[Masthead] Light Snow Fog/Mist ~ 31°F  
Winter Weather Advisory
Thursday, Dec. 18, 2014

Speak Out August 3 to August 23, 2009

Monday, August 3, 2009

The Marshall Democrat-News welcomes views or questions on any issue. We hope you'll express yourself freely and responsibly. We reserve the right to exclude entries that we deem disrespectful, threatening, obscene or in other ways objectionable.

Past Speak Out conversations


Comments
Note: The nature of the Internet makes it impractical for our staff to review every comment. If you feel that a comment is offensive, please Login or Create an account first, and then you will be able to flag a comment as objectionable. Please also note that those who post comments on marshallnews.com may do so using a screen name, which may or may not reflect a website user's actual name. Readers should be careful not to assign comments to real people who may have names similar to screen names. Refrain from obscenity in your comments, and to keep discussions civil, don't say anything in a way your grandmother would be ashamed to read.

I've considered advertising for dinners, such as class reunions or small family gatherings. I've hosted quite a few family dinners, both upstairs and in the store. Also considering game night. Anyone who loves board games, or playing cards. Am a little worried about upsetting the lady across the street, who does host the majority of class reunions. Most of our family gathers in the store, because it's harder for the elderly members to climb the stairs.

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sun, Aug 23, 2009, at 12:55 AM

Let's see...that would add up to 34 at the tables and counter on those rainy and/or cold days, so that's a pretty good number.

We should've been consulting with you about our class reunion feed.

-- Posted by Slater on Sun, Aug 23, 2009, at 12:12 AM

Let's see...there are 4 booths, one large round table that can set 6, one other table that can seat 4 (looking to replace that one with another round table) another table, seats 3. Counter space, can seat up to 5. Of course there is the long bench where the large window used to be (someone made that into two smaller windows. There are two picnic tables outside, and another long bench. Oh, and of course...the rocking chair.

Have another table I can use that seats 4. There is a pool table and an old juke box. The pool table might have to go if the kids don't start playing on it. No pinball machines anymore. I think Nintendo, Xbox and what not took care of that. If I lost the pool table, I could put more tables in. Or...maybe use it as a fancy eatin' table with pot passers :)!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sun, Aug 23, 2009, at 12:05 AM

Ray, have you ever been in www.newegg.com to browse all the computer stuff there? They offer some very good buys for an array of things on a regular basis.

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 11:54 PM

I don't know the Jeter's personally, but I believe he's related to the wife of one long-time friend from Marshall - Gary Babler ('59 grad of MHS). They were in CA a year or two ago visiting her relatives who are in the dairy business. I'll quiz him about them for my own edification.

I'm glad it went well, and if I were a lover of peaches, that dessert would be a true reward. :)

I wish you great success for tomorrow and the coming occasions as well. How many can you serve at one time?

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 11:43 PM

I missed the photos that were posted earlier this month. Being they were of the Marshall area, I'm sure I would have enjoyed seeing them.

I've scanned and saved a few of my family's photos, but need to do more. Flash drives, massive external hard drives and other digital storage devices are fairly cheap these days too (compared to what they used to be).

If others are like my family, I suspect there's a lot of really good stuff in shoe boxes on shelves in closets, or sitting in an old album, or in an old picture frame. The quality of the photos goes downhill decade after decade as I've learned from old photos in my own history.

Someone might even be able to start a small business, "Make a Digital Record of Your History." Old documents can be scanned and saved too, but it's the pictures that are most in need of preservation, IMO.

-- Posted by Ray on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 11:33 PM

Slater,

Very much so. Met some of the hub's relatives from California, I'm thinking originally from Slater. Their name's John Jeter and his son Josh. Know them? They now own a dairy business in California and Texas. Very nice people. They were driving from Chicago, on their way back west.

The food was fantastic also, if I may say so. :). Used them as guinea pigs for a new desert recipe. Grilled peaches, drizzled with honey, sprinkled with cinnamon and a dollop of cheesecake filling in the center. YUM!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 11:28 PM

NB, did your evening mealtime offering meet your expectations?

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 11:16 PM

The old Van Dyke building on the northwest corner of the Marshall Square now houses the Saline Country Historical Society. Maybe you can contact them, if you would like some information or pictures. I'm certain that they can give you names of people still living that has past information, or stories.

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 11:06 PM

CH, I don't recall if I tried the rum and cream soda, but gin and squirt made a nice summer evening libation. :)

One thing I remember about Lula Lafoon's potato chips is the heavy coating of salt, but they were pretty yummy.

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 11:05 PM

Does anyone remember riding around on hot summer days drinking rum and cream soda from a Nehi bottle?

How about Lafoons potato chips which always seemed to have at least one charred chip.

-- Posted by ceh_meh@verizon.net on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 10:57 PM

Upsedaisy, that's a very good suggestion about the need for a county historian. Someone in county government could put together a program as a VISTA project, perhaps.

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 10:55 PM

Ray -- one way to preserve them would be to put them on disc. The copy places like Kinko's do that for little money, in case you haven't been to one of those.

You're absolutely right about the value of all the historical information. Once the old folks are gone, so too is all that detail, unless it gets recorded in some way.

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 10:51 PM

Ray, Did you see the postcards of early day Marshall and Slater that were linked in a post on here earlier in the month? They were fun to look at. There were some private homes shown and it would be great to know if they are still in existence. One worries after the contretemps on Marshall's only Tuscan style villa which was demolished. Saline County needs a historian. There probably isn't money to pay one. Volunteers?

Eric has done a great job keeping up w/the courthouse renovations w/many outstanding photographs.

-- Posted by upsedaisy on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 10:45 PM

Given the cost of a high quality Epson scanner (or similar) these days, someone should start a project scanning old photographs of some of those sites from Marshall's past. I have photos my dad gave to me from his childhood and I now struggle to remember all the details. How quickly we forget and once the old folks are gone, many details are lost forever. Even though it doesn't seem all that important at the time, the younger generations are left to wonder, and eventually they (as we) do wonder. The loss of a record of our Saline Co. history is a tragedy.

-- Posted by Ray on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 8:48 PM

"Competition lacking among private health insurers" Associated Press

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/arti...

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 8:30 PM

Does anyone remember what the name of the small grocery store, a little South of Bueker (the old high school? I am not old enough to remember it :)but my Mother was talking about it.

-- Posted by litlmissme on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 7:30 PM

I saw a recipe for bacon-wrapped salmon just 2 days ago. On allrecipes.com, I believe. All this odd food together reminds me of one of my brother's favorite restaurants in Michigan...Jose' Babuschkas. It was a combo Mexican/Greek place! HA!

Talking about all this food reminds me I am serving two dinners, one this evening and one tomorrow at noon. Better get crackin! Will chat with all later!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 3:54 PM

Would a bottle of Nehi grape and a MoonPie be compatible in taste? I never tried the two together. Maybe it would be in the same category as the following:

Today I heard someone on the tv talking about bacon-wrapped salmon. I wouldn't think to put the two together, but it does sound kinda good. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 3:47 PM

Slater,

You betcha! Orange was good, too. Rember the old line, "A grape Nehi and a Moon Pie"?

Sold moon pies in here last year! Only, I think I ate more that the kids! HA!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 3:36 PM

Heh heh...my right index finger believes there's no difference between the letters H and N.

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 3:35 PM

By the way, NB, The Little Store sold Grapette, which I always liked, and which I learned not too many years ago while touring the Dr. Pepper museum that it was made by Dr. Pepper.

Hehi orange wasn't bad, either. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 3:33 PM

NB,

Thanks for the info on Pappy's. Going and picking up one of those pizza's was a huge treat when I was a kid. As far as the rootbeer I couldn't say but I do miss the cold glass mugs.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 3:23 PM

Ahhh, yes, emerging from that dark tunnel we know as the teen years.

I'll wish her a Happy Birthday vicariously through her mother. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 3:21 PM

Slater,

I played I spy with my little eye with my children on car trips. Also...how many windmills you could count. They advanced it to slug bug! Couldn't believe it when I told them it was as old as me! I think they just wanted a reason to hit me :)! So, I guess I instilled a little bit in them. Certainly hope so. My baby girl turns 20 tomorrow! My son turned 26 last month. And to my amazement they are truly beautiful people and I am extremely proud of both! At least I get fewer, Awwwww...Mom...from them! HA!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 3:03 PM

NB,

I understand fully where you're coming from on this. The times have changed so greatly since I was young and manufacturing ways to have fun. The electronic age and the "age of entitlement" are taking their toll on children in a variety of ways, I believe.

When we made motor trips when I was little, my sister and I would play games like spotting out-of-state license plates, highway signs like the old Burma Shave ads, cloud shapes, you name it we tried it. At Christmas she and I had a game where we'd take turns picking out something on the tree and the other had to guess what it was. Simple things, certainly, but how enjoyable it was.

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 2:55 PM

What the F...

Before it was pappy's pizza it was called T.J.'s pizza. Little, tiny house!

I car-hopped at the old Dog'N'Suds. Sorry if this offends anyone...but they had the BEST rootbeer! Yep, better than A&w!

Anyone out there remember grape NEHI...there is not one grape soda on the market today that can beat that one!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 2:47 PM

Pappy's Pizza was located in a little house on right off S. Odell. It would have been right accross the street from where Ted's auto is now. Ted's is located where the old Dog 'N Suds used to be. I don't know Pappy Hall's first name but he has two sons, John and Steph. Both are fine musicians. John is a phenominal guitar player that I have had the pleasure to jam with in the past and Steph is also an awesome drummer. They used to have the band the Blue Daddies. Last I heard Steph worked for Pepsi and at one time John worked for Monnings in Glasgow and also does construction. All of them are super nice guys. If they see this they'll probably be wondering who the heck I am but it will have to remain a mystery. Pappy was doing square pizza slices before Dominoes was even a game :)

Who remembers cruising A&W?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 2:41 PM

IESG,

HMMMMM.....I'll leave that to you to figure out! Just how many of LeRoy Gilliam's nephews are still living?

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 2:11 PM

Slater,

It's not that I am not a progressive forward thinker. But, I just think it is a shame at times that the children today have not a clue how to entertain themselves, how to spend quiet time and how to marvel at the "scenery" around them. I am very well aware these are different times, and I know they are making there own memories, albeit electronic ones :), and I know that with every generation comes the thought that you want your children to have better that you had. However...the word "entitlement" comes to mind! Am definitely glad I grew up in the era I did!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 2:10 PM

Wow, NB, you have a bunch of memories, both fond and historical! I think it's great to be part of an area that generates so many memories.

