absolutely need a balanced budget and that will require cuts across the board.

We also should see some serious National debt reduction with the goal of eliminating that National debt within a reasonable period of time,

In additon we should have a system in place that will ensure that all government expenditures can be paid in full with existing tax revenues.

Does anyone on the left or right agree and, if so, do you have any suggestions on how we as a Nation might accomplish these goals?

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 8:31 PM

I wonder what Palin would do if she were the POTUS?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 8:31 PM

Mrs O is wanting to change school lunches(which they need)to fight obesity. She even had Wal-Mart promise to lower the price of produce. The dinner with the Chinese president was 2200 calories. Shouldn't they practice what they want all of us to do? You know lead by example. But hey we won't be able to buy produce when gas is $5 a gallon. We will have to make a choice eat or go to work. Hmmmmmm. I know can draw unemployment and then we can have our cake and eat it too. Ain't it great!

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 5:36 PM

"Ron Paul, Ralph Nader agree on 'progressive-libertarian alliance'"

With video from Fox News.


WOW! Well all I can say is...count me in fellas! This sounds like it may be just what America needs.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 4:25 PM

Thanks Nan and rr,

I am ready to let the spoiling begin lol lol. We plan to make sure that baby comes into this World with every possible thing she or he could need or want.

...and congrats to you on your 3 too rr.

I think I am really going to like this being a grandpa thing lol.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 3:58 PM

Well congrats news I have two one of them will be three tomorrow and he loves to stay with MawMaw and PawPaw. If we knew grandkids were so much fun we would have had them first. Ha!Ha!

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 3:42 PM

Oh, hey friends,

I almost forgot to share something with you that you might enjoy.

I just found out 3 days ago that I am going to be a grandfather for the first time.

My Son and his wife have announced that they are expecting a visit from the Stork (see "Stork Theory of biological reproduction" lol lol lol) next Summer.

He has a good career in the Armed Services and he and his lovely wife are well prepared for this so its a really good thing!!

I am really excited. Oh and if its a girl (we still can't tell from the ultra sound which it is), they plan to name the child after my Mom.

LIfe just doesn't get better than that lol lol lol.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 2:46 PM

Well said and point made MM...

Good on ya mate for refusing to take it laying down!

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 2:22 PM


Yes Nan, I am familiar with TED and have viewed and listened to a number of their lectures -- great stuff!!!!

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 2:20 PM

mrxray: regarding your comment " it is really a NON-ISSUE that YOU are trying to use to justify YOUR calling people racist simply because they dont agree with it..."

I have never at any time accused you or anyone else of racism. You're the one raising that issue, not me.

-- Posted by Miss Marple on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 2:18 PM


I agree with your comment regarding extending Medicare to all American citizens and legal residents.

That is exactly what Australia did back in the '80s and it continues to make health care access open to all Australians without regard to income.

The sad fact is, the United States is the only Western, industrialized nation in the World that does not have some form of socialized medicine to ensure health care access for all Americans. As a result, Americans continue to die for lack of medical care and many of those uninsured who do survive the archaic American health care access system, often find themselves in bankruptcy court.

Its sad that a small minority of Americans, the Republican/Tea Party, are the ones who decided this issue for all of America, and as if their uniformed ("...keep your government hands off my medicare" -- statement by Tea Party member during debate), vauge opposition to adequate health care access for all was not bad enough, they even went as far as to waste American tax payers hard earned dollars in a symbolic vote in the House -- done entirely for political reasons -- to overturn the changes made to health care access providers under President Obama's watch.

Frankly, its sad to see the Republican/Tea Party begin this Congressional term ignoring their own promise to put direct job creation at the top of their legislative agenda and instead using our Congress to make inappropriate, symbolic political statements in an attempt to appease the ultra-conservative extremists of the Republican Party.

Not too long ago I had to have one of my saliva glands removed from my throat. The surgery was performed by one of the best throat surgeons in the Sydney area, it was performed the next day after the initial consultation -- even though it was not a necessity to have it done right away -- and of course a whole slew of medical professionals were involved including nurses and anesthesiologists. Everything went just great. The surgery went without a flaw, and after a few weeks of recuperation at home, I was fit as a fiddle.

My cost?...nothing...zip...zilch...and our taxes didn't increase as a result...lol...nor did it break our National Government Budget lol.

Like any other country, Australia is not perfect - yes we have some bugs in the system that we are still working out -- but at least here we have health care access for everyone...not just those who can afford the high price of insurance.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 1:45 PM


1 am not Julian Assange's Attorney. It is he who would be the special prosecutor -- not me. I simply posted the article.

Apparently you did not read the article or what Editor Assange's Solicitor had to say.

The charges have nothing to do with the shooting in Arizona, but rather her calls for the murder and assassination of an Australian citizen, Editor Julian Assange.

While such threats against American citizens may not reach the level of assault in the United States, such calls for violence against an Australian citizen -- and especially one who has broken no laws in either the USA or Australia and who's only "sin" was to exercise his free press rights and publish news -- are a violation of our laws and amount to assault. Such threats are codified here under the title "inciting violence."

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 12:10 PM

I have not obession with Obama, I merely take the opportunities to counter people who are always saying that we who disagree with obama are racists...

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 2:29 AM

Nanadot... see there you go again with you unsubstantiated accusations of people being racist... it is never ending... lol

Amusing though.

But I agree with you on Walmart... I just like to point out little ironies like Obama saying he would not shop there and them M obama having them as the MAIN contributor for her better food for kids program.

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 2:28 AM

news... so you advocate for Australia to prosecute someone in some other nation for something they said regarding to a situation within their own homeland?

How in the world can they make a leap that she is inciting violence in Australia?

BUT in that same article the state that even Biden called Assange a high tech terrorist... is that not inciting violence by comparing them to a terrorist that should also be sought out and executed?

here is the REAL culprit of violent rhetoric in the AZ shooting case and his own county is trying to force his recall as an elected representative of his county.


HE is the one who opened his mouth and blamed people by NAME in the conservative movement and talk shows as to be blamed for the shooting even before an investigation had time to even get started, as he made rash and INCORRECT statements an hour after the shooting, while they were still dealing with the emergency before they could even have started with any real investigation.

THEN you have to accuse the main stream media for taking his words and running with them and repeating the same thing without checking the facts of the investigation.

ALL of that has led to death threats towards the people they named as being at fault, when they were not, obviously.


-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 2:26 AM

It is much much easier to have a scape goat to blame for individual failings, much easier than telling yourself that you are the one who screwed up and made bad choices and now you have to live with the consequences and overcome with hard work and diligence and sacrifice to overcome those self imposed obstacles...

It is easier to buy into the "its not your fault, its the fault of the evil rich man, evil big corporation, the racist republican conservative" so let the government cause you to become dependent.

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 2:19 AM

"Palin to be prosecuted for inciting violence if she visits Australia, attorney says"


Well...I guess former half-term Governor Palin will be crossing Australia off her "places to see" list lol lol lol...

...but the really funny part is...if she does come here, We the People of Australia will see to it she is fully prosecuted, tried, convicted, and imprisoned for threatening the life of our citizen.

She doesn't have any friends here lol lol lol...

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 2:03 AM

ooooo ooooo... I thought Walmart was the EVILest of all evil big corporations and that B. Obama was not going to shop there ever again because they are Anti-Union. http://www.associatedcontent.com/article...

YET M. Obama created a food program with Walmart to fight obesity.... now the walmart is toeing the government line? LOL

I wonder now that M. Obama loves Walmart if B. Obama will have to change his tune to keep maritial harmony?? lol

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 12:41 AM

U.S. health disparities increasing among the rich and poor. The bottom line here is that we are better than this in this country. With a decrease in health care for the poor and middle class there becomes an increase for the need of mental health care due to the stress. The shooting in Arizona helps to bring light that mental illnesses are a threat to society, so how do we increase access to health care if the current reform isnt enough?


-- Posted by cheesehead on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 12:36 AM

So... all you lefties... what do you think about this new UNION between Obama and the Main stream media outlet owner GE/Immelt? Can you really claim any sort of unbiasedness now?

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 12:35 AM

Zeke... dont you know that calling a Pot black is politcally incorrect and now you are a racist.... LOL (JOKE, SARCASM.... dont delete me)

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 12:13 AM

lol Mrs marples... I think that it is just the common short hand and people from both sides refer to it as Obamacare... it is really a NON-ISSUE that YOU are trying to use to justify YOUR calling people racist simply because they dont agree with it...

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 22, 2011, at 12:12 AM

miss marple

Very well said and where have you been, we need more common sense people on here.

-- Posted by cheesehead on Fri, Jan 21, 2011, at 11:16 PM

mrxray and others: The health care bill is H.R.3590 - the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act. If you wanted to have a calm and rational discussion about it, you could refer to it as HR3590, or the PPAC Act, or Health Care Reform Act, or the Rangel Act. Any of those would be fine. It's ridiculous to think that anyone would be confused about what you're referring to. It's not as if we've been innundated with health care reform bills in the recent past, now is it?

Continually referring to the bill derisively as Obamacare is, as you well know, offensive. That's why you use the term. But you know that, too. Name-calling like this is for children.

-- Posted by Miss Marple on Fri, Jan 21, 2011, at 10:38 PM

Well, I imagine that Bill OReilly and the folks at FOX are poppin' the corks tonite.

Olbermann leaves MSNBC.


-- Posted by What the f...... on Fri, Jan 21, 2011, at 10:21 PM

Well it looks like all of Pres Obama's poll numbers are up and heading in the right direction.

Up from 30% to 40% is the percentage of people who view Obama as a moderate. 53% approval rating up from 48%. Also a 55% approval rating from indepedents.

It looks likes now the radical right media such as Rush, Beck, Fox, and Savage need to bring even more anger and lies to the table to bring Obama down, but with America fed up with talk their do they dare to continue down the same path they have been going down.


-- Posted by cheesehead on Fri, Jan 21, 2011, at 2:54 PM

Well said and so true Zeke.

-- Posted by marshallfriend on Fri, Jan 21, 2011, at 11:45 AM

hey all

just dropped in to see what condition my condition was in - sort of.

everyone on here calling everyone else racist is kinda funny - in a grade school kind of way.

if we'd all be big enough to admit the truth, racism is alive and well in all aspects of our political realm.

repubs have their extremes - racists and non- racist - as do democrats and all others - including the naacp. some of the most hateful and divisive writing and editorializing and mobilizing comes from all areas - extreme liberal, extreme conservatives, and the naacp.

there's an old term - the pot calling the kettle black - sounds like that's what's going on around here.

just sayin -


-- Posted by zeke on Fri, Jan 21, 2011, at 11:20 AM

Hey... while we are happy and getting along today, can we have a big shoutout to the newest

Government-media complex... the newest, most public leftist media biased propaganda machine...

Obama gives his favored MEDIA mogul, Immelt of GE NBC a high profile assignment on a "wheres the jobs" committee.... it is sort of ironic that Obama is reaching out to business owners and instead of reaching out to small business owners to find out what they need to create jobs, he looks toward a HUGE business mogul that has seen his corporation see financial losses under his watch... shares dropped from in the 40-50s to into the teens....

So much for the main stream media outlets NOT being biased... LOL

-- Posted by mrxray on Fri, Jan 21, 2011, at 9:05 AM

Nanadot... according to you, language does matter and does influence people.... so STOP CALLING PEOPLE RACIST SIMPLY BECAUSE THEY DO NOT AGREE WITH OBAMA... THIS is the most divisive langage of all...

When liberals or anyone pro Obama runs out of facts and logical arguments, their next argument is to call those who oppose him a racist... HEY... maybe this is why they call it Obama... if we are racist because we disagree with it then the government take over must therefore be OBAMA'S

-- Posted by mrxray on Fri, Jan 21, 2011, at 9:00 AM

Cheesehead... exactly what do you call it when a government body, appointed by the HHS Sec. or the president that will be making decisions about what health care is to be provide or not covered based on "is the cost worth the outcome" OR is the person too old to obtain the treatment based on a GOVERNMENT body's opinions?


OR what do you call it when a government agency, the FDA in this case, can arbitrarily deny a Cancer drug to late stage metastatic breast cancer? Their reasoning? Because they decided that the drug does not provide "a sufficient benefit in slowing disease progression to outweigh the significant risk to patients."

SO women who are in late stage metastatic breast cancer are iminentyl facing DEATH... due to their disease... exactly what possible side effect of a drug outweighs DEATH? AND exactly what right does the government have in deciding what drug I can have or not have in the treatment of my disease? AND how does the FDA make a decision that goes against the substantial number or Oncologists that are PRESCRIBING this drug as a last ditch effort to cure or postpone the effects of a deadly disease?


How can you NOT say that there are death panel type decisions being made and Obama care is not even fully implemented?

But I dont expect an answer from you Cheesy because you cannot answer direct questions

-- Posted by mrxray on Fri, Jan 21, 2011, at 8:57 AM

Wow Nanadot... your calling the Tea party racists is typical... but maybe you need to see someone for all of that anger you seem to have built up.

I find it silly to accuse ONE side of politics racist while people claim their side is not... I find it unintelligent to continue to use the race card in an unsubstantiated means to stereotype a whole group of people, non of whom you actually know.

At least MY comment about racism and the NAACP is based on public actions of the NAACP is backed up by their own actions.

BUT when you claim one political party or the other is racist ONLY because they disagree with you based on political ideals does no one any good. As for the term Obamacare... what else would you have it called? Hillary Care? Nope she is not president... Kennedy Care? Nope he is dead and not the president. Obama is the pusher of this bill and therefore the knickname is Obamacare... nothing racist and the only thing to blame it on is the simple fact that OBAMA is the one pushing the health INSURANCE bill onto the public....Had it been Bush, it would have been Bush care... ohhhhh no it would have been called the "evil, racist, rich, big oil, white man keeping the minorities down" health care bill...

BECAUSE Obama is the President and IS pushing the bill... he is the figurehead that is attached... for you to read racism into the calling it Obamacare is illogical and nothing more than a sad attempt to race BAIT

-- Posted by mrxray on Fri, Jan 21, 2011, at 8:41 AM

In 1798 congress passed and President John Adams signed the ACT FOR THE RELIEF OF THE SICK AND DISABLED SEAMAN which was a Federal mandate for private employees to have medical coverage and the fees were deducted from their paychecks.


-- Posted by cheesehead on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 10:57 PM

Sounds like you got down pat Nana.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 10:33 PM

Is this really what Glenn Beck fans watch his show for? They may shoot you!