IESG, I remember Leroy Gilliam's donuts, but I don't recall how long he operated that business - on the northeast corner of Main and Emma (I believe that east-west street is Emma).

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 1:23 PM

Hmm.. I married Leroy's granddaughter.

-- Posted by ieatsuperglue on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 1:20 PM

IESG,

The hubs remembers Leroy Gilliam's donuts! Leroy was his uncle.

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 1:14 PM

Oh the aroma of those fresh roating nuts...Remembering Mattingly's at Christmas time...Mom would always takes us on a ride on "Santa's sleigh", then we'd go down to Toyland and sit on Santa's lap, tell him what we wanted for Christmas! I often remember the Marshall Square and Mattingly's at Christmas and it makes me smile and sad all in one. My Children would never experience that sort of innocent wonder.

Gambles was kitty corner from Wood & Huston. They have recently sold that building and are in a smaller bldg next to the old Hayob Theater bldg and it's now Silverthorn's. The old Mattingly's store is now Marshall Floral.

The old neighborhood stores were great! Miss them. Master's Grocery, B&B market, penny candy and collecting pop bottles to trade for bubble gum!

Anyone remember the old A&P, eight o'clock coffee aroma and the old dry cleaners across the street where the fountain and peacocks were?

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 1:12 PM

Remember Godfather's Pizza? How about CD's Raceway on the square. (The Hallmark building) They used to race toy cars in there.

Anyone remember Leroy Gilliam's donuts?

-- Posted by ieatsuperglue on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 12:37 PM

WTF, you sure brought back some memories with your post. I had forgot about Pappy's Pizza. Where was it located - do you remember? I vaguely remember the man who ran it. Was his name John or maybe his son was named John?

Aikman, I remember Mattinglys basement very well! Those wooden stairs creaked like the dickens when walking down them. The place was like a wonderland. It was magical - an entire HUGE room full of so many different toys and games. And small pets all along one wall. Santa Claus always made an appearance each December. Mode Anson was the manager for a very long time.

-- Posted by Dawson16 on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 12:22 PM

I've intended for some time to share this link with those of you who admire the wonders of the world, man-made or otherwise:

http://www.sleeponthegreatwall.com/qtvr/...

This is a spectacular panorama of the Great Wall of China at Jinshanling. Left click your mouse on it for the full effect.

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 11:32 AM

Slater I am glad you all enjoyed it it is by far my favorite.

WTF we may not agree on a lot of things but I do agree very much with this statement "The Red Cross soda fountain etc. What I remember most is that here was a time when we got by just fine without Wal-Mart. Remember all little neighbor grocery stores like Shady Grove, etc? The Fully enclosed Baseball stadium at the park?

Brunner's Bar-B-Q? Pappy's pizza (Pre-Pizza Hut) Back then if you wanted a pizza you bought a Chef Boyardee pizza kit. Wow. I miss those times.

"

-- Posted by Gal66 on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 10:46 AM

Yes I remember Mattinglys well and the toys down stairs. The Red Cross soda fountain etc. What I remember most is that here was a time when we got by just fine without Wal-Mart. Remember all little neighbor grocery stores like Shady Grove, etc? The Fully enclosed Baseball stadium at the park?

Brunner's Bar-B-Q? Pappy's pizza (Pre-Pizza Hut) Back then if you wanted a pizza you bought a Chef Boyardee pizza kit. Wow. I miss those times.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 8:49 AM

"anyone else remember mattingly's"

I remember buying some stamps there for my stamp collection, when a small boy. It's been a long time, but didn't Gambles go in that locations after Mattinglys?

-- Posted by Ray on Sat, Aug 22, 2009, at 2:37 AM

Slater, Perhaps we should post NOEII at the beginning to warn the 99% (seems a little high since we are at least two!). Hope you bought your chair today and are looking forward to relaxing in it soon. The great thing about getting older is that you can see things in your mind's eye. Each fall, I call up memories of a beautiful yellow maple that I looked at for 10 autumns from 1964-74 in Ohio. I see persimmons falling to the ground in my neighborhood and remember the persimmon trees at Nana's house in Slater in the 30s-40s.

The vertigo came on after I had both knees replaced in 2006. It didn't respond to medication. May be genetic. My daughter has had it. Ghastly when the room first starts spinning, but hasn't driven me to the emergency room since the first incident.

-- Posted by upsedaisy on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 11:54 PM

Wow, no one's arguing tonight about health care or politics or whatever. Just a lot of love floating around. Everyone is feeling real mellow, I guess.

What do you think - take about a day to get back to normal? =)

-- Posted by Dawson16 on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 11:46 PM

The towheaded boy, sadness etched on his face and in his voice hoarsely whispered, "Cards lost," and without further comment, gathered his possessions and left.

Good night one and all.

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 11:34 PM

Upsedaisy, even though I never tried skateboarding, I think I get enough of a sense to know I'd be the spectator rather than the participant.

Vertigo has to be difficult to deal with. Is there a viable treatment for it, or is it one of those things you just deal with?

I don't possess much knowledge of art, but I enjoy looking at paintings. I'm sort of keen on the Flemish painters and really like the Ver Meer painting, Girl with a Pearl Earring.

Do you travel through New England in the fall when the leaves turn? I suppose the colors vary from year to year, but ordinarily pretty vibrant? Around the yard at the old homeplace in Slater were several Silver Maples, and fall was always a fun time for me, playing in the leaves that I'd raked up. I can still sense that wonderful smell when it came time to set them afire. I do love the fall.

Well, the clock says you're into Saturday now. Have a great weekend!

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 11:11 PM

alta patton ... what a lady! i remember living on vest street as a kid, just east of the middle school, she'd be pushing her little grocery cart down the street headed toward the square to say her piece ... we'd yell at her from the upstairs windows "praise the Lord!" and she'd immediately turn and yell the same thing back to us, sometimes breaking out into more.

she was always there, every saturday, on the north end of the square, by the statue, little bible in hand, preaching, screaming at the top of her voice, preaching the Word. I don't remember mattingly's drowning her out with music, probably happened, but i do remember her being one strong lady. i always wondered what happened to her ...

anyone else remember mattingly's and going into the basement, the toy store down there?

-- Posted by aikman8 on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 11:10 PM

Gal66 -- my wife stirred up some barbeque sauce using the recipe you posted on here, and I'll say it's mighty tasty! Thanks!

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 10:13 PM

Dawson16 it sure does not look good.

So sad!

-- Posted by Gal66 on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 10:04 PM

I remember her also we moved to Marshall in 1972 and one of the first things my Dad did was take me to the back to open my savings account it startled me when she spoke so loud.

-- Posted by Gal66 on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 10:02 PM

When the new poll went up I was really interested to see how the voting would go this first day before people get the chance to vote again and again and skew the results.

It's running 2 to 1 against.

Representative of how the town will vote? Makes a person wonder.

-- Posted by Dawson16 on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 10:00 PM

The description of Alta Patton's behavior reminds me of my first-grade teacher.

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 9:35 PM

I remember her. The first thing that comes to mind is that she was obnoxious and extremely loud.

She was very frightening to little kids.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 8:39 PM

i remember i worked on the square sometimes and mattinglys put a loud speaker with music to try and drown her out. one tough ole bird she was!!

-- Posted by wheresthelove on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 5:36 PM

Alta Patton:

God rest her soul was the lovely lady referred to. I am not afraid to post her name she would have been proud that so many remembered her (I think!) :)

-- Posted by litlmissme on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 5:30 PM

Missy08,

She passed some years ago. Have her name ( out of respect I would give it out, on here )right on the tip of my tongue. Not 100% certain, but I think her old home was bulldozed, a duplex in it's place.

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 5:16 PM

I remember her too! She stood on the Northeast corner and "yelled" toward Wood and Huston. Scared the snot out of me when I was a kid! Wonder what happened to her?

Slater, I like your stories.

Have a good weekend everybody!

-- Posted by missy08 on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 4:53 PM

*This lady would walk down North Street, (where there used to be a lot of bars) open the door of each one and yell inside "Go Home, You Sinners"!*

Priceless!

-- Posted by Third Child on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 4:51 PM

Third Child,

I remember her. When I was a child and went to town with my mother, it frightened me. She was still at it when I was a teen and young adult. My grandmother owned a restaurant 1 block off the square on North Street. This lady would walk down North Street, (where there used to be a lot of bars) open the door of each one and yell inside "Go Home, You Sinners"! Saw that with my own eyes one day, while walking to the restaurant to work for the evening!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 4:38 PM

You go, Slater!

By the bye, I was asleep before you posted your response last evening! Yep, mixed expressions in their faces, however, all said they missed me! Sure makes you feel good.

How about a new topic; friendship and keeping in touch with past, present & future utilizing any venue possible? (^*^) Ok, ok....I know I shouldn't stir the pot, unless it's the one in my kitchen! HA!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 4:30 PM

Public Square

When I was a lad there was a woman who would choose a position on the square in Marshall, usually on the south or east side, and give extemporaneous speeches to any and all that would listen. I was young and didn't really understand what it was all about but do recall damning jabs being thrown at the inhabitants of the courthouse across the street in a voice as loud as a bullhorn.

It was mostly fire and brimstone meant for all comers but there was a strong element of targeted political criticism, that at the time, I thought quite bold.

I recall teenagers mocking her but it didn't seem to matter. She would just turn up the volume that much more. Adults seemed to tune her out as they went about their business, much like today.

Who else remembers this?

-- Posted by Third Child on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 4:29 PM

Re: chit chat. That's really what Speak Out is for. Any given post will seem interesting to some, uninteresting to others. Those who are interested are invited to read and response. Those who are uninterested are invited to skip that comment.

-- Posted by Eric Crump on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 4:20 PM

MidMoCat, and any other like-minded boors:

You don't like what gets posted here, don't read it.

I'm completely bored by what you have to say, but I haven't told you to go somewhere else, before now, that is.

You leave, and take your friends with you.

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 3:56 PM

A suggestion.. Someone could open a blog with a subject line of 'Friends' or 'Reunion' or something for that type of discussion? Just a thought..

-- Posted by Third Child on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 3:37 PM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
Excellent idea, Third Child! Our web publishing system doesn't have a discussion forum application, per se, but it occurred to me that we might try setting up a blog for this purpose. It actually fits in with an occasional column, Recollections, that we publish whenever a guest columnist has a story to share. I'll find and publish some of the past columns, but in the meantime, I've added an initial post that invites current reminiscers to continue their conversation. Another good thing about this idea: Stories of the past will now have their own place, making it easier to find things for future reference than the hurly burly mishmash of Speak Out.

Yes, Grandma, There is a Death Panel

http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/art...

http://www.hhs.gov/recovery/programs/os/...

-- Posted by Third Child on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 3:07 PM

First Lady, Michelle Obama, Requires 26 Servants

Little did American voters realize the call for "change" would result in the establishment of an Obama oligarchy.

The annual cost to taxpayers for such unprecedented attention is approximately $1,750,000 without taking into account the expense of the lavish benefit packages afforded to every attendant..

http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/art...

"In my own life, in my own small way, I have tried to give back to this country that has given me so much," she said. "See, that's why I left a job at a big law firm for a career in public service,"-- Michelle Obama.

-- Posted by Third Child on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 2:41 PM

Oops i should have looked further...website says its going to be sept 8 i believe. You gotta take your furkids..its a hoot!!

-- Posted by wheresthelove on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 2:25 PM

Hey!! Does anyone happen to know if they are going to have the doggy swim at the city pool this year like they held last year? I took my girls don't remember when i've had so much fun!! Hopefully it happens again this year!! We are really looking forward to it...

-- Posted by wheresthelove on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 2:21 PM

Sorry Slater, I took your advice, "I see by the old clock on the wall that it's approaching midnight. Keep in mind that every one hour of sleep you get before midnight is equivalent to each two hours after midnight.

Sleep tight!

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:28 PM"

Of course, the next night you're holding forth cheerfully at 12:28 p.m.

Yes, the architect Frank Lloyd Wright designed the Guggenheim. The building itself is art. Some critics feel it overshadows the art displayed. I haven't been there since the addition was completed. I have vertigo and some problems w/depth perception, so it can be challenging. It brings out the latent skateboarder in all. Who does not look down from the top floor and not visualize flying around those curves?

-- Posted by upsedaisy on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 12:40 PM

The Marshall school board is expected to discuss Tuesday the creation of a community committee that will advise it on the building bond issue campaign.

I don't know if anyone is thinking about forming an opposition group, but if you do, I hope you'll post here or contact me with any information the group puts forth (meetings, positions, questions, etc.). 660-886-2233 or marshalleditor@socket.net.

So far, our online conversations have been a great source of questions and concerns. I gathered a list of them before meeting with Craig Noah and Larry Godsey two weeks ago, and they were quite willing to address each.

I plan to continue doing so between now and election day and would like to include any representatives of opposing groups as sources for stories.

-- Posted by Eric Crump on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 11:20 AM

Upsedaisy, is the Guggenheim the building designed by F.L. Wright? It's the tall, round building?

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 12:12 AM

I'm doing my best to turn over a new leaf, OKR. I'm convinced that I'm very unbecoming as a grump. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 21, 2009, at 12:02 AM

Slater: You are in good spirits this evening. Whats wrong? :)

Gailbrath's quote to me is the ultimate in cynicism about government.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:54 PM

Cosa Nostra

You might want to suggest the Y establish prices for classes on an individual basis. Our Senior Center charges six dollars for each strength training class, for example. Seems to work and people are happy with the arrangement.

-- Posted by upsedaisy on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:54 PM

CARDS WIN!! CARDS WIN!!

Too bad Harry Carey moved to Chicago.

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:52 PM

OKR, don't mind me. I think Fanboy must've slipped one of those pink pills in my water. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:50 PM

OKR, so it would be nam stiolpxe nam?

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:41 PM

Under capitalism man exploits man. Under communism it is just the opposite.--J.K. Galbraith.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:28 PM

Hi NB.

What a busy day you had! Which highway did you travel? I haven't been on I-70 since 1997, and it was a frightful mess then. When we were in Slater in 2006 we came from Kansas City by way of Highway 24/65, and that was the first time I'd been on that road since the mid-1960s.

I'm pleased to hear that you got that painting chore taken care of, yep, between the storms. Sure wish some of that rain could drift southward.

What did the faces look like today? A mix of sad and happy, maybe?

Hubby needs to invest in some good standing shoes for you, or maybe some of those industrial mats, the cushioned model. :)

Well, I see by the old clock on the wall that it's approaching midnight. Keep in mind that every one hour of sleep you get before midnight is equivalent to each two hours after midnight.

Sleep tight!

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:28 PM

Hey there Slater,

The windows are painted (between thunder storms). School started today. The kids are back! Had a great day. Made a quick to KC and back, after closing the store. After such a lazy summer, my dogs are tired(standing on concrete since 6:30 am to 4:30 pm), my butt is numb(sitting for my round trip) and I'm half cross-eyed. Hope I'm spelling everything right! HA! Just thought I'd pop in and say hello!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 10:21 PM

I didn't spend much time trying to locate the other 90, so maybe you'll have better luck.

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 10:03 PM

Cosa Nostra, who's twisting your arm and forcing you to read our posts? Try minding your own business.

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 10:01 PM

No, Upsedaisy, I looked at about a truckload of them yesterday, but I don't believe the Back Saver was in the group. The one I went searching for is made by Lane and it's called a Mission style. It has wood arms and slats down the sides, much in the style of an Adirondack chair. We're in the process of changing out our living room furniture, so I decided I'd add a recliner to the mix. :)

I've passed through NYC on my way to Germany in 1961, then on my way back to Missouri after being discharged from the Army in 1963, but I didn't take any time during the return to look around. The Statue of Liberty and two or three museums will be on the itenerary when I finally do get up that direction.

Thanks for the recliner suggestion.

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 9:28 PM

Ha ha ha...no, Fanboy, you hang on to those pills. You need them much more than I ever would.

You like 80s music, so try this out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m77YGAaJh...

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 9:05 PM

Slater I've been out to the Statue of Liberty a couple of times. Seeing it at night is very special. On a hot summer night you can ride the ferry to Staten Island and enjoy a million dollar view and hopefully a cool breeze all for the price of the ferry ride. It was a bargain at a quarter in the olden days. You get off in Staten Island and catch the next ferry back. Kathy Fairchild will probably remind us Liberty Island Park is in New Jersey. Some years NJ "farmers" have better luck--I've had mighty fine corn and fresh tomatoes on 54th St. after a day trip to south Jersey farm stands.

In the market for a recliner? Have you checked out the Back-Saver? I've had one for fourteen years. Great solution for back pain, along w/a cup of Tetley's British Blend Tea.

-- Posted by upsedaisy on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 8:59 PM

Thank you, Mr. Crump; although I must say omitting obituary notices from the free electronic version of the MDN would encourage us "freeloaders" to buy more papers! :)

-- Posted by born-n-raised on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 7:09 PM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
Ah, a challenge we wrestle with all the time: What to give away and how to stay in business if we do. Thanks for noticing :-)

It's fun, isn't it WonderJim? I haven't twisted a single word.

Maybe you've been taking too many of those pink pills.

Don't worry. I won't come back around your way, unless you invite me again.

Now YOU'RE in the real world.

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 6:19 PM

You have to pay $0.75 if you want to know who died in this town.

-- Posted by born-n-raised on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 5:47 PM

TerryM, there were a couple of obituaries in the print version of the paper today. Guess they haven't got everything online yet because I saw another newsworthy article on the front page which isn't online either. Can't remember what it was. Oh yes, now I do. Library news. Budget woes for the library.

-- Posted by Dawson16 on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 4:55 PM

WonderJim,

You have a certain mindset which you revealed in your second post about the pass/fail grading system of some class and how you felt victimized by it. I've not been trying to change your way of thinking, since that isn't an issue; instead, I attempted to show how people differ in their overall view of their environment. Two individuals in an identical situation could very well have totally opposite views of identical experiences.

You and Scarpetta should endeavour to take the same classes together. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 4:43 PM

NEW TOPIC!!

I'd hate to be in the funeral business in Marshall right now. According to the MDN obits, nobody's died in the last week.

Is the Democrat-News being boycotted for funeral info?

-- Posted by TerryM on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 4:23 PM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
We published two obituaries today.

"If you believe people (in general) do not take into consideration race/acquaintance/affiliation, I still say you are lying to yourself."

Totally agree, very well put.

-- Posted by Scarpetta on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 2:50 PM

WonderJim,

I encountered my share of high hurdles during college days, but that's how I saw it.

"You obviously have never taken a course by an instructor, in which the entire faculty is highly anticipating their retirement, that only distributes one A' per course per semester."

This statement sounds to me as if you've been listening to and taking to heart too many rumors. You'd be hard-pressed to ever make a case of this argument since it has no basis in fact.

It's very true that some instructors are extremely demanding and therefore the number of A's would be minimal, but that certainly doesn't support your allegation that teachers deliberately discriminate against students at the college level. I could agree that it does happen in high school and the earlier grades, but you'll otherwise have to prove your point.

Some people don't accept responsibility for themselves, for their failures, preferring instead to blame outside circumstances on the outcome.

My point is that failure has to do with looking inside ourselves and owning up to our shortcomings rather than trying to put the blame for any failures we experience on factors that have nothing to do with outcomes.

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 1:57 PM

Hey Slater, Hope you've been well, Friend? Have you found the Sand Stone with all the Name's yet? Or are you like me to stiff too be roaming around through the woods?? Bill from RayTown, it seems to me i remember you when we were Kid's. I don't know how , but something about you working in a Service Station , before your Police Career! I don't really know. You are a little older than me? I'm 74! No biggie just a thought! Glad your still around! Hang in there!!

-- Posted by Jo on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:55 AM

Oklahoma Reader, good to hear from you. I have been so busy with other commitments that I very seldom post anything. As time permits I do read some of the postings. You are right my views are still very conservative and as you would probably suspect (in my opinion) the legislative, judicial, and executive branches of our government have hit an all time low............God help us!

-- Posted by Billfromraytown on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:50 AM

WonderJim, when I first started college it didn't take long for me to realize that students who fail classes do so based on their own lack of preparation. That's the simple truth of the matter, and no attribution can be made favoring any externalities.

The reality is not "me against the world," as you concluded, but rather "me against me."