-- Posted by cheesehead on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 8:36 PM

The labeling of the Health care reform as Obamacare may come back to haunt the Republicans because when people realize that there are no death panels in this reform more will be for this reform and come to a realization that they were lied to they will know who to blame.

-- Posted by cheesehead on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 8:32 PM

Hey... speaking of jobs going over seas and it being the fault of Republicans.. (NOT, it is the fault of global economy and our pricing ourselves out of competition) During the same visit between China's Hu and Obama, Boeing made a huge deal with China, NOW BOeign laid off US workers

Wonder where those jobs will go.... China?


-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 6:59 PM

Because OBAMA jammed the OBAMACARE BILL down our throats... they did NOT know what was in the bill before they passed it... then the title OBAMA CARE is exactly what OBama care needs to be called when anyone wants to discuss Obama Care

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 6:54 PM

so... Nanadot, Mrs marples. and Back in the day...

you are tired of division, as you call it, from the right, but you can blatantly ignore, and justify the exact same actions from the left?

What typical blind and hypocritical bias...

BUT, politics is ALL ABOUT division and fighting for what you think is right... The history of politics is ALWAYS full of division and anger and harsh words.... the world is harsh and divisional and angry at times and full of situations and actions and behaviors and bad luck that make it unfair and unequal and full of tension.

Complaining about is does what exactly? Do you think that by biasedly standing on the sidelines on this forum hypocritically stating that the "right" to blame is going to convince anyone that YOU and the left is correct and the right is not? Are you not perpetuating the division by refusing to acknowledge that YOUR side is equal in its devision and anger and harsh words, and rhetoric?

I am confused as to exactly what you are trying to do.... either you have beliefs and convictions and values that YOU are willing to stand up for even if harsh words are needed and even if tension and division are the results when people disagree with you OR you are weak minded and unwilling to stand up for what you THINK are belifes and values and convictions....

Personally I dont want a mealy mouthed, wishy washy, fence straddling politicians... I want one that has beliefs, values and convictions that they are WILLING TO FIGHT FOR....

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 6:52 PM

Miss Marples... you are tired of the term obamacare... sort of like people are tired of the instant attempts to tie tea party people to racism and to blame them for shootings that have nothing to do with conservatism or the tea party or even politics in general?

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 6:44 PM

back in the Day.... regarding the MLK quote and my "attack" on naacp....

Did you actually READ the link I posted? and how the NAACP is showing its true RACIST tendencies?


That is ANOTHER link to the same story... combine with how the NAACP is extremely quick to link the tea party to racism and this example of racism and other situations the NAACP is constantly doing, how can you NOT say that this organization is racist or that they perpetuate racism?

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 6:42 PM

Probably "Health INSURANCE Reform" would be the most accurate title. Don't buy all the BS folks.

The insurance companies are behind the move for repeal. They don't care about you, only profit.

I for one applaud the effort to hold them accountable. The bill, like any, is not perfect. I would rather see the GOP try and help fix current legilsation as opposed throwing a hissy fit at the behest of thier benefactors.

At least the Dems are trying to do something, anything. It's already paying dividends to the American public if folks would just shut thier mouths and open thier ears.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 6:19 PM


I have heard of some of the members of the Supreme Court attending Koch fundraisers or something like that,but the Koch brothers are criminals and have pled guilty to covering up enviromental violations. so how can they even associate with the likes of such?

Is there any branch or vote by the people that can get these Justices off the court or how does that work with this court? How do we just stand by and let this happen as these rulings have taken the influence away from normal people can have on elections?

-- Posted by cheesehead on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 5:14 PM

Well Miss M you didn't tell me what to name it.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 11:46 AM

LOLOL...8 hours or so is the best you can do? Not much of an effort.

-- Posted by Miss Marple on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 10:25 AM

Paul Ryan slices and dices Obamacare.


Interesting video if you dare to watch.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 6:07 AM

What Spending Will We Cut?

Republicans have a budget cut bill, we're not gonna tell you what's in it 'til we pass it. How does that feel?

Sound familiar?


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 5:57 AM

What would you like us to call it Miss M? Is there something more politically correct?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 20, 2011, at 5:50 AM

It appears that after all our founding fathers did believe that there was room in the Constituition for Federally mandated health insurance or they wouldnt have done it. I guess the health care reform is Constitutional!


-- Posted by cheesehead on Wed, Jan 19, 2011, at 11:45 PM

Let's have a contest, okay? Let's see how long you can all go without writing "Obamacare." The constant harping on that particular phrase is really, really getting old.

-- Posted by Miss Marple on Wed, Jan 19, 2011, at 9:59 PM


Youre right many people are getting tired of what they are hearing the politics of division from Limbaugh/Beck/Palin camp and you can start to see this in more of the polls coming out. This includes many Republicans who actually want to discuss the real problems we face.

-- Posted by Back in the day on Wed, Jan 19, 2011, at 8:25 PM


Why would you use A MLK quote and use it to attack the NAACP? Do you have lots of anger built up?

-- Posted by Back in the day on Wed, Jan 19, 2011, at 8:19 PM

Interesting perspective of Hiroshima vs. Detroit. What did the most damage the A-bomb or U. S. Government welfare programs created to buy votes from those who want something for nothing?


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 19, 2011, at 5:46 AM

Lets deal with a POLL company that tracks all sorts of polls with pretty good results... Rasmussen Polls STILl shows that 55% of American favor repealing OBama care while 40% do not favor it. IF you look at the results since last March, you will see that the results fluxuate from 52% to 63% in favor of repealing. and those against from 35% to 42%... that is a pretty consistent rate. This goes clear up until Jan 17, 2011...

We will see the interest in Obama care dwindle on both sides of this issue amongst the working/common folk because we have more importan things to worry about like Celebrity House wives, dancing with stars and American Idol... lol

-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 19, 2011, at 2:53 AM

explain to me this one thing about the health care bill... BECAUSE we are taxing people 10 years for 5 or 6 years of benefits, how do you justify the math that claims we are SAVING money by having Obama care if the bill is TOO expensive to pay for ONE YEAR AT A TIME....WE are taxing people TWO YEARS to pay for ONE YEAR of Obama care.... how in the heck is that saving MONEY?

Ohhh sorry TWO THINGS

IF.... errrr not if, but BECAUSE Obama is granting more and more 'exemptions' to Obama care so that his favored big and medium businesses and is MOST favored Unions do not have to participate in Obama care, how is this working to get ALL people insured and access to medical care?

-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 19, 2011, at 2:48 AM

Back in the Day... I can post tons of quotes from MLK Jr... and most of them would NOT hint that he would be in favor of the NAACP covering up George Washington... lol

-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 19, 2011, at 2:45 AM

He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it.

Martin Luther King, Jr.

-- Posted by Back in the day on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 11:06 PM

Much of the opposition to the health care reform from the public is falling off. As many are figuring out that the health care bill isnt as bad as many from the right said it was.


-- Posted by miss october on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 9:44 PM

The Left Creates a Climate of Hate


Who really keeps us divided?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 9:31 PM


The Republicans have plenty to worry about as they have to sort out which of them they consider Presidential. For some reason they dont get it because the fringe right such as those who watch Fox and listen to Rush are going to vote Republican anyway. So why are they so worried about the radicals speaking out against them when those closer to the middle of the spectrum will decide the election that is if the young voters dont come out in 2012.

-- Posted by miss october on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 9:23 PM

W t f... regarding the T-shirt... I was not uncalm... lol just pointing out that normal, respectful, people do not need the pep rally atmosphere that reminds them of Obama's campaign rallies.... it was NOT the time nor the place for that type of atmosphere... I could almost excuse the cheering and inappropriate clapping (NOT all clapping was inappropriate) but when they BOOd the Governor of the State of AZ THAT was unacceptable for this type of event that was supposed to be about the victims and their families and NOT about the ego of Obama, or his attempts to make this about his political campaign.

-- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 8:34 PM

Along with Obama demanding that religious symbols be covered up during his speeches, YET for political gain he can invoke God and religious scriptures during a "pep" rally like attempt at speaking at a memorial service..... NOW we have the following example of POOR TASTE and Racism


-- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 8:30 PM

Cheesy will at least respond to my comment in rebuttal of yours this time? OR are you not brave enough to face FACTS?

(Inside Parentheses are my comments)

Here is a list of potential 2012 Republican presidential candidates and what sets them apart.

Sarah Palin-Crosshairs, Bad shot, Death panels. She keeps trying to make the idea of death panels stick to health care reform, yet she keeps changing her mind on who will decide who lives and who dies. (Democrat Leadership Committee, created by Bob Beckel A MAP with TARGETS over Republican "targets" same as a cross hair) (Obama said he was bring a gun to the fight with Republicans, Biden is going to STRANGLE all that disagree with him and the list of GUN and WEAPONS comments is endless from the left as with the right since historically they have ALWAYS compared politics to war because it is a fight between philosophies.)

Mile Huckabee supported cap and trade in 2007 but now has flip-flopped since its now unpopular among Republicans. (Who cares)

Mitt Romney's healthcare for citizens of Mass has many similarities to the Health care reform act just passed by congress last year. So is Health care reform only a good idea when Republicans pass it? (Romney care is being show to be TOO expensive to support)

Tim Pawlenty still doesnt know how to read jobs reports as he still thinks that public sector job growth is on the rise and continues to state it as such, so maybe he is just trying to increase fear of big government is going to take your money and guns. (are you saying that the progressive agenda is NOT to remove guns and that they are not already taking your money?)

-- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 8:29 PM

Funny but a sad state of affairs... and yes...I copied from a friend

Preisdent Hu: "Good evening Mr. Obama, please, have a seat."

President Obama: "Thank you Mr. Jinato, don't mind if I do!"

President Hu: "Excellent, now, Mr. Obama.. my people have told me that you have not been making payments on the funds bo...rrowed, is this true?"

President Obama: "Uhh... you must have gotten your information from Sarah Palin."

President Hu: "Mr. Obama, I have no idea who that is, but if Sarah Palin is a transliteration for this financial statement right here in my hand, I certainly have."

President Obama: "[muttering to self] Oh s***, that really DOESN'T work in real life negotiations..[/], look man.. I'll have your money by next week.. just let me go back to my country and get it from the Federal Reserve.."

President Hu: " So, you are going to print more IOUs and then pay with them?"

President Obama: "Of course.. United States currency is the standard bearer!"

President Hu: "That was only when you actually had the currency in proportion to the amount of gold you have, without inflation, which was about 70 years ago."

President Obama: "Look.. I don't know about all that hate speech, racism and rhetoric you just said.. but I know I'm going to have your money by next week."

President Hu: "No, you won't Mr. Obama."

President Obama: "....."

President Hu: "This meeting is adjourned Mr. President."

President Obama: "I ended this meeting first.."

President Hu: "Fantastic, now go back to your country and tell your press that nearly half of your country belongs to China."

President Obama: "I will, in fact-- in my country that translates to we need to raise taxes and spend more money we don't have."

President Hu: "Yes, yes it does, and by this same time next year, you will be re-named the United States of China."

President Obama: "Whatever.."

-- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 8:24 PM


Your post about the Repuplicans candidates raises more questions about where we are headed. Obama has alienated his base, but appears more presidential and more like a leader by putting the country ahead of partsian politics on occasion recently.

The Republican candidates appear to be already trying to appeal to the radical wing of their party which seems to leave Indepedents like myself scratching my head. This is something thats common with members running for the house, but not for those that want to be President.

If I remember correctly Obama and Mccain both won their respected parties due to the Independents that voted for them in the majority of the states. So by assuming all the Independents are going to move more towards the right due to radical policies and appeasment of the radicals such as the Tea Party they will have another thing coming in the elections of 2012.

If any of these Republicans want to be considered Presidential they must come out with a voice of reason and honesty now and not before their poll numbers slip and they realize they cant win by joining the movement of fringe politics and obstructionism.

-- Posted by Back in the day on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 3:04 PM

If the Tea Party wants to achieve sucess they must stay away from the Republicans. Just a clip of some Republicans who have helped tarnish the Tea party's image.


-- Posted by miss october on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 1:56 PM

Common sense: The antidote to too much government.


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 11:59 AM


Thank you. I take it that is from my saying the "church is a business?

Dictionary meanings not withstandind. The church is a "business". Everything is a business.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 11:49 AM


Just some definitions from Websters, no personal spin on any of the terms.

business (noun)

an occupation, profession, or trade: His business is poultry farming.

religion (noun)

a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.

church (noun)

a building for public Christian worship.

-- Posted by Who on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 11:44 AM

Here is a list of potential 2012 Republican presidential candidates and what sets them apart.

Sarah Palin-Crosshairs, Bad shot, Death panels. She keeps trying to make the idea of death panels stick to health care reform, yet she keeps changing her mind on who will decide who lives and who dies.

Mile Huckabee supported cap and trade in 2007 but now has flip-flopped since its now unpopular among Republicans.

Mitt Romney's healthcare for citizens of Mass has many similarities to the Health care reform act just passed by congress last year. So is Health care reform only a good idea when Republicans pass it?

Tim Pawlenty still doesnt know how to read jobs reports as he still thinks that public sector job growth is on the rise and continues to state it as such, so maybe he is just trying to increase fear of big government is going to take your money and guns.

-- Posted by cheesehead on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 10:41 AM

If 7 out 10 Republicans agreed with the way the President handled the memorial then what does that say about the few that don't agree?

-- Posted by cheesehead on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 10:28 AM

Here xray,

Now maybe you can calm down a little bit.

But I doubt it.


-- Posted by What the f...... on Tue, Jan 18, 2011, at 5:50 AM

The way I see it, the AZ memorial was the FIRST action and the first stop of the Re-elect Obama in 2012 campaign trail... the Obama Campaign T-shirts, the concession stands selling soda and popcorn, the hooping and hollaring the BOOing of the AZ State Governor during what was supposed to be a RESPECTFUL, Solemn occasion to remember those killed, injured and their familes.

I find it SAD that a politician and those working for his 2012 campaign took advantage of a horrible situation to gain political points

If Republicans would have had the whole T-shirts with Bush Slogans and hooped and hollared at a 9/11 memorial service the DEMS would have had a fit!!!!!!!!!

-- Posted by mrxray on Mon, Jan 17, 2011, at 11:51 PM

Nearly 80% of Americans polled agreed with President Obama's response to the shooting in Arizona while only 30% agree with Palin's response to the shooting.


-- Posted by Back in the day on Mon, Jan 17, 2011, at 10:26 PM

I love that SNL video but I hope Fox news really decides to be a bit more civil in their news reports.