You thrive or fail purely on your own merit - no more, no less - and if you believe otherwise, you're deluding yourself by attributing your degree of success (or failure) to imaginary forces.

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:47 AM

Abraham Lincoln, on our true enemies:

"The money powers prey on the nation in times of peace and conspire against it in times of adversity. The banking powers are more despotic than monarchy, more insolent than autocracy, more selfish than bureaucracy. They denounce as public enemies all who question their methods or throw light upon their crimes.

I have two great enemies, the Southern Army in front of me, and the bankers in the rear. Of the two, the one at my rear is my greatest foe. As a most undesirable consequence of the war, corporations have been enthroned, and an era of corruption in high places will follow. The money power will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until the wealth is aggregated in the hands of a few, and the Republic is destroyed."

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:41 AM

STLgirl, those are indeed great memories, and what a collection of memorabilia those albums are!

I was sad to see old Busch replaced and torn down, since I really liked that stadium. I haven't been to the new one, so I don't know personally how it compares. Did you or any family get any souvenirs from the old stadium when it was demolished? I think I read in the St. Louis paper about people carrying off all sorts of parts from it. :)

I see the team fared well out west against the Dodgers. Yippeeeeee!!!!!!

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:29 AM

Global War and Dying Democracy: The Revolution of the Elites

Take the red pill to know the plans to dominate and enslave the planet..

PLEASE READ THIS!

Global Power and Global Government: Part 5

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?c...

This article is the 5th and final part in the series, "Global Power and Global Government," published by Global Research.

Part 1: Global Power and Global Government: Evolution and Revolution of the Central Banking System

Part 2: Origins of the American Empire: Revolution, World Wars and World Order

Part 3: Controlling the Global Economy: Bilderberg, the Trilateral Commission and the Federal Reserve

Part 4: Forging a "New World Order" Under a One World Government

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?c...

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 11:22 AM

Americans=Serfs Ruled by Oligarchs

Paul Craig Roberts

"In a little time [there will be] no middling sort. We shall have a few, and but a very few Lords, and all the rest beggars." R.L. Bushman

"Rapidly you are dividing into two classes--extreme rich and extreme poor." "Brutus"

Americans think that they have "freedom and democracy" and that politicians are held accountable by elections. The fact of the matter is that the US is ruled by powerful interest groups who control politicians with campaign contributions. Our real rulers are an oligarchy of financial and military/security interests and AIPAC, which influences US foreign policy for the benefit of Israel.. snip..

http://www.infowars.com/americans-serfs-...

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 10:46 AM

WonderJim -- do you believe that private institutions routinely qualify students for graduation based on their mere appearance on campus?

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 10:38 AM

Obama lies to defend US War of Aggression in Afghanistan

Sending your kids to die for the new world odor

http://www.examiner.com/x-18425-LA-Count...

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 10:22 AM

Obama Is A Corporate Marketing Creation

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEHzjn5ws...

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 9:59 AM

Sorry Red Dog you lose. I live in Marshall about two blocks from an elementry school.

Cash will be fine. That's a joke. Don't take it too seriously.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 7:24 AM

Well Slater, being the youngster I am all my games were at the old Bush stadium and my parents have pictures of me and my step-uncle Stan next to the Stan Musial statue that was there. I do fondly remember getting to wear our Cards t-shirts over our catholic school uniforms in 1987 during the World Series. And Ozzie Smith is my most remembered player from my childhood. My grandfather and one of my aunts make the yearly trip to FL for spring training and have many pictures with and autographs from Cards players over the last 3 decades, great memories in those albums.

-- Posted by STLgirlMarshallMom on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 6:31 AM

This wtf guy is an agitator isn't he? Why does he write what he does?

Because He Can.

MDN gives him a forum. He has used it before on other issues. This one about schools is a juicy one for him.

I will bet even money he doesn't even live in the district. I bet he lives a State or two away.

Enough said about this guy. I am going to ignore him. I suggest you do the same.

-- Posted by red dog on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 5:30 AM

Well, on that note I'm clocking out and giving my feeble eyes a rest.

Good night to you, Ray, and to anyone else looking in.

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 12:51 AM

"That's right, Ray. No more argumentum ad hominem from me."

Sounds good to me. I'm not sure everyone will buy in. But a bilateral agreement w/you works for me even if no one else agrees.

-- Posted by Ray on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 12:46 AM

"Here is what I actually said:

'Actually, we do know how the majority of them voted.'"

At this point I have to laugh. :-) :-) I went back over WTF's posts for the one where he attacked me viciously, stating how I voted, when we clearly know he doesn't know how I voted. Voting as we all know is secret ballot. WTF's post was so nasty that it's now been deleted. It's definitely futile to try to debate somehow engaging in vicious ad hominem attacks, who denies doing it and has his posts deleted for being ad hominem attacks. The totality of what has transpired is very revealing, IMO. I think "stacked deck," might be an appropriate term at this point.

-- Posted by Ray on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 12:39 AM

That's right, Ray. No more argumentum ad hominem from me.

I'm Mr. Nice Guy from now on. Why don't you join me and thereby reduce your stress level? I'm sure we could have a normal conversation about non-controversial topics.

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 12:36 AM

Welp, that ends my slow stroll down this blog road fer the evenin. I think I oughter jes slip outside real quick and check that awesome night sky, and breath in real deep the sweet perfumes of a late summer's night.

Good night.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 12:21 AM

"Hmmm...are these the same chivalrous conservatives that want to legislate what a woman can do with her body?"

WTF: I debate the issues and give factual examples supporting ascertations made. You merely attack me and have done so from your earliest postings against me. I see no signs that you are desisting in your mean spiritedness.

-- Posted by Ray on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 12:20 AM

Hey Okie!

It's okay for me to call you that? :)

It's quiet around this area these days. Nothing much of controversy is taking place, so the natives are fairly lucid.

I went out furniture shopping today, looking for a Mission-style recliner I saw in a Macy's ad a couple of months ago, and I found it, AND it goes on sale this Friday for $350. off list! The luck of the Irish, maybe. (heh heh)

I got a good laugh from that Tequila ad. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 12:20 AM

Evenin Ray.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 12:13 AM

Good night Mizz NanaDot. Good night Johnboy.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 12:11 AM

Slater:

I've never taken a pass/fail class in my life. They were all for grades.

As for Hamlet. It's probably my favorite Shakespearean play.

I disagree with Hamlet. IMO, it is better to oppose a sea of troubles (if feasible) and by opposing end them.

Thank you for disregarding any future comments from me. I consider that a real blessing based on your past ad hominem attacks against me.

-- Posted by Ray on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 12:11 AM

Hello Upsedaisy,

We just rolled into Thursday, so we've caught up with you Easterners. :)

So, it was a yukky forecast for your area, eh? I have a long-time friend in New Jersey, and he keeps me up on the weather, especially during the summer when he's wanting his garden to produce. All the rain earlier about did it in, I understand.

I wondered the same thing about some aid for the farmers. I expect there'll be a certain number who won't be in the business much longer if the weather doesn't change for the better.

I'm sure you've been out to the Statue of Liberty. I'm excited about the re-opening of her crown, but I haven't heard whether the torch will ever be re-opened. I've never been out there, but I'm hoping to see her some day.

Hope your weather improves! :)

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 12:10 AM

Also good evenin to you Mizz Upsedaisy. I hope your evenin is a goin fair to middlin.

Maybe some of us can bring some fresh material to the blog afore long. I'm a hopin so. :)

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 12:07 AM

"Take a chance on some calling you a very unreasonable Man! And, i will say,may be a very selfish hateful Person! Sorry Ray, that's my personal opinion."

Jo: More ad hominem attacks, instead of addressing issues.

-- Posted by Ray on Thu, Aug 20, 2009, at 12:04 AM

Good evening Slater. I have decided to make this my cordial greeting evening, We have had rain day after day here. I wish you could have the rain that is coming...again, tonight, we don't need it.

This blog has turned into a brouhaha recently. ENOUGH!

I am about burned out on the healthcare issue, and am convinced that the American people either really don't know what they want, or don't know that what they claim to want, isn't what they really want. Oh yes, and there are those that are loud, and clear about what they don't want, but are clueless as to what would be better. At least you can't get two sentences out of them as to what they want. Whew.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 11:59 PM

Hi Slater,

Just logged on and noted the weather report at the top of the page for Marshall. ND is probably right--everyone is hunkered down riding out the storm. Here on the East Coast the NBC weatherman last night predicted our weather today would be "Yucky". Not exact science but an accurate description!

I remember a summer in San Antonio when there were many, many yucky days w/o ac. TX is more tolerable w/ac,but the cost to cool is hitting those w/o jobs hard.

Of course, you also have the drought. (Two years on is it?) I saw footage recently out of TX showing starving cattle at auction and predictions people would not be getting back into the cattle business. I remember during snow storms out west in the 50s the government used planes to airlift hay to stranded cattle. Wonder why the government doesn't step in w/water and hay to keep the cattle business afloat?

I share your view that some folks are getting absurdly testy and seem to have a great need to say the same thing over and over.

Gets right much old.

-- Posted by upsedaisy on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 11:50 PM

BillfromRaytown: You probably won't believe this, but I am glad to see you are still kicking. Re: no deaths in Marshall, I had the same thought. Isn't it amazing how some of your perspectives change as you get a bunch of years behind you.

You know we have been locking horns longer than you probably realize. Way back when there were just a few writing anything beyond how are you, on what was then the "guest book" on the Democrat News. We really used to get after each other. I was writing then as "Old Timer". There were a few others posting also. I have often wondered if any of them are posting now, under different screen names.

In my opinion neither you, nor I have changed much since then. I guess old dogs are too stubborn to learn new tricks. So, if you come back at me swinging it would be just like before... so why bother? We have both said our bit to each other. Take care of yourself.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 11:47 PM

Ohhh! Well, send it this direction. In another week we will have ended the driest two-year period in recorded history for s.a.

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 11:41 PM

I guess everyone picked up their marbles and went home.

Jo, I see I mistyped your screen name. Sometimes I think my fingers are operated by another engine.

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 11:23 PM

Hey Joe!