-- Posted by Back in the day on Mon, Jan 17, 2011, at 10:13 PM

Why We Must Repeal Obamacare

The business they're in is health insurance for a profit.Obama is wiping the profit out.


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Mon, Jan 17, 2011, at 9:52 PM

Jihadists Promote Theft to Fund War on West


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Mon, Jan 17, 2011, at 9:44 PM

After Blaming the Right for Arizona Shooting, Some in Media Won't Let Go, Analyst Says


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Mon, Jan 17, 2011, at 9:43 PM

This is too funny!. Saturday Night live mocks Fox News for their false claims of a new civility.


-- Posted by cheesehead on Mon, Jan 17, 2011, at 1:36 PM

Russian immigrants say that focusing on 'income redistribution' and 'class warfare' of the rich vs. poor is too socialistic.


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Mon, Jan 17, 2011, at 8:26 AM

It is so sad to see that this young man caused so much horror and destruction of life. One of the shooting victims was so upset that he threatened a Tea Party Representative at a filming of a post-shooting abd news TV Special.... It is sad to see the victim turn into an offender.

I hope he gets help.

It would be easy to blame the left media outlets and Left talking heads and the Sheriff of Pima County for making false and premature accusations about the Right wingers causing this shooting which in turn led this shooting victim to falsely believe a false news story. It is even easier to make a connect between shoddy news reporting and false statements from someone who is supposed to deal with facts of an investigation as a duly elected Sheriff, than it ever was to draw a line of connection between right wing talking heads causing this horrible shooting in AZ.... at least the lies were ACTUALLY told and recorded on TV so we have proof that these lies probably misled this shooting victim and added to the shock, horror and trauma and the stages of grief that follow this type of action..

I wonder if the lefty talking heads and those Democrats in DC who blamed Republicans and Tea Partiers will have the integrity to step up and admit that they contributed to this situation with the shooting victim.



-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jan 16, 2011, at 11:52 PM

news... I scanned down throught the comments and could not find the one of mine you were refereing to... so I have to go on my faulty memory...

if you are refering to a post about the Sheriff of Pima County and Obama getting in the way of successful prosecution of the Federal Judge then you are off on the wrong track... I never said that they guy would not be prosecuted or not found guilty and punished... I only mentioned that by the Sheriff of Pima County and others, like Obama saying that the Judge just happened to be in the area and stopped by to say "hi" could prevent the prosecution of the shooting of the Federal judge under Federal Law and mess up the case that the FBI was trying to build by saying the Judge was there on official duty to meet and discuss something with the Congress Woman...

-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jan 16, 2011, at 11:44 PM

Taliban May Lift Ban on Education for Women


Such nice people!

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Jan 16, 2011, at 10:38 AM



Amazing that we can even feed ourself without a 'certified' kitchen and a 'certified' food manager. Simply amazing and we wonder why people don't step up and help more when government stands in the way.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Jan 16, 2011, at 9:06 AM


In response to your "...good advice for all lefties..." comment,...

...I would like to point out we would all like to see justice prevail -- right mate? That's what we want, Right? Justice is our goal, right?

I think its pretty clear that we all want and expect a fairly easy prosectuion of this case. Unless we learn that there were co-conspiritors, then its a pretty open and shut case. There were quite a number of eye witnesses of good character. I think the jury will find their testimoney most compelling. Then there is the physical evidence, the weapon, the gun poweder burns on his hands, the empty shells, the bullets, you know, all that farensics stuff.

I am pretty confident that this fellow will be convicted with no problem. The only real question at this point is whether or not he gets the death penalty.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 15, 2011, at 7:27 PM

Ok Nana if you posted a similar link which way would it lean?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sat, Jan 15, 2011, at 8:14 AM


Congressman Louis Gohmert, former prosecutor and judge give advice to the Sheriff of Pima County, AZ... good advice for all the lefties... LOL

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 15, 2011, at 2:25 AM


anything that does not match the OPINION of someone on the left, according to their own words, does not matter, is just wrong and is inarguable simply because they state that this is so...

Like the fact that this shooting had NOTHING to do with any political rhetoric... left was wrong for brining it up for political gain at the expense of a horrible mass shooting....

Or the fact that they cannot admit that the left uses equally violent words and actions... they say that this is not true or that somehow when the left does it then it is justified or 'not as bad' ... simply because they state that it is so.

But, we will all be cured AFTER the Dems pass a resolution to force people to hold hands and sit in an alternating Dem/Repub setup up in Congress... lol

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 15, 2011, at 12:12 AM

LEFT violence and not just to property... like it some how makes the left's violence ok since Nanadot claims it is never against people.


-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 15, 2011, at 12:06 AM

just in case you dont look at that last link... M Malkin describes the numerous times that the main stream media outlets and Leftist and Democrats have jumped the gun and blamed right wingers and right wing rhetoric for horrible events before the facts are obtained and sometimes before the event is even to the investigation stage.

April 2009, Pittsburg, man shoots police officers, turns out NOT the right wingers fault but the fault of a mad man who is unemployed

April 2009 Jiverly Voong shoots up immigration center in NY, no evidence of any right wingers influence..

June 2009 Shooting of guard at Holocaust Museum, DC..not the right wingers but... unstable, equal-opportunity hater and 9/11 Truther conspiracy loon who bashed Jews and Christians, George W. Bush and Fox News, and had also threatened the conservative Weekly Standard magazine.

Aug 2009, Colorado Dem Party windows smashed...by...NOT the right wingers but... "far Left transgender activist/single-payer anarchist who had worked for a labor union-tied political committee and canvassed for a Democrat candidate."

Sept 2009 Bill Sparkman...found dead with the word Fed written on his chest and rope around his neck.. accused of being murdered by right wingers..you know those evil southern rednecks This turned out to be suicide that he tried to make look like murder.....

Feb 2010, Amy Bishop... Alabama college professor. Shot 3 fellow professors. Bishop was an Obama-worshiping academic who also shot her own brother in 1986.

May 2010, Mayor Bloomberg tried to blame right wingers for the Times Square Bombing attempt but it was an Islamist Jihadist.

August 2010, Missouri's Russ Carnahan's office was fire bombed... Carnahan blamed right wingers, tea partiers... in fact it was... NOT a right winger or tea partier but....A Disgruntled progressive activist Chris Powers, enraged over a paycheck dispute.

The point is that political rhetoric did NOT cause the AZ shooting AND the Sheriff of Pima County Jumped the gun in saying that it did and his blatant disregard for the truth by saying on TV that it was people like Limbaugh and Palin and other right wingers when there was NO INVESTIGATION completed and no evidence to suggest it. This is a horrible example of leftist talking heads and main stream media outlets taking something they DESIRE to happen and trying to make a bad situation fit their desires because of irrational HATE for anyone with whom they simply disagree with politically.

-- Posted by mrxray on Fri, Jan 14, 2011, at 11:47 PM

nandot... the article starts out saying exactly what I stated, that this shooting was a result of right wing political rhetoric in the authors opinion... lol

Here are some great examples of events that have occurred that the leftist media outlets and talking heads and dems and mayors and other left leaning political types have rashly and prematurely jumped to blame right wing radicals... not once have any of those people retracted or apologized for their rash and hate-filled statements...


-- Posted by mrxray on Fri, Jan 14, 2011, at 10:40 PM

wtf you are correct... the memorial... a place for quiet reflection, respect, not Campaign T Shirts, loud clapping and hoopin and hollarin or booing the Governor of AZ.

-- Posted by mrxray on Fri, Jan 14, 2011, at 10:25 PM

Compare the Campaign atmosphere of the memorial service in Tuscon, where the Mayor of this town was not even invited to speak, where the Governor of AZ was disrepectfully booed (Example of leftist hypocrisy regarding hateful speech and behavior) to where there was loud cheering and clapping, to the campaign T-shirts that showed the white and blue but not one fleck of Red; to the Memorial Ceremony that President Bush spoke at during his presidency.

You will note that during the memorial service at Va Tech that not one COLLEGE STUDENT hooped or hollared or clapped nor did President Bush have a long winded, all about me, campaign event attitude.


-- Posted by mrxray on Fri, Jan 14, 2011, at 10:23 PM

President Obama tried to comfort and give support at the memorial in Arizona, yet Fox news finds every reason to critize everyone from the President to the students who attended this memorial. Please everyone watch this video from Jon Stewart. Please repost this link so everyone has a chance to watch this video.


-- Posted by cheesehead on Fri, Jan 14, 2011, at 7:37 PM

You know, now would be a time for President Obama to give a speech on inflation so he can stop that dead in its tracks.



-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Fri, Jan 14, 2011, at 5:47 PM

Conservative vs. Liberal Beliefs

Interesting side by side comparison.


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Fri, Jan 14, 2011, at 5:36 PM


Good post, someone has to keep them honest. When is the last time you seen a crowd full of liberals carying automatic or semi-automatic guns to a rally or political event. Its not very often you see a left wing extremist with a gun at all as they are usually against gun use.

-- Posted by cheesehead on Fri, Jan 14, 2011, at 3:36 PM

NanaDot I may not see eye to eye with you on most of the subjects here but you do make me think and for that I thank you

-- Posted by Gal66 on Fri, Jan 14, 2011, at 10:44 AM


Technically what you saw wasn't the funeral, that was yesterday.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Fri, Jan 14, 2011, at 7:03 AM

Just an observation on my part.... I turned on the TV and it was in the middle of Obama's speech at the little girl's funeral. I was appalled to listen to the loud cheering and clapping of the crowd in the background, when Obama was introduced the person speaking doing the introduction acted as if this was some of campaign stop for Obama instead of showing reverence for the gravity of the situation. Then the crowd cheering and clapping made me think this even more. Then after the fact, I learned that Team Obama gave out Campaign like T-shirts for people to wear.

I am not sure who was responsible for any of this, and I am not blaming Obama for it, unless at some point someone blows the whistle and says this is what Obama wanted. I wont jump the gun like the talking heads did in blaming the right wingers for this shooting. I was just put off by the atmosphere of those in the background, like it was maybe lots of college students who were acting inappropriately. A funeral or memorial ceremony for something of this nature is not the time for this type of behavior.

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 11:47 PM

nana,... your so called "perspective" makes a basically false presumption that this act was incited by political rhetoric and relies on the VERY biased Southern Poverty law Center. AND it leaves out many things that have occurred on the left. But the main point is that there is no evidence that this kid listened to any political TV or Radio or anything, EXECPT a RASH and POLITICAL sheriff jumping the gun and accusing the right wing political talking heads ONLY of being to blame for this horrible shooting WITHOUT proof and WITHOUT an completed investigation which is pretty unethical of a person involved with the investigation or an elected representative of the County of Pima.

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 11:42 PM


I also said "or other religions".

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 6:27 PM

Does anyone remember when Eisenhower(Republican)defended his friend JFK against the radicals(Eisenhower often thought as radicals as those who wanted to abolish taxes and the ability for Amercians to unionize)even though they were political opposites?

Sometimes I think this is what that is missing today in politics as one politician is often worried more about pleasing his/her base than about things said or actions towards their collegues due to the fact they are enemies in the polical arena.

Does anyone agree that if members of congress took more actions to defend each other even when they are separate parties that Americans might do so more often?

-- Posted by Back in the day on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 6:20 PM

Newsacross... dude I never mentioned YOU specifically regarding statements about the evils of the right wingers... I never mentioned you at all... only that I read multiple posts about the evils of the right while playing off what the left has done and said that is similar and even exactly the same.

But I am all for more 3rd party candidates or any candidates that refuse to play the established political game and stand up to those long term career politicians and the special interst groups that want to buy them off.

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 5:41 PM

W t f... hmm EVERY religion has the opportunity to be a tax free entity, not only christianity.

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 5:37 PM

News.... I have no clue what you are talking about... if you have a problem with something you consider a generality, then please feel free to tell me exactly which point you are refering to... otherwise your comment is pointless as it points to nothing...lol

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 5:28 PM


When Obama himself says you can't have a nativity scene on the courthouse lawn, let me know. You and I both know what seperation of church and state means, however, I feel that if Christians or any other religion that could get away with could have their religion established as the official American religion, they would jump at the chance. That is something I would have a problem with. But, then again what other businesses enjoy such a tax exempt status? Pretty sweet deal, huh? How much is enough? Complete theological control of our democratic process as well?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 5:26 PM

Wow a dulpicate posting...now how the heck did that happen?

Well the version on top is the best one lol lol lol.

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 4:38 PM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
Happens occasionally. I deleted the first one. Thanks.


If you check my postings, you will see that I certainly have pointed out that both Republicans and Democrats are guilty of some pretty nasty policies, behavior, and rhetoric since 2000 when Bush was appointed to the Presidency by the 1 vote Republican majority on the Supreme Court.

As I have pointed out, these 2 parties are actually one party since there is very little significant difference in policy or ideology.

Its time for 3rd parties to make headway in Washington.

Here in Australia our Senate is controlled by the Green Party because more and more folks had the courage to cast their votes for that 3rd party despite critics claiming 3rd party votes were wasted. In the last election here, the ruling Labour Party and the opposition Liberal Party both lacked a majority in Parliment, and now the Labour Party has been forced into an uneasy alliance with several independents and the Green Party. A future Green Party Prime Minister, once thought an impossibility here, is now seen as not only possible but probable sometime in the near future.

There is no reason in the World that we must only have these 2 major parties in Washington. Clearly the irresponsible rhetoric, the failed economic policies, the unlimited military spending and the massive debt it has created, demonstrate that neither major party is capable of responsible government management.

Here is an interesting article about how 3rd party alliances in the USA are beginning to make the possiblility of new players in Washington a strong probablility in the near future that further illustrates my point.

"Nader: Progressive-libertarian alliance 'the most exciting new political dynamic' in US"


The trend has already started and many on both the right and the left and in the middle are fed up with the antics and rhetorical games being played out by the Republicans and the Democrats. Real change is coming and it will probably take the form of a major 3rd party.

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 4:37 PM


You sure are talking a lot of generalities that sound completely made up to me there buddy.

Don't just say it, prove it.

'Cause mate, I may have dual citizenship but trust me, I am from Missouri so you will have to "Show Me."

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 3:58 PM

Dissent and angry opposition to a government entity that is running rampant and spending our way into destruction is something that is needed to make our politicians listen to us common folk.