I haven't said hello to you for a while, so it's about time. How's your summer treating you? :)

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 11:03 PM

Like i said Ray, use Intuition & Common Sense! Everyone knows right from wrong! All of this silly, (Crap) makes no sense to anyone, that has those qualities! And does absolutely nothing for the Quality of life for the People, Republicans or Democrats! But if that's what you want to do, get out to some of these Townhall meetings, were there's Cameras and Reporters and you can get a lot more coverage! Take a chance on some calling you a very unreasonable Man! And, i will say,may be a very selfish hateful Person! Sorry Ray, that's my personal opinion.Just a guess??

-- Posted by Jo on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 10:42 PM

Ray,

Here is what I actually said:

"Actually, we do know how the majority of them voted."

Since we know who won the election I thought you would be able to get that. I was obviouly wrong. Where in that statement do I claim to know how every "individual" voted? It was a joke Ray.

Did the Marx-o-centrics steal your sense of humor?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 10:21 PM

Ray, the point about schools offering a pass/fail system is that anyone can pass. Now do you get it?

Your blustery manner is tiring, and I'm no longer intending to pay you any mind.

Go to the library and check out a copy of Hamlet and turn to the third act, second scene and study on the meaning of the line, "The lady doth protest too much, methinks." Maybe you'll then understand why others in here are challenging your opinions.

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 10:19 PM

Gee Ray,

You're actually quite sensitive and emotional aren't you? No one is attacking you personally.

I don't know you and I certainly don't hate you

but I will comment on your comments and I can be just as smug and condescending as you are. It doesn't really get us anywhere does it?

Let's take a look at some of your greatest hits:

"Your patronizing, insulting, dismissive "

"Your ignorance is showing. Men and women have historically faced oppressions in their lives. The chivalrous conservatives have always tried to have gender roles that protect women, often at the expense of men's safety. But in the 1960's it was the radical feminists in the democrat party who fueled vast, new discriminations against all things male - and you know it."

Hmmm...are these the same chivalrous conservatives that want to legislate what a woman can do with her body?

"but that does not stop you from making a totally ignorant comment like the one above"

Those are all your words Ray or did some "Marx-O-Centric make you type them? No matter because I'm sure you feel totally justified because you were provoked, right?

Joe McCarthy would be so proud of you.

Like I said. Glenn Beck called and wants his act back.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 10:15 PM

Of course, people know how the overall vote went. But no one knows how any person voted personally, unless they divugle that info, and clearly WTF was alleging he knew how I voted. That's purely ignorance by the dictionary definition. To call pointing out the facts about the secret ballot a GOP tactic, strikes me as a Stalinist tactic. This is America, not Russia, or China, the secret ballot is sacred, and to be attacked as voting a certain way, as WTF did to me without having a clue, is not the American way, IMO.

As to your other question, what in the world does pass/fail have to do with anything? Explain yourself.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 9:40 PM

"Ray & WTF: I'm with Slater. This is getting old. Truce!"

I'd love to see the personal attacks end. WTF's personal attacks on me have been relentless, as well as the personal attacks of others on me. WTF, and others, should refrain from personal attacks and stick to debating issues, IMO. It is WTF, and others, who initiated the personal attacks on me and it is he, and others, who are continuing with the personal attacks. By all means, go back and check it out. Just the personal attacks on me by he, and others (that have been deleted), overwhelmingly show how vicious he, and other, posters have been to me.

Sincerely, Ray

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 9:31 PM

Ray,

Your GOP tactic regarding the point of knowing how people voted in the general election doesn't fly with me.

Yes, my commentary about your school success was a snide dig, but don't overestimate your brain power. Go with an open mind, if that's possible, and maybe you'll have success.

By the way, does this school you'll be attending use a pass/fail grading system?

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 9:30 PM

More and more we are seeing what Obama is about. Now we see how the Obama administration will profit from his "health care" bill.

http://tinyurl.com/ll32jy

"Firms with Obama ties profit from health push"

"WASHINGTON -- President Barack Obama's push for a national health care overhaul is providing a financial windfall in the election offseason to Democratic consulting firms that are closely connected to the president and two top advisers.

Coalitions of interest groups running at least $24 million in pro-overhaul ads hired GMMB, which worked for Obama's 2008 campaign and whose partners include a top Obama campaign strategist."

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 9:19 PM

Gee Ray,

That fact that we have a "Democrat" president as opposed to another Republican president suggest that the "majority" voted for the democratic candidate, would it not? I never claimed to know how every individual voted but I think it's clear how the majority voted.

Get over it.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 9:13 PM

"Sorry Eric, but the more Ray spews his hatred and bile.."

That's another ad hominem attack on my person, rather than any issue.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 9:07 PM

I think it might behoove me to move to Marshall, looks like people have quit dying there. No obituaries added for several days now!

-- Posted by Billfromraytown on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 9:05 PM

Slater:

Do you think WTF's allegation, that he knows how people using a secret ballot voted is not ignorance? He does not know. That is ignorance. Please go to your dictionary and look up the word. I was polite not to say what that ignorance infers. WTF's attack based on "beliefs," not facts, is vicious and ongoing. Your attack on my scholastic abilities is likewise mean spirited.

As far as your snide attack on me, that I will "flunk out," that appears quite ignorant based on my past academic performance. However, I suppose it's possible I could go into a coma, not show up for my classes, and not drop my classes, but I assure you, historically, that's not been the case. I don't think attacking my academic record is a wise thing to do.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 9:04 PM

Ray,

Is Obama forcing you at gunpoint to go to this "leftist" school? Oh the humanity!

I don't think you have any right to accuse me of running away from an arguement. The problem is you won't talk about anything unless it is anti-Obama. Let's talk about the Bush admin. Ray. How do you feel about them? Hypocrisy is not a virtue.

Sorry Eric, but the more Ray spews his hatred and bile the more I"m gonna call him on it.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 9:03 PM

Ray, enjoy your short stay in school. When you flunk out, maybe you can make a case for being the target of leftist discrimination, particularly if the Dean of the department in which you're enrolled is a woman.

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 8:44 PM

Ray & WTF: I'm with Slater. This is getting old. Truce!

-- Posted by Eric Crump on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 8:39 PM

"Thanks Ray. You have proven my point."

Really? What is your point in that post, to declare victory, then run and hide? Apparently, you are unable, or unwilling, to debate the issues and stay on topic. It's no biggee. I'm back in school in a couple of weeks, contending with the far left professors who are brainwashing the next generation of America's youth into the Marx-o-centric ideologies.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 8:32 PM

"Ray calling specific individuals ignorant and moronic..."

That's a lie. I called no one the terms you allege above.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 8:25 PM

Canada's health care system is imploding. Why, oh why, would we ever go to a government run health care system?

http://tinyurl.com/kkb9nx

"The new president of the Canadian Medical Association, Dr. Anne Doig, has made comments that indicate that Canada's public run healthcare system is running on empty.

'We all agree that the system is imploding, we all agree that things are more precarious than perhaps Canadians realize...We know that there must be change...We're all running flat out, we're all just trying to stay ahead of the immediate day-to-day demands.'"

http://tinyurl.com/lztubg

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 8:24 PM

Thanks Ray. You have proven my point.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 8:23 PM

Editor Crump, how long are you going to let this nonsense continue, Ray calling specific individuals ignorant and moronic, but a reference to his being a "b_ _ _ _r o_d m_n" gets that post deleted.

Fair is fair.

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 8:22 PM

Every day we are seeing more of what it is that Obama stands for:

http://www.capoliticalnews.com/

"It seems that Obama has absolutely NO respect for Americans. His Obamacare is a take over of your health care--he believes government should decide if you live or die. He has taken over a large portion of the finance and auto industry, uses stimulus money to pay off radicals and unions.

Now, he has decided that if you attend a Townhall you must be a Nazi, astro-turf, rich trying to kill the poor and worse. No respect.

As for illegal aliens, to Obama, the more the merrier. Just this week he pretty much cut the raids of employers hiring illegal aliens. If he wanted, he could raid almost every car wash in California and deport thousands of illegal aliens, for a start. Instead, he wants to give these criminals, like those who burned 90,000 acres in a National Forest growing marijuana, citizenship!!!"

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 8:08 PM

"You hate democrats which pathetically manifest's itself in your constant usage of the term the "democrat" party or "democrat" politics."

Once again, you attack me personally, instead of the issue(s). I don't like the thuggish tactics of the democrat party and their operatives. The more those tyrants work to suppress the free speech of freedom loving Americans, and push their tyrannical agenda, the more I'll speak up.

http://tinyurl.com/lztubg

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 8:03 PM

"Actually, we do know how the majority of them voted."

Really? You know how each individual voted? Tell me another one.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 7:57 PM

"Really Ray? That's all you do is attack people. Just because they are public figures and may not be on this blog does not lessen the attack.

I see once again you won't respond to any post that calls you out. So c'mon Ray. Where's your URL and you buzzwords?"

That's another lie. We as Americans are free to debate policies and the politicians who push their agenda. This is not Russia, or Red China - yet. You apparently aren't very aware that there is a difference between attacking an issue, instead of attacking the person who has an issue.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 7:55 PM

"Polling data show that Mr. Obama's approval rating is dropping and is below where George W. Bush was in an analogous period in 2001."

Bush was well hated and then 9-11 happened. Elemental physics was turned on its head. Three buildings imploded at the speed of gravity and George Bush was off and running.. the flag waving torturer in chief was back in the ball game..

The country bought the lies and made the sacrifice because we are sheep. The truth was known at the time but sheep live in denial. Fiction is reality in a video world.

Now it's Obama's turn. People are waking up but there's still a lot of denial.

This is a very dangerous time. Collin Powell and Joe Biden have warned us that 'something' will happen in the first few months. We are being played like a fiddle..

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 7:51 PM

Really Ray? That's all you do is attack people. Just because they are public figures and may not be on this blog does not lessen the attack.

I see once again you won't respond to any post that calls you out. So c'mon Ray. Where's your URL and you buzzwords?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 7:45 PM

Actually, we do know how the majority of them voted.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 7:41 PM

"...people that arnt to smart voted him into office making it your fault as well, its a mess."

You do not know how I voted (secret ballot), but that does not stop you from making a totally ignorant comment like the one above, then you proceed to attack and blame me personally "arnt 'to' smart," based only on your total ignorance of my voting record. Apparently, your arguments are so bankrupt of any real meaning that you can only resort to attacking me personally (ad hominem attacks).