"Dissent is the highest form of patriotism" Thomas Jefferson. however it seems as if people on the left cannot handle dissent and ONLY want to force the right to be silent by attempting to pass laws to make neutrality laws or to make laws banning certain types of speech or telling state employees that they are banned from talking on talk radio shows..... dictators in Venzeula, North Korea, Iran and other nations are ALWAYS trying to silence their enemies and opponents. In the US they are trying to do it under the guise of laws and with intimidation tactics

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 3:25 PM

lol, you guys are funny. You all post link and comments about how horrible the right are and when people make any reply about how hypocritical you are being by refusing to acknowledge that your side is doing the exact same thing.

I read over and over about how horrible the right is and how evil the rich guy is and how evil the big corporations are...

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 3:20 PM

miss o,

Im still here and you are right I tried to post about several madmen that claimed to be inspired by Fox media and even with links but it didnt get posted.

Also are we not allowed to show hate speech by Fox news anymore due to the YMCA and it allowing such to be played in a community setting and if not why are some voices allowed to attack left wing media outlets without us doing the same?

If you read the last 10 posts or so Gal you will see exactly what she is talking about? Eric could you please clarify this rule for us specifically because it does seem a bit leaning. I have checked your link, but I cant still find a clear answer on what is exactly going on.

If left leaning networks are fair game than why not Fox news?

-- Posted by cheesehead on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 1:45 PM

miss october How do you not see that as an attack on Eric?

I have been reading and posting here for some time and I have see things deleated from both the right and the left so in my opinion your way off base!

-- Posted by Gal66 on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 11:20 AM

I know you read this forum Eric Crump and you see the continous attactks from the right and you are allowing this. If we try to post statements showing examples of right wing hate its not posted, but you allow the right to do the same.

It also appears cheesehead was kicked from the blog and im quite sure he was probably just speaking out against what the editor unfairly allows with attacks from the right. Eric you have been successful in silencing those on the left to allow more of the same from those you support. This isnt attack on you but anyone reading this can tell.

-- Posted by miss october on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 10:41 AM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
No one has been banned of late.

"Tact is the knack of making a point without making an enemy."


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 13, 2011, at 7:53 AM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
Thank you for posting this! It's a succinct expression of our comment policy.

Alec Baldwin: 1998 on Conan And he wants to run for office?

"I was in Africa. I go to Africa. I mean ladies and gentlemen I am in Africa. For three months I am in the bush and I come back. I come back here and I come back to what? I mean what is happening right now as we speak? Right now the Judiciary Committee, the President has an approval rating of 68 percent. The President is very popular and things are going pretty good and they are voting to impeach the President. They voted on one article of impeachment already. And I come back from Africa to stained dresses and cigars and this and impeachment. I am thinking to myself in other countries they are laughing at us twenty four hours a day and I'm thinking to myself if we were in other countries, we would all right now, all of us together, [starts to shout] all of us together would go down to Washington and we would stone Henry Hyde to death! We would stone him to death! [crowd cheers] Wait! Shut up! Shut up! No shut up! I'm not finished. We would stone Henry Hyde to death and we would go to their homes and we'd kill their wives and their children. We would kill their families. [stands up screaming] What is happening in this country? What is happening? UGHHH UGHHH!!!!"

"Rush Limbaugh is beginning to look more and more like Mr. Big, and at some point somebody's going to jam a CO2 pellet into his head and he's going to explode like a giant blimp. That day may come. Not yet, but we'll be there to watch." -- Chris Matthews on MSNBC's Morning Meeting, Oct. 13, 2009.

"So, Michele, slit your wrist! Go ahead! I mean, you know, why not? I mean, if you want to -- or, you know, do us all a better thing. Move that knife up about two feet. I mean, start right at the collarbone." -- Montel Williams talking about Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minn.) on Air America's Montel Across America, Sept. 2, 2009.

"He is an enemy of the country, in my opinion, Dick Cheney is, he is an enemy of the country.... You know, Lord, take him to the Promised Land, will you? See, I don't even wish the guy goes to Hell, I just want to get him the hell out of here." -- Ed Schultz, The Ed Schultz Show, May 11, 2009.

"I'm waiting for the day when I pick it up, pick up a newspaper or click on the Internet and find out he's choked to death on his own throat fat or a great big wad of saliva or something, you know, whatever. Go away, Rush, you make me sick!" -- Radio host Mike Malloy on the Jan. 4, 2010 Mike Malloy Show.

"I'm just saying if he [Dick Cheney] did die, other people, more people would live. That's a fact." -- Bill Maher on his HBO show Real Time, Mar. 2, 2007,

After then-Sen. Jesse Helms (R-N.C.) said that the federal government was spending too much money on AIDS, National Public Radio's Nina Totenberg, on the July 8, 1995 edition of Inside Washington, said, "I think he ought to be worried about what's going on in the Good Lord's mind, because if there is retributive justice, he'll get AIDS from a transfusion, or one of his grandchildren will get it."

On the Nov. 4, 1994 edition of PBS's To the Contrary, then-USA Today columnist and Pacifica Radio talk show host Julianne Malveaux said of Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas: "I hope his wife feeds him lots of eggs and butter and he dies early like many black men do, of heart disease. ... He is an absolutely reprehensible person."

Hillary Clinton

Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton said Wednesday that the Arizona shooter who killed six and injured 14, including Arizona Rep. Gabrielle Giffords (D), was motivated by political views.

In an interview with CNN Wednesday Clinton, who had recently referred to the shooter as an "extremist," doubled down on her comments saying that the shooter was an extremist who acted on his "bizarre" political views.

"Based on what I know, this is a criminal defendant who was in some ways motivated by his own political views, who had a particular animus toward the congresswoman," Clinton said. "And I think when you cross the line from expressing opinions that are of conflicting differences in our political environment into taking action, that's violent action, that's a hallmark of extremism, whether it comes from the right, the left, from al Qaeda, from anarchists, whoever it is. That is a form of extremism. So yes, I think that when you're a criminal who is in some way pursuing criminal activity connected to -- however bizarre and poorly thought through -- your political views, that's a form of extremism

-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 8:57 PM

lol WTF... I only said that to stir you up...

However, how is obama invoking God and scripture any different from a nativity scene on a court house lawn?

-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 8:50 PM


He and you can talk about God anytime you want but that is a far cry from using religion to legislate.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 8:31 PM


I like that saying rr. Its pretty funny and probably usually true lol.

-- Posted by news across on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 8:30 PM

Yea I hear you News my mother is in her 80's but thank goodness she is happy to stay in when the weather gets like this. She lives in town so she can get her groceries and prescriptions delivered to her if I can't make it. She only gets out if the weather is nice so I call her often to see if she needs anything.

You know what they say about big farmers they don't want all the land just what is next to them.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 8:24 PM

so much for the whole separation of church and state... Obama just invoked words and references within the bible and God....

-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 7:48 PM

Oh rr,

I almost forget to tell you a kind of funny story you might like about the Gores.

I have a good friend that lives in Carthage, Tennessee. He owns a large farm there that borders the Gore farm. When Al Gore Senior was still alive, my friend told me Al Sr. would try to move his fences a few hundred feet onto my friends land every year, and every year they would have a big fight about it and often times it took a court order to get Al Sr. off his land. It really used to infuriate him and I don't blame him for being upset about it. But it just goes to show that the Gores can be just like any other rich family and it has to make you wonder what other things the Gores did to get rich.

Anyway, I thought you might enjoy that story. It is a true story and it sheds a little light on the Gores that a lot of folks may not know.

-- Posted by news across on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 7:05 PM


Yeah I have been keeping up with the weather there. I worry a lot about my Mom and Dad with that cold weather. Dad is in his 80s but he thinks he can do things he did when he was 30 lol lol lol. I have been telling him to just stay in the house until it warms up...but you know how stuborn some old folks can be...and us middle aged folks too lol.

Anyway, while we are having a lot of flooding in Queensland here (3/4 of Queensland is a flood plain the size of Texas right now), down here in New South Wales the weather is great. I often laugh at the Aussies when they complain about the Winter here which has normal day time temps of 60 to 70 degrees and often times climbs to 75 on an average Winter day. I tell them that if they want to know what real Winter is then just head on out to Missouri in January.

Try to stay warm there buddy. You know it won't be long and you will be able to enjoy another beautiful Missouri Spring.

-- Posted by news across on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 6:57 PM

Xray don't forget abortion it has been the cause of at least one doctor to be murdered(not to mention 50 million babies) but we really should make hate speech illegal though thats the big problem. Isn't it?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 6:14 PM

Sarah Palin's Prebuttal to Obama

They marvel at how she has made herself bigger than the president in this story.


Happy Birthday El Rushbo

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 6:10 PM

Miss October.. and you tried to claim that the Pima county Sheriff Dupnik was not playing politics? Why is that he is now ignoring death threats toward other political people?


-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 4:28 PM

I am going to repost this question just to see if we can discuss it or if it will be ignored.

The leftists and the Dems and the leftist media outlets are blaming the rhetoric from right leaning outlets for this AZ shooting. In essence they are saying that right slanted media shows and discussions are influencing the minds and actions of a young person... that right wing rhetoric from media sources DID influence this young person and caused him to shoot all those people in AZ.

On the other, hand these EXACT SAME people deny that TV, Movies, Celebrities, Video games and commercial, that show sex, violence, and words that demean women and discuss things like murder and cop killing and the like.

Exactly how can you state that ONE media type can influence a young man into killing people while other, more visual and audio stimulating sources do not?

-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 3:46 PM

By the way... I LOVE it when you lefties cannot handle it when you accuse the right for being responsible for some horrible action by a horrible person and then when exact same things that the lefties do are shown to you, you either ignore them or claim the lefties actions did not mean anything...

-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 3:41 PM

To summarize...

WHAT silly person, OTHER than Gore and some scientists being swayed by millions of dollars in grant money would expect a reasonable person to view the SCIENTISTS incorrect predictions regarding the global ice age that NEVER happened and then those same people with the same doomsday predictions are now saying global warming using the same types of computer models?

I am all for CONSERVATION and intelligent usage of our natural resources and also an aggressive program to encourage private industries to develop renewable energy sources WHILE AT THE SAME time using our OWN, within our borders, natural resources instead of being reliant on foreign sources... instead of banning drilling oil in the ocean for US companies and then allowing Cuba and other foreign nations to drill there instead, we should be using ALL of our resources and developing new ones at the same time....

They predicted an ice age that never came but still demanded the government "fix it" They predicted the total and complete usage of minerals and petro and natural gas and claimed that NO oil would be found in Kansas, Nebraska or California... they were wrong.... HOW many things can the same group of people be wrong about BEFORE people realize that they are nothing more than Chicken Little herself... ?

-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 3:39 PM

Well... global warming, climate change, and now back to the potential of an ice age again... If you have not heard those predictions regarding the new coming ice age you can probably do a search for them and find some articles... that is not my point

In the 1970s many scientists predicted a doomsday ice age and that GOVERNMENTS needed to fix policies to prevent this global disaster. Now, revisionist history tries to say that there not many scientists on board and that more scientists were predicting warming... however....

For those of us grounded in reality regarding climate the whole "Chicken little the sky is falling" predictions that are used as an attempt to push and change police while the science is based on preconcieved ideals based on what "outcomes" will generate the most Grant money and not honest science. Here is the prediction from 1971 by Obama's climate czar Holdren who predicted doomsday ICE AGE problems such as this quote

"The effects of a new ice age on agriculture and the supportability of large human populations scarcely need elaboration here. Even more dramatic results are possible, however; for instance, a sudden outward slumping in the Antarctic ice cap, induced by added weight, could generate a tidal wave of proportions unprecedented in recorded history"


"If man survives the comparatively short-term threat of making the planet too cold, there is every indication he is quite capable of making it too warm not long thereafter. For the remaining major means of interference with the global heat balance is the release of energy from fossil and nuclear fuels. As pointed out previously, all this energy is ultimately degraded to heat. What are today scattered local effects of its disposition will in time, with the continued growth of population and energy consumption, give way to global warming. ... Again, the exact form such consequences might take is unknown; the melting of the ice caps with a concomitant 150-foot increase in sea level might be one of them"

Holdren drastically got the prediction WRONG yet we are supposed to believe that this leftist leaning radical, who follows the progressive play book of never letting a crisis go to waste is somehow correct in THIS prediction about global warming? I mean they have already had to revise their global warming predictions to climate change... LIKE Somehow BEFORE man or BEFORE the evil corporations and the EVIL rich people in the US who ONLY exploit the poor people and our resources there was ever climate change?

As for 1970s science regarding the predicted doomsday ice age:

James E Hansen, a NASA scientist who has publicly critized Bush for ignoring Global warming and the crisis that it is supposed to be, ALSO predicted as a NASA scientist that there would be an ICE AGE in the 1970s... Hansen, along with fellow NASA scientist predicted the upcoming Ice age within 50 years of the 1970s...as you can see from the data, Hansen was the creator of a "computer model" that was predicting the ice age that warned of huge and southward sweeping glaciers that would cause mankind to die off... Now I wonder how ANYONE with any logical mental process can NOW believe a "computer model" that NASA uses to make long term climate projections can be trusted? One of the things they claimed was that fossil fuel "Dust" would cloud the atmosphere and cause the Earths average temps to drop 6-7 degrees... OH.... the big bad EVIL oil companies were to blame back then as they are now!!!!!




THE CIA... central intelligence agency... predicts ice age as well..


Here is an interesting article... a Stanford University Professor has BANNED anyone from using his old interviews where he predicts the global ICE age back in the 1970s.. which is ironic since NOW he is a Global warming predicter...


The FIRST Earth Day in 1969 predicted the Ice age and its doomsday effects by Nigel Calder. This article also has some ironic predictions about global resources such as gold, silver, copper, oil, natural gas and how we would run out by 1985... Also, reference to the fact that England would not exist by the year 2000....


This link has a bunch of links to journalists and scientists articles from the 1970s regarding their INCORRECT predictions


Here is a common sense article about a common sense scientist who studied climate and changes in climate WITHOUT the intervention of government and prejudicial influences of monetary sources that influence outcomes...



-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 3:34 PM

You know you're right Phil but we have had temperature fluctuations(called weather) since this earth has been here and whether we have global warming/cooling or even climate change there is nothing we can do about it. God will end this world as we know it in his time and not before.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 3:13 PM

Wow wtf someone does actually believe this stuff. Heh! Heh! Heh!

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 2:27 PM


Really? Your stuck on some literal translation of simple terminology?


I'm old enough to have seen the actual changes in our weather patterns, are you? Wheter they be natural cycles or man made, these changes should not be ignored. Do you realize how you sound when you make such ill-informed FOX news like comments? Climate change or global warming,

the name doesn't matter but the results do. It's not a religion, you can't just make up stuff as you go along.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 2:13 PM

Get with the program rr3, now it's called climate change, thus allowing for cold temperatures also. I'd explain the science of it, but I'm sure someone who cares more about our flippant remarks on the issue will explain it better than I could anyway.

-- Posted by Philemon on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 1:44 PM

Thank you news.

It was about 0 degrees F here last night with wind chills -5 to -20 below F so I think we should all call Al Gore and congratulate him on the resolution to global warming and its success.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 10:49 AM


As an Australian citizen, I would like to thank all those kind Americans and the American Government, who have sent millions in assistance, for their kindness, charity, and help which is coming in to Australia from America at this difficult time.

As you may know, 3/4 of the State of Queensland is currently a flood plain almost the size of the State of Texas, Brisbane, our 3rd largest city is underwated, and the flooding continues with great loss of property and increasing loss of life. Our Nation is devestated.

Thanks to assistance and money sent by the USA, we are slowly making headway in rescuing people.

We in Australia thank you for all your help, your prayers, and your financial assistance at this most difficult time.

-- Posted by news across on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 2:32 AM


You write,

"Personal attacks on an individual poster I can see needs to be deleted. Relating the tone of this column to what happened in Tuscon is wrong and irrelevant. It going to severely limit the discussion on the political blog when you take away grouping the bad things the either conservatives or liberals do."

I agree 100% mate, and I think those are some of the wisest words I have read in this forum in a long time.

Thanks for making those important points.

-- Posted by news across on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 2:19 AM

here is a map with targets on a map... are targets different than cross hairs... NOPE... was this from a right wing website? NOPE



-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 1:38 AM

and since I am bored... here is another one


The leftists and their media networks are following the progressives and radicals on the left... never let a crisis go to waste.. this was what I was talking about when I was discussing knee jerk emotional responses not founded in anything fact or rationale, but ONLY in emotion OR an attempt to manipulate people immediately after a tragedy while emotions are high...

-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 12:47 AM


just for fun there is a Biggovernment sister website for all you lefties to make fun of...

YET you lefties heros Colbert and Jon Stewart agree with most of the NORMAL Americans that political rhetoric is not to blame... lol

-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 12:40 AM

After all of that here is the REAL question...

Is it not ironic that the left's stance is that this shooter and any other possible act of terrorism or shooting is blamed on someone being swayed by political debate, or right wing radicalism, YET they are the first bunch of people to jump up and claim that rap music talking of murder and horrible treatment of women, or that playing of violent video games or watching TV and Movies full of immorality and violence should NOT be censored because they claim there is NO way that this type of data input could EVER cause bad behavior or bad actions in teenagers or young adults?

-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 12:27 AM

Not only was this action and statment by Pima County Sheriff Dupnik regarding this AZ Shooting, he has been in the political game in AZ for some time, especially regarding his opposition the AZ immigration laws and his blatant disregard for AZ laws and open statements that said he would refuse to uphold this AZ law.....

so YES he is politically biased and he foolishly made a rash statement and hoped it would stick to the wall after he tossed it out there for all to read.....


-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 12:23 AM

Oh come on Miss Oct.

When a sheriff gets up and makes a statement immediately after something has occurred and BEFORE all the facts are in, and then blames it on right wing radicalism, ALL it is is political stagecraft or simple blatant bias that might jeopardize the federal prosecution of this person who shot and killed all those people.... how in the world can you think that the sheriff's actions were helpful or anything other than a political stunt?

Here is an interesting read... where the County of Pima had multiple interactions with this person due to alleged threats to kill people PRIOR to this horrible incident... maybe since the county did nothing to force this guy to get mentally evaluated or their lack of charging this guy when he threatened people, maybe this sheriff is trying to Cover his "you know what"

I think this is equally viable of an assumption as that of the sheriff jumping to conclusions based on political ideals immediately and during the confusion directly after this horrible event.

This is no different than mayor bloomberg jumping the gun in NYC and blaming a right wing radical for the Christmas Day Bombing attempt....

In fact, I think it is a strategic game plan by the left to find any and all incidents and to immediately blame the right wing radical and if the events dont bear this as being true then ignore and dodge and evade and NEVER acknowledge you were wrong NOR apologize.

Hows that for a conspiracy theory?

-- Posted by mrxray on Wed, Jan 12, 2011, at 12:14 AM

I think the anonymity of this column shouldn't define group comments as personal. Personal attacks on an individual poster I can see needs to be deleted. Relating the tone of this column to what happened in Tuscon is wrong and irrelevant. It going to severely limit the discussion on the political blog when you take away grouping the bad things the either conservatives or liberals do. I understand tightening the belt when the discussion becomes heated or personal but until then we should have latitude to freely discuss. Right now I think it is just a little too tight. I mean we have bars we have to drive to and people drink there and have to drive home. All of them don't drive home but a lot do and some get caught when they get out of hand. Delete when getting out of hand. Just my opinion.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 9:26 PM

It's getting hard to make anything stick.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 8:45 PM

At first it was scientists that politicians tried to debunk claiming they know more about global warming then the same politicians debunked economists claiming they know more about the economy.

Now the same people are trying to debunk the sheriff. Dont you people think the sheriff probably has a little more insight about the situation surrounding the shootings more than any talk radio host, politician, or news station?

-- Posted by miss october on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 8:26 PM

miss O.... what seemed harsh about an honest opinion?

-- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 8:12 PM

Sad that the party of our President are trying to figure out a way to blame their political opponents for the tragedy in Tuscon. We have to understand his advisors are telling him how to capitalize on this politically.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 7:58 PM

hmmm did it get removed? Was my truth about the Dems to honest for this DEMOCRAT NEWspaper?

Just curious EXACTLY which part of what I said caused it to be deleted.... is see responses to it but not my post.... lol


-- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 7:58 PM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:

What Obama Fears Most



-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 7:48 PM


That seems pretty harsh dont you think!

-- Posted by miss october on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 7:14 PM


I agree both Republicans and Democrats share responsiblity for making violent threats and they should be held accountable for that...but its no surprise since in fact there is almost no significant difference between these 2 parties and in fact they are the same party.

As to your claims that all those on the left wanted to target Bush...that clearly cannot be true since millions of American liberals, including me, strongly support the rule of law. There may have been some extremists on the left who made some inflamitory statements, as there are on the right, but most liberals condemn such behavior as it is contrary to an orderly society that operates within the rule of law.

As to Obama, he may have been a liberal at one time -- frankly he has always sounded pretty middle of the road to me -- but if he ever was liberal, it stopped the day he became President. Most of his policies are very similar to his predicessor, G. Bush, including his use of neo-classical economic policy and his pro-empire building, war-mongering foreign policies.

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 7:10 PM

I would like to add that one has to wonder how the recent shooting in Arizona might have gone if everyone there had been well armed. While certainly he would have gotten off a few shots, i think if everyone there had been armed he would have been gunned down and stopped within seconds of his first shot.

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 6:38 PM


I don't think there is any such thing as a supreme World government.

To date the USA remains firmly an independent and sovereign Nation and I believe there is no way the American People would tolerate the loss of that sovereignty...not without one heck of a fight and I don't know of any country that can out-gun the United States Military and Naval forces.

I do agree that the elite on both sides of the poltical asile do all they can to protect themselves from the masses. Our Founding Fathers certainly did. Our Founding Fathers were the elite of their time -- mostly very rich slave owners. They wrote a great deal about the danger of mob rule and how that concern was behind many of our Constitutional Ammendments.

Only a Constitutional Ammendment can modify another Constitutional Ammendment -- and that is a very slow, difficult, and uncertain process that is highly unlikely to occur with regard to the 2nd Ammendment.

Interstingly enough, while researching the Founding Fathers' intent with regard to an unrelated issue, I read a lot of what they had to say about the right to bare arms and what their intent with the 2nd Ammendment was.

I found that the Founding Fathers seemed to be almost unanimous in their support of the right of the People to own and carry weapons, and that they seemed to almost unanimously agree that in no way or form should the Federal or State Governments have any power to regulate gun owndership by free citizens. Jefferson in particular was very clear that his intent was to insure that the People could own and carry loaded weapons when and where ever they wanted to with of course exceptions where security and the well-being of the masses would be under threat -- such as a prison or jail. But other than those limited security concerns, he seemed to feel that all free citizens should and could own and carry weapons without any government -- Federal, State, or local -- infringment of that right.

In fact, I belive any regulations that address gun ownership by free citizens -- including laws that prohibit ex-cons who have fully paid their debt to society and mental patients or folks with a history of mental illness from owning and carrying weapons -- are unconstitutional.

Writing for the majority opinion, Justice Scallia was a bit unclear as to how future rulings may affect current restrictions that have not yet been struck down. He did say that he believes that the government does have some right to legislate some restrictions, however a future Court may indeed strike down all government regulations based upon the most recent Supreme Court precident. Reading the 2nd Ammendment and reading essays written post-ratification of the Constitution by many of our Founding Fathers, the 2nd Ammendment does not seem to make any exeptions to the right to own and carry weapons. The 2nd Ammendment seems fairly clear when it says,

"...the right of the People to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."


Nowhere in the 2nd Ammendment does it list exceptions to this, so I believe future Courts will eventually rule almost all government restrictions on gun ownership and the right to carry that gun are unconstitutional except where that right threatens the physical well-being of all the People -- such as with in a prison or jail or a mental hospital.

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 6:33 PM

News I did not say anyone was trying to take our guns I said if someone did they would be in for a fight.

I do agree with you in we need to elect our next leaders from a 3rd party.

-- Posted by Gal66 on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 6:13 PM

News I noticed you didn't say never in your statement. I don't think that we should be naive enough to think that the political elite will uphold the constitution or any other laws in our interest unless it will further their interest. I am convinced that the corruption runs so deep anything could happen. What about One World Government will our constitution be followed or even a valid document? Will we still be a sovereign nation?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 5:38 PM


The Supreme Court was very clear in their most recent decision -- our right to bear arms is absolute.

No one can or will take away your guns.

The Constitution clearly prohibits the Federal and State governments from regulating weapon ownership in any way...and this means all citizens including ex-cons and mental patients, everyone -- all adult Americans have and retain the right to bear arms -- so say our Founding Fathers.

U.S. Constitution, 2nd Ammendment


-- Posted by news across on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 4:07 PM

"Dem who called for Fla. governor to be 'shot' now pleads for 'civility'"


As I have said before, the problem is not just one party...but rather the problem is both major parties. Their is no significant difference between them.

We should throw everyone of these bums out and vote 3rd party and independent candidates only.

We need real change and we need it now -- but we won't get it from the 2 major parties.

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 3:56 PM

Back until you answer the question in my last post I am done with answering your questions as it seems I have made my point.

-- Posted by Gal66 on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 2:05 PM


Who do you think might try take your guns?

-- Posted by Back in the day on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 1:36 PM

Why do I need guns.

#1 Protection (Ask my Girlfriend about being robbed)

#2 I hunt

#3 I like to shoot paper

#4 It's my right

And for your other question I do not like to do this but I have to answer you question with a question.

How do you only get guns and fighting out of this?

"Back I consider myself somewhat centered in my views in that I don't think anyone has the right to tell a woman what she can do with her body, I do not care one way or another if 2 people of the same sex get married, as long as my kids are happy if they take a mate of the same sex or a different color of skin thats their business and I will support and love them period.

I do not mind giving anyone a helping hand but it will not last if they do not try to help themselves.

I do own guns and If anyone trys to take them they are in for a fight!

I think people should work for what they want and not live off the backs of others.

-- Posted by Gal66 on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 11:57 AM"

Back you seem to only be able to comprehend what you read if it's what you want to here!

-- Posted by Gal66 on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 12:49 PM


I would disagree with your statement you must be one o those on the right.

-- Posted by Back in the day on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 10:59 AM

The left is no better!


-- Posted by Gal66 on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 7:34 AM

You can buy into that if you want but it will only help to get laws restricting free speech which will no longer be free. Careful what you wish for.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 6:31 AM

The following link gives insight into the ramblings of Jerad Loughner, making sense of what appears gibberish to a lot of us. http://www.talk2action.org/story/2011/1/...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Jan 11, 2011, at 1:50 AM

So news how do people get guns and kill people that live where there is unfriendly gun laws?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Mon, Jan 10, 2011, at 8:57 PM

"'Gun-friendly laws' made Arizona shootings possible, Brady Center president tells Raw"


-- Posted by news across on Mon, Jan 10, 2011, at 8:21 PM

"Exclusive: America has 'reached the point of no return,' Reagan budget director warns"


Folks this is where the Democrats and Republicans are taking us.

We the People need a new deal because all we get from the 2 major parties are policies that seem designed to bring our Nation to its knees.

End the Wars! End the empire building! Bring our Troops home, and slash the big fat military budget that is running our economy into the ground.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Jan 10, 2011, at 8:08 PM

Hey Xray. Not much to disagree with in your latest comment. I can get on board with that. If we find that it isn't enough, we can later do more.

Thanks for calling attention to Soros, I had failed to mention powerful private individuals. It was just an oversight on my part. You did forget to mention the Koch brothers, the Soros equivalent on the right. I am sure that was just an oversight on your part. ;)

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Jan 10, 2011, at 12:59 PM

"Republicans banish 'civil rights' and 'civil liberties' from House subcommittee"


-- Posted by news across on Mon, Jan 10, 2011, at 5:44 AM

No need for a constitutional amendment. The problem is access to money and the power ego trip that you feel after becoming accustomed to the money that special interest groups give to politicians... not only big corporations, but Unions and people like George Soros and all his many different companies that he uses to front Obama and the progressive movement.

All you have to do is remove the money from the campaing process, and the lobbying process and create term limits so that the politicians know they will have to return to live amongst their constituents and earn their living back home. AND enact a law that says Congress can only vote to enact a law comprised of ONE law, with NO pork or extra provisions and laws used as negotiation... vote yea or nay on single issue bills

Without the corrupting money involved in the entire process(es) then the corporations or any other entity would not have the power to influence that they do.

-- Posted by mrxray on Mon, Jan 10, 2011, at 2:33 AM

Cheese what good will it do to send a petition to Palin? Sounds pretty crazy and off base to me. We have all these laws that is supposed to prevent something like this but he passed all of them and you want to sign a petition. Yea I bet that will put a stop to it.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 11:58 PM

I always grow weary with sadness when another tragedy such as this Arizona massacre, occurs. Today, as on all similar days I flashback to exactly where I was when I heard John Kennedy was killed. Dying along with Kennedy that day was my innocent idealism, and unbounded belief that we, all together, were going to make America a shining example to the world.