Given how Obama's poll numbers are plummeting, it appears there are lots of Americans who've "wised up" to his destructive agenda and now regret how they voted. There are also people who voted Independent, Libertarian, or other. You are totally ignorant of how Americans have voted unless they've declared how they've voted.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 7:33 PM

"Marx-o-centric & Islamofacist = over used GOP buzzwords."

You are wrong again, but at least you appear consistent. Wow, thanks I didn't know I'd used "Marx-o-centric" that much and that so many people are hearing that truth. I see it's really starting to get out there, since I searched for it and could hardly find it. There's nothing like using a word and getting it in the English language. When it comes to Marx-o-centric, it should be used every time the word Democrat is used, IMO. As far as "Islamofascist," it fits the terrorists who have attacked America and deserves to be used as is.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 7:15 PM

Well, it looks like Obama supporters have worked themselves into a real tizzy. Yes, Bush contributed to the economic mess by not vetoing, massive democrat pork, earmarks, and entitlement spending. The radical feminist are some of the most wasteful "pigs at the trough" in Amerika, but there's no end to special identity politics in the democrat party, demanding funding. You just can't beat the democrats big government programs for ripping off taxpayer's money.

"So tell me Ray, what is the actual criteria for

impeachment and what constitutes a nutjob?

Well Ray, I'm still waiting..........."

As to the above question, it isn't the addled, nutcase comments that have been floated demanding Bush's impeachment. If you want an answer beyond that figure it out yourself, or wait for L.A. to freeze over. I'm not your elementary school, civics teacher.

As far as far as Americans, I see the majority no longer approves of the job Obama is doing. Why am I not surprised? As Obama further social engineers and destroys America the numbers will get worse.

http://tinyurl.com/ae6kdj

"It is simply wrong for commentators to continue to focus on President Barack Obama's high levels of popularity, and to conclude that these are indicative of high levels of public confidence in the work of his administration. Indeed, a detailed look at recent survey data shows that the opposite is most likely true. The American people are coming to express increasingly significant doubts about his initiatives, and most likely support a different agenda and different policies from those that the Obama administration has advanced."

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 7:06 PM

notgvnasht,

I agree 100% with you. The neocons are crazy if they think We the People, as represented by the majority, have forgotten what the neocons did to our Nation for 8 years...including Bush/Republican neoclassical economic policies which ultimately crushed our economy and robbed millions of most of their 401K's.

-- Posted by news across on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 6:07 PM

STLgirl -- I saw my first Cardinals game at the old Sportsmans Park, around 1951. Cards vs. Phillies, and the Phillies won. :(

I may be idealizing this bit of information, but I have it in my head that in his first major league game, Stan Musial hit a home run giving the Cards a 3-2 victory over Cincinnati, and in his last game as a major league player, he hit a home run to give the Cards a 3-2 victory over Cincinnati.

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 4:38 PM

So tell me Ray, what is the actual criteria for

impeachment and what constitutes a nutjob?

Well Ray, I'm still waiting...........

Marx-o-centric & Islamofacist = over used GOP buzzwords.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 3:34 PM

*Quit analysing,this insane crap, and stick with him! Inform your friends about the truth!*

Jo, how do you inform your friends about the truth if you don't analyse the crap?

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 2:54 PM

"Inform your friends about the truth!"

The truth is the dem's. are as responsible for the financial mess were in as anybody. The dem's., in the interest of Marx-o-centric social engineering, pushed loan policies on financial institutions that made them make loans to people who couldn't pay them back. Forget supporting democrats. I say vote them out of office.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 2:49 PM

You can't just put Obama in Office and not support him through the Mess he was left with! His supporters needs to be heard, and seen, where are they now? We put him in there, lets make some Noise! Write, Call, and keep calling! Quit analysing,this insane crap, and stick with him! Inform your friends about the truth! You don't know who too believe anymore, but use your Common sense, with these freaks!

-- Posted by Jo on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 2:42 PM

"Them dems had (have) more than enough ammo to take down Bush and Cheney but refuse to do it."

They can't take down anyone because they're they're all complicit. Pelosi has used her procedural power to squash the truth. Obama's justice department wants it covered up. The criminals are investigating themselves!

The system is corrupt and Obama is just playing president. An actor. He does and says what he's told. Rahm Emanuel has more power than Obama.

The blush is off the flower. His polls are plunging. Obama is losing control and that is dangerous. The believers need to be sucked back in. Something to happen to force them to 'trust' the president.. Biden said a crisis was coming.. and the president would do things that weren't popular..

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 2:02 PM

It never ceases to amazing me the amount of ire some people feel against the current POTUS who has only been in office for what? seven months?

In that short time he has managed to commit the crime of at least trying to make sure that WE ALL have affordable heatlhcare. How dare he!

Ok, maybe the bill isn't perfect and maybe the republicans could help us to that end. Have they done everything that they can to help us have affordable health care? No.

Meanwhile we are supposed to overlook that past president's actual crimes. I won't bore you with the laundry list of impeachable offenses committed by the Bush admin.

Kucinich is a "nutjob" for introducing those articles of impeachment.

So tell me Ray,what is the acutal criteria for

impeachment and what constitutes a nutjob?

Is it simple infidelity as seems to be the case when the GOP was in power or probably everything the Bush admin. ever did?

Them dems had (have) more than enough ammo to take down Bush and Cheney but refuse to do it.

These dems that you hate so much hold the fate of your hero's in the palm of thier hands. You should be thankful. Then again maybe they are just waiting for the right time.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 1:06 PM

It appears Kucinch is considered an unsound person even by members of his own party. It was democrats who derailed Kucinich's nut job effort to impeach President Bush.

http://tinyurl.com/634xjk

"WASHINGTON (CNN) -- An attempt by Rep. Dennis Kucinich to impeach President Bush was kicked into legislative no-man's land by members of his own party Wednesday.

The House voted 251-166 to send the Ohio Democrat's impeachment resolution to committee, a maneuver that allows the Democratic leadership to freeze the measure indefinitely.

The vote largely followed partisan lines, with 225 Democrats voting on Kucinich's request to send the measure to committee for consideration.

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has repeatedly said she would not support a resolution calling for Bush's impeachment, saying such a move was unlikely to succeed and would be divisive.

All 166 votes in favor of opening up a House impeachment debate came from Republicans, apparently eager to bring up the vote immediately and paint Democrats as political creatures in a time of serious issues."

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 12:36 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C62KAmMzu...

John Pilger Obama Is A Corporate Marketing Creation -----------------------------------

John Richard Pilger is an Australian journalist and documentary maker. He has twice won Britain's Journalist of the Year Award, and his documentaries have received academy awards in Britain and the US.

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 12:20 PM

"The Corporatists smash every thing they see as a threat, no matter how miniscule the threat."

It appears you're projecting onto capitalists what in reality the Marx-o-centric communists, socialists, national socialists, radical feminists, and democrats, have historically done, including trying to vilify, ordinary, everyday American good citizens who attend town hall meetings.

http://tinyurl.com/mtd8rx

"Six people were arrested at a town hall meeting for Representative Russ Carnahan. Kenneth Gladney, 38, said he was attacked by some of those arrested as he handed out yellow flags with "Don't tread on me" printed on them. Gladney, who is black said he was approached by a black member of the SEIU and called a racial slur before he was assaulted. As you can see in the video below Gladney was also assaulted again, by the white male seen in the picture to the right and thrown to the ground.

Also in the second video below you will see that members of ACORN or the SEIU are let into the doors while hundreds of protesters opposed to Carnahan's support of universal health care were barred from entering."

and

http://tinyurl.com/nly5yg

"...local Pennsylvania people booed ACORN and SEIU members who were bussed into a recent Sen. Specter town hall in Pennsylvania."

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 12:09 PM

Dennis also had the courage to introduce articles of impeachment against Bush.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 11:58 AM

*Corporate media trivialized him.. shut out of the debate.. *

The corporate media is an arm of the military industrial complex. Look at what they did to Ron Paul, the only other peace candidate. Obama never was a peace candidate. That was just corporate marketing illusion that sucked a lot of people in. They had hope..

Now the truth sets in and Sally is getting cynical.. I'm listening to Alex Jones interview Dr. Alan Keyes right now. Wow! Dr. Keyes does not mince words when it comes to criticism of Barack Obama.

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 11:50 AM

TC: Dennis Kucinich was my first choice as the Democratic Party nominee for President. Corporate media trivialized him even though he was not considered a "major candidate". Elmer Fudd references were made, at times he was ignored by the media, and at other times nearly shut out of the debate.

The Corporatists smash every thing they see as a threat, no matter how miniscule the threat.

Further, he is too different in his appearance,his ideas, and his actions to appeal to the brainwashed masses. Remember that he is the candidate who stated during the primary debates that he would establish a Department of Peace.

Nice post.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 10:58 AM

http://current.com/items/90724719_dennis...

Rep. Dennis Kucinnich on healthcare reform:

The hotly-debated HR3200, the so-called "health care reform" bill, is nothing less than corporate welfare in the guise of social welfare and reform. It is a convoluted mess. The real debate which we should be having is not occurring.

Removing the "public option" from a public bill paid for by public money is not in the public interest. What is left is a "private option" paid for with public money. Why should public money be spent on a private option which does not guarantee 100% coverage nor have any cost controls? A true public option would provide 30% savings immediately which would then cover the 1/3rd of the population who presently have no health care.

Unfortunately, under HR3200, the Government is choosing winners and losers in the private sector; proposing to spend public funds on subsidizing insurance companies who make money not providing health care. This process will insure only the expansion of profits. Gone is the debate over cost.

As a result of current negotiations, the Medicare Part D rip-off will continue for another decade, further fleecing senior citizens. Drug importation has been dropped, so no inexpensive drugs can be accessed from other nations.

Instead we are told the pharmaceutical companies will accept a 2% cut in the growth rate of their profits - they call this cost control!

If the matter were not so serious, it would be farcical: The executive branch pretends that the proposed health care reforms are something they are not. The legislation is being attacked for something it is not. Congressional leadership and the White House defend the legislation, pretending it actually is the very proposal that is being attacked. But it is not.

A commonsense government health care reform policy would insure that every single American has full access to health care by expanding Medicare to cover everyone under a Single Payer System. We are already paying for a universal standard of care, it is just we are not getting it.

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 10:36 AM

The Annenberg Foundation is agenda driven. They don't spend that much money for nothing. Saying it is nonpartisan is just playing with words.

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 10:07 AM

Third Child: I checked, it's fact.

-- Posted by Eric Crump on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 9:45 AM

The claim that Factcheck is non partisan needs to be factchecked.

Everything the Annenberg Foundation touches comes from an agenda. It's the social engineering of indoctrinated worker bees raised in a pavlovian school system, taught what to think instead of how to think. The only way it is non partisan is to consider that there is no difference in democrats and republicans.

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 9:16 AM

Saw a bumper sticker the other day. Said "Wage Peace." I loved it.

-- Posted by Green Eyes on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 8:56 AM

Mandate to Congress: Read the bill! Represent the majority. It's not all about Obama.

Last year's legislation does not build confidence amoung voters. In the Great Depression, infrastructure/ public works and job building came first. Revising social programs came later. The same pattern would make sense now. Years of reducing Great Depression era bank and Wall Street regulation that protected under the rubric "It will never a happen again" got us here. Mark Twain said history doesn't repeat but it rhymes. Remember that and use it.

-- Posted by Cat13 on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 8:12 AM

Fact checking AARP membership losses: True, they've lost some membership over the health care issue, but let's read the entire story, please.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/arti...

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 7:50 AM

For nonpartisan analysis of claims made by various sides in public political debates, see http://factcheck.org

These days, the service is offering a number of useful articles about health care reform, and as always, criticizes any source of misleading or distorted information, regardless of party affiliation or ideology.

-- Posted by Eric Crump on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 7:16 AM

Reminder: Please do not post long comments (more than 150-200 words is starting to get longish). Better to post URLs or offer to email longer texts to those who are interested.

-- Posted by Eric Crump on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 7:13 AM

NanaDot: Thanks for linking "The War Prayer". It is an ironic coincidence that I was working on my much more humble bit of church related doggerel when you posted it. I just reread Twain's piece.

Just before the Iraq War we had a miniscule peace march here in OKC. There were about a thousand of us at the first one (though the corporatist local paper said four hundred). At the end of the march "The War Prayer" was read. It was so sad, for most of us knew what was to come.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 2:54 AM

The Bloviates went to church each Sunday in the finest car.

Their diamonds were so big, you could see them from afar.

Pastor said God loved them most , see how they are blessed.

He gave them special unction, to some others he confessed.

The Buckchases, Cravens, and Dealmades, tried to be the same,

and were also quite successful at playing the Bloviate's game.

Pastor said to the others, in his cool and confident voice,

give God money, "tenfold back my brethren", you too can rejoice.

Most of the others were disgruntled when they did not win.

Pastor from the pulpit preached it is because you sin.

Be more like the Bloviates, to this church help me add a wing,

you shall see what riches our God to you will bring.

They scraped together dollars, and went hungry every week.

They counted on the Pastor, and the fact that they were meek.

One Sunday a ragged bearded man stood up, looking all around.

He shouted Preacher its wrong, you have turned it upside down.

Pastor saw the stranger and courageously masked his fear.

Some one call security, that wretch should not be in here.

The stranger was yanked away, he was suspicious you could tell.

He was delivered most appropriately, thrown in a cold dark cell.

Not one thought of the stranger, not one was bereft,

They learned three days later that the wretch had left.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 1:40 AM

"Ray - that road goes both ways..."

I'm not sure you know what you're talking about. But considering how many deadly European conflicts have been fought, that involved interpretation of the scriptures, the road appears to be going in even more directions than two.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_di...

Of course, when it comes to religious "faith," everyone believes they're correct.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 19, 2009, at 1:06 AM

"IF we consider it a necessity, like water, electricity, or sanitation - then it is a commonly-held public utility that is regulated so that everyone has a reasonable, non-profit charge to cover costs and access to what are considered the bare necessities."

At least with public utilities I am not asked to subsidize freeloaders like I am with the proposed ObamaCare bill. If you don't pay your electric bill, your cut off and not just dumped on other taxpayers to support. Please, spare me another nanny state burden, another taxpayers burden for the benefit of those not bearing their fair share, another welfare handout, paid for by hardworking taxpayers.

-- Posted by Ray on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 11:58 PM

"The devil can cite Scripture for his purpose. An evil soul producing holy witness Is like a villain with a smiling cheek."

[1596 Shakespeare Merchant of Venice i. iii. 93]

http://tinyurl.com/qp8hg7

"The proverb alludes to the temptation of Christ by the Devil (matthew iv) when the latter quotes a passage from Psalm xci."

In books and sermons on Bible study, I've been informed to study a verse in the context of the chapter it's in, the chapter in the context of the book it's in, and the book in the context of the entire Bible. The Bible says not to kill, yet in one verse in the Bible Paul refers to the authority of government, very interestingly in chapter 4, talking about bearing the sword.

Romans 13:1-4 (King James Version)

Romans 13

1Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.

2Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.

3For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:

4For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

A lot of Bible scholars and lay people interpret that verse differently.

-- Posted by Ray on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 11:48 PM

Slater, I of course am a life-long Cards fan. Love seeing how well my boys are doing this year.

-- Posted by STLgirlMarshallMom on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 11:27 PM

What say you to Christ's word? Is this what you hear on Sunday at your church, or are these messages missing?

You don't have to be a Christian to endorse this message. You may be a "Christian", and find these messages ignored in your church, and your own heart.

Peacemaking, not War Making: Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God. [Matthew 5:9] Resist

not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also. [Matthew 5:39] I say unto you, Love your

enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despite-fully use you, and persecute

you; [Matthew 5:44]

The Death Penalty: Thou shalt not kill [Matthew 5:21]

Crime and Punishment: If any one of you is without sin, let him be the first to cast a stone at her. [John 8:7] Do not judge, lest

you too be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged and with the measure you use, it will be measured to

you. [Matthew 7:1 & 2.]

Justice: Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled. [Matthew 5:6] Blessed are the

merciful: for they shall obtain mercy [Matthew 5:7] But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your

trespasses. [Matthew 6:15]

Corporate Greed and the Religion of Wealth: In the temple courts [Jesus] found men selling cattle, sheep and doves and other

sitting at tables exchanging money. So he made a whip out of cords, and drove all from the temple area, both sheep and cattle;

he scattered the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables. [John 2:14 & 15.] Watch out! Be on your guard against

all kinds of greed; a man's life does not consist in the abundance of his possessions. [Luke 12.15.] Truly, I say unto you, it will

be hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. [Matthew 19:23] You cannot serve both God and Money. [Matthew 6:24.]

Paying Taxes & Separation of Church & State: Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the

things that are God's. [Matthew 22:21]

Community: Love your neighbor as yourself. .[Matthew 22:39] So in everything, do to others as you would have them do to you.

[Matthew 7:12.] If you would be perfect, go, sell what you possess and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven.

[Matthew 19:21]

Equality & Social Programs: But when you give a feast, invite the poor, the maimed, the lame, the blind, and you will be blessed,

because they cannot repay you. You will be repaid at the resurrection of the just. [Luke 14:13 &14.]

Public Prayer & Displays of Faith: And when thou pray, thou shall not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in

the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

But thou, when thou pray, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret...

[Matthew 6:6 & 7]

Strict Enforcement of Religious Laws: If any of you has a son or a sheep and it falls into a pit on the Sabbath, will you not take

hold of it and lift it out? [Matthew 12:11] The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath. [Mark 2:27.]

Individuality & Personal Spiritual Experience: Ye are the light of the world. [Matthew 5:14]

Follow the Truth.....wherever it leads you!

Copyright 2004 - 2006 WWW.JesusIsALiberal.org All Rights Reserved.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 11:21 PM

THX SO MUCH KATHY, NICE TO KNOW ABOUT FUTURE OF IGA BUILDING !!

-- Posted by gokinser11 on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 11:16 PM

Any Cardinals baseball fans in here?

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 11:09 PM

Robert Reich redux on the necessity of a public option for health care reform.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 11:02 PM

Snow? Before Halloween. Been a cool summer.

On a side note: Go to the State Fair and listen to the clown on the Midway. (Dunking booth) He cracks me up.

-- Posted by ieatsuperglue on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 10:51 PM

Any predictions on when the first snowfall will occur this coming winter?

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 10:45 PM

ND -- thanks for your usual pearls of wisdom. :)

OKR -- the Reich article is a good read, a good summary of the way things look today. I'm siding with Sally, but I'd much rather have reason to move over where Fred resides.

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 10:41 PM

Robert Reich:

"Obama's reluctance to fight for any specifics is causing the base to lose interest."

They haven't lost interest, they've lost the illusion. People are starting to wake up..

"If it comes to a choice between trust and cynicism, America will never achieve lasting change."

This is a twisted comment.. says nothing but puts fence sitting liberals on notice, I guess.. be a good believer and a truster and not a free thinking cynic. The 'base' is not to question the messiah..

-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 10:34 PM

So 60,000 people have resigned from AARP? Guess it's time for those who believe in health reform to sign in.

-- Posted by upsedaisy on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 10:18 PM

OR Thanks for the link to the American Prospect. On the same page to the right you can click on an excellent article on "Letting the People" In by Mark Schmitt. (8-12-09) Very illuminating on a previous attempt at expanding Medicare and how it was cancelled by "the masses". Recommend reading.

NanaDot: Two excellent responses. On excessive use of MRIs and x-rays: It is not only costly it exposes the patient to unhealthy amounts of radiation.

It's interesting that Newt Gingrich promoted the use of online medical records in the 90s as a cost savings measure. Newt?

Yes!

-- Posted by upsedaisy on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 10:14 PM

Robert Reich, "The Limits On Likability", an analysis of the tactics, strategy, and persona of Barak Obama. I'll say it again, President Obama recycled the wrong Robert from the Clinton cabinet. http://www.prospect.org/cs/articles?arti...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 8:27 PM

AMEN NANA DOT!

Re: Your last post. I don't usually get into these sort of political discussions. However, I could not said better, or more eloquently. Pat yourself on the back! NB.

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 8:05 PM

Thank you Kathy and Ray. The recent events in Afghanistan have been very upsetting - hopefully it will quiet down after their election is over. Otherwise, all is good here in the Ozarks. Haven't had the energy for the on-going healthcare debate. I have come to the conclusion that the "powers that be" will do what they want - no matter how loud we scream or how much we argue. The only time we the people are heard is at election time and that's with one vote at a time. :)

-- Posted by Air Force Wife on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 5:28 PM

Thank you Air Force wife. As much as we hear criticism of President Bush from radical feminists and other leftists, we never hear from them about the vastly improved quality of life for Afghanistan's women as a result of America's war on terror - largely shutting down the misogynistic Taliban (Islamo-fascists). Thank you for your family's love of freedom and its service to America. Sincerely, Ray

-- Posted by Ray on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 5:12 PM

no respect!!