We, compelled by innate curiousity, begin to search for answers as soon as we hear the disheartening news. We may never get the complete answers that we frantically try to find in this, the immediate aftermath. Try we must, not only to assure that justice prevails, and that the full scope of the crime is revealed, but because we once again, must attempt to make sense of madness. There is some chance that justice may prevail, there is some chance that we will know all the details of the act, but there is no chance that we will ever make complete sense of the madness.


-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 11:12 PM

Typo correction:

I meant "assassination" in my previous comment. I apologize for any confusion the typo may have caused.

-- Posted by news across on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 6:47 PM

In regards to the terrorist attack on Congresswoman Gifford, as long as there are well known personalities calling for the assisnation of people on political grounds, there will be others ready to head the call and commit terrorist acts.

Yes its sad, and its also true.

-- Posted by news across on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 6:45 PM


Free speech is great thing but if you think that all the hateful rhetoric has made any difference then I think you are sorely mistaken.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 2:38 PM

Girl gets a year in jail, 100 lashes for adultery


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 10:41 AM

Remember Reagan


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 10:34 AM

Congresswoman Guifford being shot is a national tragedy. Funny how some want to put the blame anywhere but the shooter. This man was a 22 year old white male that made a bad decision. Those that proclaim free speech at any cost then wants to blame a criminals actions on what someone said. I know this guy has several things going against him for one being a white male, possibly a registered Republican and a Tea Party member.(Just an example of the rhetoric that will be forthcoming.)We can't blame Palin, the media, video games, the gun, etc. If we are such proponents of free speech why blame the actions of a criminal on what someone said? I think free speech really depends on who says it whether it is really free. What do you think?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 8:38 AM

News I appreciate and concur in your scorn for the Republican and Democrat parties. In my opinion they are both Corporatist tools for the most part. I use "tools" as a noun defined in at least two ways. ;)

You, I, and several others who post here, and are members of what many would consider the far left are unrelenting in our condemnation of both Democrats, and Republicans as well as their policies.

I often wonder why the far right, many of whom post here do not exhibit the same contempt of both parties. From the perspectives that they espouse they are as far removed, if not further removed from the mainstream as we. Yet they are utterly silent when it comes to criticism of Republicans, and without reserve in their criticism of Democrats.

It seems only yesterday that in a single voice, they pilloried Speaker Pelosi as if she ran the country, and in fact ran it into the ground. Now that the Republican Speaker Boehner is in office we hear nothing from them as to his succession. We hear no jubilation that one of their own is now in a position that they in their own words, when Pelosi was in office, indicated largely controls the course of our government. Nor do they curse him as a part of the establishment that they like we, believe has committed a grievous disservice to our country. On the point they remain strangely mute.

Another example of their refusal to critically examine, and give voice to such examination is their refusal to discuss the massive failings of the eight years of the Bush Administration. When the subject is broached they do not disagree. Instead they either say that it is not pertinent because it is the past, and nothing can be done about that, or when pressed, lamely fall back on the excuse that it really started with the Clinton Administration, and proceed to rail against Clinton's policies.

It makes me laugh to see them so easily give up their demurrer that the Bush Administration is the past, so not worthy of discussion, then discard that rationale to at length attack Clinton.

Of course I hold opinions as to why it is an anathema to the far right to ever attack Republicans.

The first is that though they constantly talk about the failures of the liberal, or center left federal government, all three branches, executive, legislative, and judicial have drifted center right. If that is so, then the Republicans, obviously to the right of the Democrats are in fact far right, and the far right masses have no quarrel with them. Still the far right masses share the uneasiness of the rest of the masses, and the repugnance at bail outs of Wall Street, which have been solidly supported by Democrats, and Republicans. They can't seem to appreciate that it is a corporatist betrayal of the people by both parties, hence they reserve their ire for Democrats, and can not bring themselves to condemn those who pay lip service to positions they hold dear. Which brings me to my second opinion.

There are several studies, and likely more on the way, that hold that there are differences in the conservative mind. Those differences include an aversion to thinking outside the box, to only being comfortable with rigid values, and an inability to adapt, or change opinions. That is an explanation as to the reasons for my first opinion, and that first opinion is an example of this second opinion.

Until there is a break through within the far right, which may be impossible, and they too begin to openly condemn the betrayal of the people by both Democrats, and Republicans they will not be able to participate in a hopefully peaceful revolution by the citizens to take our government back from the powerful of this world, not just the powerful of our country, who now dictate what our government does. Without the support of the right I am concerned that any such effort at recovery is doomed.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Jan 9, 2011, at 2:10 AM


Perhaps this explains Obama's likely visit with the ultra-secretive Bilderberger group (along with Rockefeller and the other top bankers of the World).




...and for those you who still the Bilderberger Group is just some crazy conspiracy theory...

here is the Bilderbeger Group's Official website...


I sure hope we won't be re-electing this fellow. In fact, I sure hope for once the American People will finally let go of the Unified Fascist Party (Republican Party + Democrat Party) and finally elect a 3rd party candidate to the White House along with 3rd Party Senatorial and House candidates in 2012.


-- Posted by news across on Sat, Jan 8, 2011, at 5:58 PM

More Wall Street in the Whitehouse. They not only have Obama's ear they have him by the *****, naw, thats not right he gave those to the corporatists long ago. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/jan...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sat, Jan 8, 2011, at 1:06 AM


I wonder what percentage of minorities voted for Republicans last year? HMMMMM

-- Posted by cheesehead on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 8:15 PM

The Democrats' White Flight

Fully 60 percent of whites nationwide backed Republican candidates for the House of Representatives; only 37 percent supported Democrats


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 7:10 PM

It looks like we finished 2010 with job growth in 12 straight months. Almost 300,000 jobs added in December so this looks postive and their is no proof that Health care reform has killed any jobs yet.

Now hopefully they can find a way to increase the average wage of the working and middle classes in this country.


-- Posted by cheesehead on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 5:08 PM

Let's Take Barack Obama's Advice on the Debt Limit


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Fri, Jan 7, 2011, at 6:21 AM

I heartily agree with you rr3. If the left, and the right do not come together on this issue, this death knell of our democracy, none of us are patriots.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 10:50 PM

So Called Constitutional Option Is A Trick


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 9:34 PM

Democrats Tortured by Reading of the US Constitution on House Floor


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 9:33 PM

The Four Corners of Deceit Strike: Autism/Vaccine Study was a Hoax


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 9:30 PM

I agree okr but I think the corruption in Washington runs so deep it will take a major collapse of this country as we know it before we could change direction. I could go for a 4-6 month campaign season before all major elections the rest of the time do what we hired you to do.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 8:18 PM

rr3 the numbers 666 mean nothing to me personally, I just thought that those of you who are more theocratic should be aware of the "signs". After all our current problems with over spending did start with Ronald Wilson Reagan and have not been surpassed as yet.

In reply to your question as to whether, or not it will be business as usual with the new congress. I believe it will. It may come out of the other side of their mouths, but they are regurgitating the same swill. Don't ever forget that most of them are dependent on, and beholden to their corporate/union sponsors, not you, and me. We are done as a democracy, unless we the people take it on our selves to modernize, and pay for federal elections.

Actually one of the things that keeps some very good people out of federal politics is the ceaseless begging for funds. Would it not be great if our representatives were once again directly dependent on all those who vote for, or against them, and no one else? Do you not think they would be more efficient if the period of campaigning was sharply curtailed? Would you not enjoy the absence of television sound bites, that more often blast the opposition candidate, than explain the candidates position? On, and on. I am not expecting a perfect world of politics. I just hope for a more rational end to the current ridiculousness.

What do you think?

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 11:19 AM

America's Mother-In-Law Puts Down the Gavel


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 6:44 AM

Okr you are comparing 8 years of Reagan to 2 years of Pelosi, and if continued at the current rate would surpass Reagan. Let's forget about the past for a minute and see if we are currently on the right track. I think the new congress will be business as usual after the first 30 days. What do you think?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 6:08 AM

So what does 666 mean to you okr?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 6:00 AM

Okr I don't have to you will do it for me.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Jan 6, 2011, at 5:55 AM

I was wrong about Reagan it was a 189% increase in debt, not a 182% increase. I don't want to be remiss in giving the devil his due.

Ronald Wilson Reagan, six letters in each name, 666. His California house number was also 666 until he had it changed.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Jan 5, 2011, at 11:40 PM

Overall percentage of increase in federal debt:

Last three Democratic Presidents: 101%.

Last three Republican Presidents: 334%


Blaming Nancy Pelosi, how misguided can you get for crying out loud.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Jan 5, 2011, at 11:23 PM

rr3, I thought I might take a moment to provide you some information that you have either forgotten, supressed, or never knew. Your comment about the 60% increase under Pelosi is chump change.

Your hero Ronald Raygun is the true champion with a 182% increase during his tenure.

Since his "sin" is three times greater than Pelosi's I expect you to berate him three times as much as you did Pelosi in regard to the issue.


-- Posted

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Jan 5, 2011, at 11:12 PM

I hear ya 1ofthegals and what-the-f...

I live within walking distance of an elementary school (even with my bum knee) and the 2 fourth grade twins who live a couple houses down from me take a bus to another elementary school. can somebody please explain to me how this is a smart way to spend dollars?

-- Posted by BigFatGuy on Wed, Jan 5, 2011, at 3:02 PM

Dont' worry gal,

I had the opposite happen a while ago. I got behind a bus that was giving curb service to drop off each child. At point there were 3 kids, and 3 stops within one block.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Jan 5, 2011, at 10:04 AM

Just barely made it to work on time this am. Had to wait on 13 (yes thirteen)with barely a child in each one to drive out of the loop in front of the high school. First I will admit this was a mistake on my part to drive down this road in the morning during the week. In the future I will definitely not take this route again. None of these buses were dropping off or picking up a child as they did not have their stop signs out. No this was a parade of buses all going the same way with a couple of kids in each one. Doesn't sound too cost effective to me. Not to mention screwing up my morning. So there it is...I am sure I have made some one out there mad by saying this. Sorry if I offended you. But to sit there and wait and wait for the parade to go by was very irritating to me.

-- Posted by 1OFTHEGALS on Wed, Jan 5, 2011, at 8:24 AM

Funny ironic hypocrisy once again from the President. In 2006 Obama voted against raising the debt ceiling. NOW it is an emergency, a catastrophic disaster if they DONT raise the debt limit... LOL

which way do the libbies want?

-- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Jan 4, 2011, at 11:49 PM

Cheesy: I always post in response to you but you always fail to respond with fact or a discussion or opinions and instead resort to bashing the right... so I will not hold my breath for you to answer this question.

Exactly what do you call withholding a cancer treatment drug from people simply because the drug costs a lot of money if not a death decision?

-- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Jan 4, 2011, at 11:47 PM

wow... trying to post from my phone was not good.

Sort of like the cities inth NE union idiot delaying snow removal and people dying. Criminals!

Should have said: Sort of like NYC and possibly other cities in the NE where the Union idiots purposefully delayed snow removal and people were killed and medical attention delayed.... criminal and they need to be prosecuted.

How about those Blue Flu supposed cops in East St Louis.... and you lefties whine about the harm that the evil corporations do. How about you fix your UNIONS before you cry for more socialist policies? remember the whole "take the LOG out of YOUR eye before you try to take the speck out of someone elses?

-- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Jan 4, 2011, at 11:45 PM

Sort of like the cities inth NE union idiot delaying snow removal and people dying. Criminals!

-- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Jan 4, 2011, at 8:44 PM

Don't forget Cheesehead, a lot of those folks are self-professed christians. Let'em eat cake.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Tue, Jan 4, 2011, at 8:14 PM

For all the talk about the death panels that would have been formed by the creation of universal health care it sees odd to me that there wouldn't be more opposition to the death panels that the republicans and the new tea party officials we be creating with cuts to medicaid.

I guess most Republicans are okay with it as long as it is low-income americans dying and its not their rich friends on wall street. Whether its the elderly or its low income Americans I don't believe money should be the determining factor in whether someone lives or dies. Its sad to see occurences such as this in this video.


-- Posted by cheesehead on Tue, Jan 4, 2011, at 12:43 PM

East St. Louis Cops Get a Bad Case of the Blue Flu


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 4, 2011, at 6:47 AM

National debt increased 60% under Speaker Pelosi


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Jan 4, 2011, at 6:02 AM

Here is a funny video about the mad tea party.


-- Posted by cheesehead on Mon, Jan 3, 2011, at 10:40 PM

Here's somethin' some of you may like.


-- Posted by What the f...... on Mon, Jan 3, 2011, at 2:26 PM

Been on vacation so I am just catching up.

In my opinion if Assange paid the person or person's then he is guilty of treason now if he did not pay for the information then he is not guilty he is just reporting.

I understand he is not a citizen of the US but if he comes to this country then he should be put on trial if it can be proven that he paid for the information.

I know there are people that do not think the same way I do but I do think there is information that does not need to be made public.

-- Posted by Gal66 on Mon, Jan 3, 2011, at 9:03 AM


-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Jan 2, 2011, at 5:29 PM


-- Posted by cheesehead on Sat, Jan 1, 2011, at 11:21 PM

The Four Questions Every Liberal Must Be Asked


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sat, Jan 1, 2011, at 10:11 PM

How true! How true!

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sat, Jan 1, 2011, at 9:47 PM

It is funny but sad how we have progressed as a nation. We ran from oppression and government control of individual lives. We created a constitution to guarantee our individual rights where we have the freedom to run our own lives without the fear of government interfering, protecting our lives, liberty and enabling us to pursue our own happiness... riches, property, family, religion, etc.

Now we have "progressed" to the point where we blame rich people for our problems instead of standing on our own two feet, using our four limbs and our intelligent brain and accepting the consequences of our good and our bad choices. We demand more and more handouts from the government instead of having pride in doing hard work and sacrificing the time and effort to get an education and building a career. We want instant gratification and when we dont get it, then it has to be someone's fault and we blame the rich.

Now we want to 'progress' even more so that we demand wealth redistribution (Confiscation of property and elimination of my happiness) so that we can allow people to continue to avoid personal responsibility and we are 'progressing' toward allowing the government to control more and more and more aspects of our lives....

Instead of progress are we not reverting back to the same thing that our founders fled from?

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jan 1, 2011, at 8:35 PM

111th Congress Added More Debt Than First 100 Congresses Combined: $10,429 Per Person in U.S.


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sat, Jan 1, 2011, at 6:53 PM

Blaming Capitalism for the World Bank's Anti-Capitalist Policies


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sat, Jan 1, 2011, at 6:45 PM

The Goulash of Right, Left and Center


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sat, Jan 1, 2011, at 6:10 PM

Cheesehead being a proponent of free speech does it matter if what you say is a lie I mean all in the name of free speech isn't it? Or is speech free only if you agree?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sat, Jan 1, 2011, at 11:36 AM

Some that make statements about no credibility has no credibility now does it?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sat, Jan 1, 2011, at 11:34 AM

Here is a list of Glenn Beck's 15 top lies that didn't get him fired!

Sorry to our fox news viewers, but your favorite news channel loses credibilty everyday this guy is allowed back to work.


-- Posted by cheesehead on Fri, Dec 31, 2010, at 7:39 PM


If Texas attempted to try to secede from the USA, they would be immediately occupied and lose their statehood status...seriously...no state has the right to secede -- secession is highly unconstituional -- and any state leaders that attempt to create such secession would be committing treason. The only reason the leaders of the Confederacy were not prosecuted for treason is because President Lincoln issued a Presidential Pardon of them at the end of the Civil War.

No WMD lies would be necessary for that one lol lol lol...still, you make an excellent point.

-- Posted by news across on Fri, Dec 31, 2010, at 4:32 PM

Just testing.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Fri, Dec 31, 2010, at 3:41 PM


-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Fri, Dec 31, 2010, at 1:13 PM


Well if Texas secceded we could then invade it for their oil right. All we would have to do is say Texas has WMD"S! It worked once we could try it again.

-- Posted by cheesehead on Fri, Dec 31, 2010, at 12:20 PM


Thanks for posting the link to that piece regarding a Texan/Southern, Independent, conservative "Utopia."

It really hit the nail right on the head.

Of course the issue of secession was settled by the Civil War, and by the precident setting, Supreme Court decision, White V Texas, 1869 in which the High Court ruled that no state can Constitutionally secede from the Union of States, the United States of America.

And of course any state that attempted such a foolish thing would be quickly occupied by the United States Army, Air Force, and Marines (in large and overwhelming force), its government arrested, and its Governor would be inprisoned pending his Military Court Matial by a military court...appointed by the Military Governor that would then be in charge of the former state -- now turned into a militarily occupied territory.

Still, having an independent Texas would give the rest of us something to laugh at...that's a good thing I guess.

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Dec 30, 2010, at 9:33 PM

Wall streets biggest top 10 lies of the year.


-- Posted by cheesehead on Thu, Dec 30, 2010, at 9:29 PM

Eight Botched Environmental Forecasts


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Dec 30, 2010, at 5:43 PM

Union Workers Reportedly Staged Slowdown as New York City Battled Blizzard

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/12/...

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Dec 30, 2010, at 5:41 PM

What if the red states formed their own country?

The poor and sick wouldn't get health care so they would infect all those around them. They wouldn't have to complain about tax cuts as they wouldn't pay taxex anyway, so unless the rich built roads it would be like all the old western movies we see on TV. The wouldn't have to worry about living with Muslims being around as there would be no separation of church and state, then they could elect preachers as presidents. Their laws would be based on bigotry so they wouldn't have people crossing their borders wanting to live there. Dont forget they would lead the world in pollution by a wide margin!


-- Posted by cheesehead on Thu, Dec 30, 2010, at 12:56 PM

Union Pickets Baltimore's City Paper Demanding Reporter's 'Resonation'


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Thu, Dec 30, 2010, at 6:29 AM

Fortunately OKR and Nan,

Our Founding Fathers created a flexible, living Constitution.

Its not easy to get an ammendment ratified, but it can be done. I think that is what is probably needed despite the difficulty -- or the American slide into fascism will increase significantly when corporations have all the politicians in their pockets...and after that such a change to the Constitution will never happen without the consent of Corporate America.

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Dec 30, 2010, at 5:08 AM

Gays attack last bastion of DADT, the Republican Party. http://satiricalpolitical.com/2010/12/26...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Dec 30, 2010, at 12:39 AM

Twelve o'clock and all is not well.

No sense in arguing here anymore due to the brain differences between righties, and lefties no one will be swayed.

Doesn't matter anyway cause SCOTUS sold us into slavery.

To quote my favorite denizen of the 100 acre wood, Eyore, "Oh Well".

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Dec 30, 2010, at 12:26 AM

"US companies hiring at rapid pace ... overseas"


Hey remember when President G. Bush, Sr. came up with the idea of shipping our jobs out of America using a new trade plan called GATT and NAFTA?

And remember we liberals told you that GATT and NAFTA would mean we could kiss our manufacturing base -- and our jobs -- goodbye?

Remember when Conservative Democrat, President BIll Clinton flip flopped and then supported Bush's crazy ideas to send our jobs out of the Country?

Remember when you thought we liberals were full of it for even critisizing the idea of sending our manufacturing base out of the Country?

So...when will you folks stop listening to those fools who keep telling you they are your friends and then stick a knife deep into your back (conservatives)?

Folks conservatives are not your friends. Would your friends want to ship your job to China and Mexico? I don't think so, but that is what conservatives in both major parties did.

So...how do you like that free trade now?

-- Posted by news across on Wed, Dec 29, 2010, at 2:54 AM

"fear"..."primitive emotions" lol lol lol...

I think modern science has made a great discovery that explains a lot about conservatives.

No wonder they are terrified of people who are different from them...lol lol lol...

Read the post below for more on this lol lol lol....

-- Posted by news across on Wed, Dec 29, 2010, at 2:18 AM

"Study: Conservatives have larger 'fear center' in brain"

"A study at University College London in the UK has found that conservatives' brains have larger amygdalas than the brains of liberals. Amygdalas are responsible for fear and other "primitive" emotions. At the same time, conservatives' brains were also found to have a smaller anterior cingulate -- the part of the brain responsible for courage and optimism."



Lol lol lol lol...

This is so hillareous I just can't stop laughing about it.

-- Posted by news across on Wed, Dec 29, 2010, at 2:11 AM

Oh and my appologies to Dr. Krugman for my typo in the spelling of his name in my previous posting.

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 11:54 PM


A capitalist is an individual with massive personal wealth who has significant control of the means of production and distribution. Usually when I talk about a capitalist, I am referring to folks in the top 1% income earners. However, there are some who, like President Obama, who are not in the top 1% income earners but still have significant control of the means of production and distribution via his employment position.


HIs list of credintials are quiet extensive and include the following,

BA -- Economics -- Yale University, 1974

Ph.D -- Massachusetts Institute of Technology 1977

Reagan White House -- Staff member of the Council of Economic Advisers, 1982 to 1983.

Taught at Yale University, MIT, UC Berkeley, the London School of Economics, and Stanford University before joining Princeton University in 2000 as professor of economics and international affairs.

Currently a Centenary Professor at the London School of Economics.

Member of the Group of Thirty international economic body.

Research associate at the National Bureau of Economic Research since 1979.

Professor of Economics and International Affairs at the Woodrow Wilson School of Public and International Affairs at Princeton University.

Op-ed columnist for The New York Times.

Nobel Memorial Prize in Economics, 2008

How does his list of creditials in economics compare to yours rr?

I think maybe you are practicing a little "kill the messenger because you don't like the message.

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 11:47 PM

Ummm... rr3yv0

President Obama is a conservative Democrat...not a member of the Socialist Party...he is a capitalist through and through and has said so many, many times. In addition, all the economic policies he has pushed are without question neo-classical economic policies. Take for example his attempt to use the tax multiplier as a method of dealing with the New Great Depression or the fact that his health care reform law's is privatized based. Those sure are not things we Socialist prefer or support at all and in fact we oppose these policies because they are a capitalist approach.

He is a capitalist.

His policies are a conservative approach and free-market based.

...and he is all yours mate...we on the left do not support him or his policies.

I think perhaps the problem is that you think there is some signifcant difference between him and the Republican conservatives when in fact the only thing he and the other conservatives disagree about is how far to stick the knife in the back of the American People.

Nice try though.

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 11:25 PM

What's a Socialist to Do?

Obama, and people like him, can't stand capitalism. Yet none of us can live without it.


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 10:35 PM

Paul Krugman: Zombie of the New Deal Era

Mr. Krugman is the guardian of a system that died a long time ago. He is the walking undead of the New Deal era. He advocates for an economic system that feeds off the productive strata of society to support the unproductive.


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 10:30 PM

Uh news name someone that by your definition is 'rich' that is not a capitalist or made their fortune because of capitalism.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 10:24 PM

Uh Ray,

George Soros is a capitalist...a big capitalist. He did not personally cause the New Great Depression. However, I personally think all capitalists should swing by their necks from a rope tied to the nearest tree branch as soon as possible. All capitalists are evil as far as the working class is concerned.

If you want a good summary of how conservative neo-classical economic policies of GW Bush and the Conservative Congress caused the great depression then you might want to read the summary I posted below.

If you would like a better explanation then I suggest you read these qualified opinions from Nobel Lauriate, Economist Paul Krugman.

"The Third Depression"


"Axis of Depression"


"Stay the Course"


-- Posted by news across on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 9:51 PM

Also Ray,

Not all EU Nations are in an economic deflationary period as the UK, Ireland, and Greece are or as the United States is.

As I said, those EU members with the strongest economies are those Scandanavian Nations that have strong socialist elements to their economic systems and their economies -- much like Australia's economy -- and for the same reasons -- are booming -- lots of good paying jobs and affordable living.

As an economist, I do understand how we got to this deflationary period which began in December 2007 as a direct result of the neo-classical economic policies of Republican/Conservative, President George W. Bush, his Administration, and the Republican/conservative control of Congress.

There were many things that contributed to this economic depression (not the least of which were 2 immoral wars in our attempt to colonize countries in the Middle East) including the lack of jobs programs in the face of growing unemployment, effective reductions of social programs for the working class, and most of all, a lack of regulation and policing of Big Banking.

Growing unemployment, the result of neo-classical laissez faire policies of the conservatives who controlled all 3 branches of Government, lead to mortage defaults -- mortgages that could be easily paid when the folks were working and the intrest rates were at a reasonable level. Big Banking had heavily bet its paycheck (and your 401K) that the home loan default rate would remain at historical rates and indulged itself in a form of gambling called "credit derrivatives." When unemployment reached 7% and more in December of 2007 and the Bush Administration allowed interest rates to rise dramatically, thousands of folks found themselves unable to pay their mortgages.

This had a disasterous effect on the credit derrivatives Big Banking had gambled their investors money on.

As defaults rose, the insurance companies, and others who guaranteed the loans, found themselves unable to pay the loans they had insured for Big Banking. This created a huge liquidity problem and caused a major shift on the ISLM curve (Investment and Savings/Liquidity and money supply). Almost instantly, trillions of dollars disapeared from our economy. The banks were on the verge of complete failure.

This in turn scared the hell out of consumers. Folks began to curtail their consumption almost to the point of autonomous consumption (buying only the necessities such as food). They stopped buying new homes, new cars, new tvs, new airconditioners, ect. The manufactures found themselves in a situation where they could not borrow because of the liquidity squeeze, and in the face of dramatically reduced saies because of the decrease in consumption, companies began to layoff more and more workers and rely on their existing inventories. This meant an even larger reduction in consumption as the newly unemployed canceled their plans for new housing purchases and durible goods purchases -- resulting in even more layoffs by manufactures.

Prices began to decline as a result of perfect competition and severly reduced demand. Homeowners lost much of their equity, if not all, and our Nation found itself locked in a spiralling deflation.

All of that was preventable, but conservatives follow strict neo-classical economic policies and felt sure they could control the economy utilizing only the tax spending multiplier -- which has never worked when used to attempt to end an economic depression. The tax multiplier is just too small to have the kind of push an economy requires to get out of a depression.

So here we are today...a stagnant, guided capitalist economy that has delivered another "bust" of our economy and millions out of work (current estimates are 20 to 22% effective unemployment -- very close the the 25% unemployment of the Great Depression) and no end in sight -- all the direct result of the failure of conservative guided capitalist policies.

...and yet to date, I have not heard even one conservative admit even the slightest responsibility for crashing our economy.

So much for personal (and collective) responsibility...eh mate? lol lol lol....

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 8:37 PM

Diversity Is A Euphemism For National Suicide


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 7:54 PM

Nana please try to understand what they are doing to you. Can't you see it just read your post.

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 7:48 PM

President Meets With Union Bosses to Discuss Government-Union "Partnership"

In fact, it seems the only way unions create jobs is to buy politicians who steal other people's money, then reward the union bosses with taxpayer dollars and government-approved discrimination.


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 7:06 PM

Senate Democrats Poised for Power Grab

Ironically, it is Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) who has caused the unprecendented number of Senate filibusters with his strong arm tactics.


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 7:03 PM

News how do you know I am not qualified and what makes you qualified?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 6:24 PM


I don't think you are qualified to decide who is a true believer of any religion anymore than me or anyone else.

Your interpretation of the Bible or the Koran is only your interpretation. There is no way of knowing if you are correct or incorrect. You can site a passage, I can site a conflicting passage. You can put your spin on a passage, I can put my spin on a passage.

No rr, you simply are not qualified to tell any Muslim or Christian or Jew that their interpretation of their religion or religious books is correct or not. No one is qualified to do that. All you can do is speculate. Heck man, none of you religious boys has a single piece of testable, observable, verifiable, repeatable physical evidence to support any of your religious beliefs...not one shread of scientifically derrived evidence...and you think you can tell a Muslim if their interpretation of the Koran is correct???

Lol lol lol lol...you will have to better than that to justify your religious prejudices rr (which are not justifiable at all, by the way).

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 7:25 AM

News ask them if they truly believe the Koran and what it teaches. If not are they truly Muslim? It would be the same if a Christian didn't believe the bible are they truly Christian?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 7:03 AM

Its sad OKR that Americans keep supporting conservative Democrat and conservative Republican policies that just keep getting America deeper and deeper in that pit of poverty, despair, anti-semitism, and fascism.

Maybe its time we Americans try something new...'cause that conservatism doesn't seem to be working out very well. Its time we put aside the failed policies of the Democrats and Republicans and start listening to what the liberals have to offer -- such as a government jobs program similar to the CCC and WPA of the Great Depression era.

Americans need good paying jobs with good benefits and long-term job security -- not tax-cuts for the rich!!

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Dec 28, 2010, at 1:08 AM

Humor. (L rated) http://satiricalpolitical.com/2010/12/22...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Dec 27, 2010, at 11:56 PM


I live in a Muslem community. I am one of the few non-Muslims that live in the suburb I live in.

I have never met a single Muslim that wants to kill you or anyone else -- not even 1.

Stop blaming a religion for the political terrorism of a few just because they might happen to claim Islam as their religion.

Stop the anti-Semitism. Stop the hate. Stop confusing the issue -- the causes of terrorism are political...not religious...and blaming a religion for the political acts of a few is nothing short of religious biggotry and religious prejudice.

We need to get our out troop out of the Middle East now, end our attempt to make colonies out of the Arab nations, and stop supporting Israeli oppression of the Palastinian People.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Dec 27, 2010, at 11:32 PM

"That very, very controversial provision that was in the original House and Senate versions of Obamacare that called for the government paying doctors, using Medicare money, to discuss 'end of life options' with patients was taken out of the final bill. But Obama just put it back in by using his rulemaking authority -- and the language he wrote in is far stronger than what they took out!" -Mark Belling

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Mon, Dec 27, 2010, at 11:14 PM

Ten Obvious Reasons Why Islam is NOT a Religion of Peace


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Mon, Dec 27, 2010, at 11:11 PM

Being nice hasn't protected Sweden

How do you deal with the people of a religion that wants to kill you?


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Mon, Dec 27, 2010, at 11:06 PM

"Counter-terror 'expert' tells cops: Kill militant Muslims, 'including children'"


This tells me a lot about America's war on Islam.

The American anti-semitism really needs to stop before it reaches NAZI-like proportions.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Dec 27, 2010, at 8:14 PM

"Drug decriminalization pays off in Portugal as US weighs its options"


-- Posted by news across on Mon, Dec 27, 2010, at 3:58 PM


Yes I do think hate speech is protected speech.

One of the advantages of free speech and free press is that is also allows us to see how evil a point of view or ideology might be.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Dec 27, 2010, at 3:33 PM

News good judgement and common sense cannot be legislated. Do you think "hate" speech should be illegal? If we truly have free speech can it be?

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Mon, Dec 27, 2010, at 6:22 AM

I should not have failed to include some facets of the center, and some liberals in my castigation of those who fail to sufficiently value freedom of the press.

I also should have also made clear that some facets of the right, particularly those of a libertarian bent, highly value freedom of the press.

And that leads me to the conclusion that I should not have written the post at all, in the manner I chose.

This issue transcends political divisions.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Dec 26, 2010, at 10:36 PM


Any law that violates the Constitution is not a law.

The Constitution is the supreme law of the land and trumpts all Federal Acts and all State Statutes, as well as any local law.

With few exceptions, any law that establishes prior restraint upon the press is in violation of the 1st Ammendment of our Constitution...no matter what level of responsibility we may think should be should or should not be shown on the part of the press, and yes this includes all the press whether we like what they are saying or not.

As Supreme Court Justice Black says in his Majority Opinion in the case of the New York Times V United States of America, 1971,

"The Bill of Rights changed the original Constitution into a new charter under which no branch of government could abridge the people's freedoms of press, speech, religion, and assembly."

I hope you agree with the Author of the American Declaration of Independence, President Thomas Jefferson when he said,

"No government ought to be without censors; and where the press is free, no one ever will.

and when he said,

"I am mortified to be told that, in the United States of America, the sale of a book can become a subject of inquiry, and of criminal inquiry too."

and when he said,

"Our liberty depends on the freedom of the press, and that cannot be limited without being lost."

and when Founding Father Jefferson said,

"The only security of all is in a free press. The force of public opinion cannot be resisted when permitted freely to be expressed. The agitation it produces must be submitted to. It is necessary, to keep the waters pure." --Thomas Jefferson to Lafayette, 1823. ME 15:491

and then he also said,

"The basis of our governments being the opinion of the people, the very first object should be to keep that right; and were it left to me to decide whether we should have a government without newspapers or newspapers without a government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter. But I should mean that every man should receive those papers and be capable of reading them." --Thomas Jefferson to Edward Carrington, 1787. ME 6:57



-- Posted by news across on Sun, Dec 26, 2010, at 7:21 PM

Planned Parenthood's Federal Funding Rose to $363.2 Million in FY 2008-2009, Aborted 324,008 Unborn Children in 2008


-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Dec 26, 2010, at 6:56 PM

You know news I agree with you about freedom of the press. I feel as long as he hasn't done anything illegal then what can they do. I do think freedom comes with a responsibility to use good judgement and common sense. I wonder though if this idea of free press is extended to all or just those with whom we agree? Or like some resort to name calling!

-- Posted by rr3yv0 on Sun, Dec 26, 2010, at 6:34 PM

Bravo News Across, and the rest of you pinko commies! Is it not ironic that the flag waving fools on the right, are clueless when it comes to defending freedom. They can't even distinguish freedom from fascism.

I have no right to tell them they can't choose to be ignorant, but I'll be darned if I will allow them to insist that I remain ignorant, nor will I allow them to shut down a free press.

They may live in a cave, and call it the land of the brave. I'll choose to live in the light, because it is what's right.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Dec 26, 2010, at 4:32 PM

Hey Gal66,

You know in this country we don't really care about treason. If we did did, Scotter Libby would still be in prison with Dick Cheney in the next cell.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Sun, Dec 26, 2010, at 1:55 PM

Ohhhh what a scary prospect you are promoting Gal66. If American law is to become international, then all law could be. Imagine having that glass of wine on New Year's Eve and finding out that Interpol has issued an arrest warrant for you from Saudi Arabia. You are then deported for breaking Saudi law and could face years in prison or the death penalty. It does not matter if you drank the wine in the USA or that you are an American citizen. This is the kind of situation you are advocating. So far Assange and Wikileaks have broken no laws in any country, however Huckabee, Limbaugh and Palin most certainly have with their hysterical demands for assasination, when are they going to be deported?

-- Posted by Divergent Thinker on Sun, Dec 26, 2010, at 2:29 AM


We Australians are very proud of our fellow citizen, Julian Assange.

Our Government supports a free press and has announced with tremendous pride that Julian Assange has broken no Australian laws. There is no prior restraint of the free press in Australia and we regard our citizen Julian Assange to be a great Australian who is fighting for freedom of the press World-Wide.

M wife and I are often surprised to read about American anger to Chief Editor Assange or hear of it on the American news. We often wonder if Americans realize they are the only People in the World who seem to hold such negative feelings towards Editor Assange. Most of the People of the World, judging by the many opinions expressed in their news papers, seem to feel that reporting the news is what a news organiztion -- such as Wikileaks -- is supposed to do. That certainly is the opinion of the American Supreme Court (New York Times V USA, 1971) and that includes leaked government documents...even if they are classified.

Its sad to see this once-great Nation, the United States of America, de-evolving into nothing more than just another run-of-the-mill totalitarian fascist state where news organizations can only print news that is approved of by the Government.

But here in Australia we strongly support Editor Assange, Wikileaks, and all other heros of the press who continue the struggle of freedom and often at great personal risk. In Australia we are now calling Editor Assange "the modern-day Ned Kelly," in memory of Australia's great National Hero, Ned Kelly.

Our government has stated clearly and without hesitation that Editor Assange has broken no Australina laws, is welcome home anytime he wants to come home, has the full support of the Australian People, and is being assisted as much as humanly possible by Australian Embassy Personnel at the very highest levels. In addition, our finest human rights lawyer, Barrister Jeffery Robinson, has offered his services to assist Editor Assange in any legal matters here or in any other country at no cost to Editor Assange.

Prior restraint of the press and opposition to a free press is not the Australian way. Nor is the path any free people should ever veer down. Yet, this seems to be what many Americans think should be done. Its rather pathetic to see the very Nation that dared to establish a free and open press, unrestrained and free to print any and all news, now seems to insist that the press be gagged and the People deaf, dumb, and blind to the actions of their own Government.

-- Posted by news across on Sun, Dec 26, 2010, at 12:52 AM

This is an interesting critique of the left, and liberalism, by a leftist.


-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Dec 26, 2010, at 12:01 AM

Oh I get it now we should be able to charge Australian citizens for Treason, because we dont like what they report here in the U.S. He may be guilty of Treason in Australia if he leaked some of their classified information, but not here.

Some people think we have the power to do what we want like police the world. The soldier who leaked classified info may be guilty of treason, but not Assange.

-- Posted by cheesehead on Sat, Dec 25, 2010, at 11:28 PM

cheesehead in my opinion they are guilty of treason!

-- Posted by Gal66 on Fri, Dec 24, 2010, at 12:48 PM

Ya know I try to be neighborly, an I also talk across the fence to my neighbor on the other side. I reckon he's a whole lot differen than Bobby Don.

Name's Fred Fesser, an he's also a good fella. He calls himself an educator, been teachin, oh, roun, I wanna say, twenty or twenty five years. We all call him Fred F., cause don't hardly nobody go by jus one name roun here.

Fred F.'s got some idea about the details of the bad stuff that's goin on, an jus rants all the time about whatsa goin on. Also says, on the quiet, that he is sick of teaching, that kids don't listen to him, and their parents don't care. He figures that he is just gonna put in his time a few more years and then forget about it. He's worried about the security of his retirement when he gets there.

Ole Fred F. won't talk to Bobby Don, an calls him an ignorant oaf. Gotta say, Bobby Don's got some names for him too.

I reckon Fred F. sees that we got some long rows to hoe, he might even get out there, an see what kinda weeds we gotta get rid of. I don't think he's inclined to tackle em, Fred F. ain't much for heavy work.

Could be that Fred F. maybe could tell somebody else, teach em, about what's happenin. I'm thinkin that Fred F. don't think he can teach anybody any more, even if his retirement depends on it. He is jus gonna keep on doin what he does.

I know one thing, you sure can't teach anybody with out a talkin to em. And you gotta believe some how that you respect em, and make them believe some how, that you respect their human dignity, for you ever utter a word.

I ain't sure, but I'm thinkin that Bobby Don, and Fred F. got the same fears, and if we could jus find a way to get em together, there might be something they could do about those fears that they each repress in their own way.

Now that I thunk about it some more, I reckon Fred F. ain't a whole lot differin than Bobby Don.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Fri, Dec 24, 2010, at 1:24 AM

I was talkin over the back fence to my neighbor Bobby Don the other day, an I jus happen to mention that incomes in God's nation had dropped bout ten percent in the last ten year. I scratched my head, and asked Bobby Don whatcha reckon we oughter do bout that?

Ole Bobby Don looks me in the eye, an says "aint the truth, an thas a fack. I'm a makin more an I wus ten year ago. You know ya can't believe nuthin ya see on TV, an nothin on that inner net, y'all are stickin yere face in all the time." Then he says, "an even if'n it war true, the onliest reason them folks is a makin less its cause they slacked off over these las' ten year. I reckon if they had jus kep on humpin, like I been doin, they'd be doin, like I be doin." He says, 'America is a fine place, but we ain't got no room for the lazy, and shifless. Ya get whatcha work for."

Well, I thinks to myself, we sho nuff got some long rows to hoe, an I ain't so sure that Bobby Don is even seein the field yet, let alone how many weeds are there.

Then I thinks to myself, its kinda sad bout ole Bobby Don, an a whole bunch like him. That thing inside of him, that wonnerful heritage, that pioneer spirit, that has served him, and a lot of the rest of us too, has twisted aroun him, an them, an is a stranglin em. We been taught well that when it gets tough we jus push harder, an don't look left an don't look right. Now that quality won't even let a lot of us look up, an see what's happenin. They is jus too busy doin the only thing they know to make it.

I spect that Bobby Don hump's even harder, knowin some folk, maybe some of em kin, that ain't gettin to do much right now. Bout all he can do is say real loud it ain't so, real loud, so he can drown out that ever more frequent whisper in his head that says "sumpin's wrong, sumpin's bad wrong". http://openleft.com/diary/21178/more-map...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Fri, Dec 24, 2010, at 12:18 AM

Guilty of what exactly?

-- Posted by cheesehead on Thu, Dec 23, 2010, at 9:30 PM

In my opinion if he or anyone else paid the person or persons that leaked the information the are just as guilty as those that leaked the information.

-- Posted by Gal66 on Thu, Dec 23, 2010, at 8:50 PM

As far as the wikileaks goes he did nothing that any NEWS organization in this country wouldn't have done if they were giving this information.

Maybe those who leaked the information to Assange are guilty of treason, but he is just the messenger.

-- Posted by cheesehead on Thu, Dec 23, 2010, at 4:42 PM


I think sometimes you disagree to give you something to do, but actually the post was talking about servicemen who were forced to leave due to their sexual orientation, not that people were disallowed to serve because they were gay.

-- Posted by cheesehead on Thu, Dec 23, 2010, at 4:36 PM

Only problim with this it's both sides not just one.


-- Posted by Gal66 on Thu, Dec 23, 2010, at 10:18 AM

cheesy... no one knows yet the extent of the lives placed at risk and potentially killed... that is something that will be in the FUTURE since these documents were JUST released.

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Dec 23, 2010, at 1:08 AM

hmmmm DADT never disallowed gay people... common but distorted or manipulated viewpoint

-- Posted by mrxray on Thu, Dec 23, 2010, at 1:06 AM

Who are the criminals, members of our federal government, or participants in Wikileaks? Read this before you decide. http://www.truth-out.org/cover-ups-coups...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Dec 23, 2010, at 12:14 AM

Ron Paul isn't afraid of conservatives or liberals he just says what he feels. He voted with the Democrats for tax cuts for those who make under 250,000. I might not always agree with his policy, but this is one guy who seems like he sticks with his beliefs over any party.

On the floor of the house he posed the question. What has resulted in more deaths? Wikileaks or us being lied to and going into war in Iraq? Well we know the answer to this and I give a thumbs up to Ron Paul.


-- Posted by cheesehead on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 8:26 PM

No longer will our country be denied the service of thousands of patriotic Americans who were forced to leave the military regardless of their skills, no matter their bravery or zeal, no matter their years of exemplary performance because they happen to be gay," - President Barack Obama (Signing the Repeal of DADT into LAW)

-- Posted by cheesehead on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 8:08 PM

Looks like a great site.

Is everyone welcome?


-- Posted by plainbread on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 8:57 AM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:

(with a very few exceptions -- people who have burned their bridges.)

Turn the page...

-- Posted by Eric Crump on Wed, Dec 22, 2010, at 8:46 AM

Respond to this story

Posting a comment requires free registration:

Related subjects