-- Posted by wheresthelove on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 5:05 PM

AF Wife, so glad to see you again. Hope things are going well for you and your family.

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 5:05 PM

AARP loses members over health care stance

http://tinyurl.com/m57cky

"About 60,000 senior citizens have quit AARP since July 1 due to the group's support for a health care overhaul, a spokesman for the organization said Monday."

"The approximately 60,000 number represents members who specifically cited AARP's stance on the health overhaul debate in canceling their membership between July 1 and mid-August, Nannis said."

It appears some retired persons are not as voiceless as some people may have assumed old folks to be. It appears they are not taking well to their new roles as "disposable humans," alongside the unborn, who as we have long known, never complain about their lives being taken.

http://tinyurl.com/orljgo

-- Posted by Ray on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 5:04 PM

wow yomamma you sound like some lil kid just dyin to tell on someone!! geez get a life!!

-- Posted by wheresthelove on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 5:02 PM

Third Child - I just read your opinion of the war in Afghanistan. Ask any military person who is there now or has been there and see how your views compare with theirs. Have you been there and know first hand what we are doing for that country and the people who are trying to make it a better place to live? We should all be grateful to the military for the freedoms we have rather than telling them to "resist deployment". We better be glad so many are willing to go.

-- Posted by Air Force Wife on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 5:00 PM

"obamaCare" is the catch term for Obama's incompetent health care proposal. As far as the drawing, it's clip art and I think everyone can easily make out it's a representation of a tombstone. Once again, your ad hominem attack is lacking in any real merit. You apparently have no valid refutation to my postings so you just attack the messenger. Your patronizing, insulting, dismissive tone is empty and meaningless.

-- Posted by Ray on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 4:56 PM

News, yes, I probably did miss them all. I have a tendency to filter as I read.... Okay, I'll shift back into lurk mode now.

M

-- Posted by missy08 on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 4:53 PM

Looking Bad On The Way In Town, As you enter Marshall we have the very nice Marshall sign and Flags but just a few minutes later you arrive in town on Bus. Hwy 65 to see the old Jims IGA & now closed Family Dollar Store Building and the town looks closed down, can't be good for Hustler's Biz either as in the day time it also looks closed for good with the condition of thier overhang & the all around condition of the building overall ? Needs to be re-modeled or torn down by whom ever owns it. It just looks really bad ! Anyone know where it stands as to helping Marshall look better ????

-- Posted by gokinser11 on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 4:44 PM
Response by Kathy Fairchild/Staff writer:
Patricia's will soon be taking over the space occupied by the former IGA and the Family Dollar store. Hustler's will stay.

Ray,

There is no authority called "Obamacare" and your link is to crudely drawn, neocon/Republican/libertarian/conservative propaganda sketch. Your empty,meaningless statement remains unqualified.

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 4:41 PM

How about Dr. Ross!Look on Case Net its there!

Response by Eric Crump/Editor:

Thanks.

-- Posted by yomomma on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 4:37 PM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
Er, it doesn't appear the city of Marshall is involved in any way.

missy08,

I have posted Webster's definition of the word neocon with link in this forum many times. I guess you missed them all.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionar...

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 4:35 PM

News, you keep throwing out the term "neocon". What is your definition of the word? If I am reading your posts correctly, you seem to be labeling all conservatives as "neocons". And, can you limit your response to just a couple of paragraphs? I'm pretty busy this evening..... Thanks.

-- Posted by missy08 on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 4:30 PM

"...we have money to heal with with." According to ObamaCare, apparently that's not the case.

http://tinyurl.com/orljgo

-- Posted by Ray on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 4:27 PM

Jo,

You make an excellent point. It is a simple fact that if we have money to kill with, we have money to heal with with.

Despite the lies of the minority neocons, the Republican Party...aka, the party of No,...I support a public option. The neocons are only interested in playing political games with our health care.

I guess the best hope we have to ever get decent, affordable medical coverage is to simply get rid of the few remaining Republicans in our Congress. That is why I will be voting straight Democrat ticket in 2010. Its the only way to get our Nation back on track.

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 3:49 PM

Satire based on a lie is still a lie.

-- Posted by Ray on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 3:00 PM

MDN how about a story on the Marshall doctor that has a lawsuit against the City of Marshall??

-- Posted by yomomma on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 2:54 PM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
How about a name?

TC: I agree with everything you said in your "Soldiers" post.

Do you think you should reexamine your opinion of it? :)

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 2:00 PM

So it sounds like you all want Medical Insurers to keep poking their finger in your eyes! Nothing could be worse then what we got! Every other country has Single Payer, and it works better than what we have, and less Complicated! If nothing else , pay for it out of the Defence Budget! Why do we always have to be losing Men & Women in Wars! Bring our people home,and take care of the Terrorism we all ready have in this Country! We will never change those People,They don't want to change!

-- Posted by Jo on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 1:08 PM

Soldiers: Courage to Resist

10 reasons to resist deployment to Afghanistan

1.Like Iraq, it is also illegal

2.No military solution to terrorism

3.Funds used for war are needed at home

4.Civilian casualties are not acceptable

5.War is not good for women in Afghanistan

6.Support the troops: Bring them home now

7.Torture and human rights abuses

8.Climate change and resource wars

9.War destabilizes Afghanistan and the region

10.Respect Afghani self-determination; No to global military intervention

http://www.couragetoresist.org/x/content...

http://www.couragetoresist.org/x/

-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 12:57 PM

Ray reminds me of a user...can't really put my finger on who though... ;)

-- Posted by Scarpetta on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 12:42 PM

Ray it is you who is doubly wrong. No common definition of satire,nor parody includes lying. Even the supreme court chimes in on the subject; Falwell v. Hustler.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 12:37 PM

Here's an example of how socialized medicine works in the U.K.

http://tinyurl.com/nlfa6o

"Woman gives birth on pavement 'after being refused ambulance'

By Daily Mail Reporter

Last updated at 9:56 PM on 17th August 2009

"A young mother gave birth on a pavement outside a hospital after she was told to make her own way there."

"Her daughter Mariah was delivered on a pavement outside the hospital by a passer-by, just before ambulance crews arrived."

-- Posted by Ray on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 12:22 PM

"i guess i am just at awe about the debate over health "insurance" reform. so many of us up in arms over this rediculous idea by the leader of the new world order, barack obama. anyone realize that the number given of 49 million uninsured is including illegal immigrants in this country that under this new reform would be granted FREE health care. now why is that?"

As I have heard it explained, in effect, seniors will lose coverage for a lot of their medical needs, and since the bill does not specifically exclude abortions, that will be covered. I've heard one theorist say that "illegal aliens" will be covered (bottom of this post).

http://tinyurl.com/owzdv6

"And right there, in plain print, is the beginning of medical care rationing. Now that the cameras have been put away and the media is no longer watching, their secret emerges: They are going to cut medical costs by cutting medical care. Right now, they cite four targets. They plan to:

1. Cut diagnostic imaging tests like MRIs and CAT scans.

2. Reduce the use of antibiotics.

3. Perform fewer Caesarean sections.

4. Cut care for management of chronic back pain

These decisions will not be medical but financial. They will not be based on a doctor's opinion of what his or her patient needs, but a bureaucrat's and an accountant s opinion of what the new health care system can afford.

And you will not be able to bypass their rulings and pay for this care yourself. The rules laid down must be followed and private payments will not be permitted to override them. What we now call a private fee for service will metastasize into a bribe.

But this is just the very beginning of rationing. The total of health care spending now runs about $2.3 trillion a year in the United States. Over ten years, that's likely to reach $30 trillion. So a cut of $1.7 trillion is a mere drop in the bucket.

More rationing is coming, and coming soon."

also:

http://tinyurl.com/q4zbz3

also:

http://tinyurl.com/n3vx67

http://tinyurl.com/m9zcq6

I've heard one theorist say that "illegal aliens" will be covered.

http://tinyurl.com/n8x37g

Obama Health Plan to Cover 12 Illegals

Sunday, July 19, 2009 6:32 PM

By: David A. Patten

"The Democratic plan will embrace Obama's vision of bringing free government medical care to more than 45 million uninsured people in America -- a significant portion of whom are illegal aliens."

-- Posted by Ray on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 12:12 PM

"Did you bother to go to the site linked before you commented? I doubt it..."

You doubt wrongly - again. Whether labeled innuendo, vilification, or satire, the example you posted all boils down to untruth and disingenuousness (lying) at the core.

-- Posted by Ray on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 11:51 AM

Wonder Jim -- throw one of those pink pills into your tank and see happens.

A few years ago one of the Costco locations here was selling bad gas until the newspeople got wind of it.

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 11:30 AM

Ray: In regard to "Cheney volunteers for death panels" you declared "that's just another lie."

Did you bother to go to the site linked before you commented? I doubt it, or you would have more accurately stated "that's just another satire". So, you tell me, did you perhaps not visit the linked site, was your declarative less accurate than it could have been, or did you choose to make the more inflammatory declaration?

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 10:54 AM

I am wondering if any other - parents, grandparents or guardians - has reports of "bugs" from their child who attends Southeast school? Not my ideal dinner conversation...but I had it.

-- Posted by Scarpetta on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 10:33 AM

i guess i am just at awe about the debate over health "insurance" reform. so many of us up in arms over this rediculous idea by the leader of the new world order, barack obama. anyone realize that the number given of 49 million uninsured is including illegal immigrants in this country that under this new reform would be granted FREE health care. now why is that? why should anyone's tax money, rich or poor pay for that? can any democrat out there please tell me? and don't use the aclu crap of everyone deserves something, everyone should work for something, and if these illegals wish to change something maybe they should take that fight to the poverty stricken countries they came from. i am sickened by the notion that this "leader" has given more money to other countries during his tenure than his own and in the same breath lie to the same fools that voted for him. stimulous money rationed out until it hits a minority target, groups and activists in the chicago area opening offices in major us cities to gain stimulus grants, calling themselves local. this is not what we elected this man to do. we elected this man to run our country to lead us. i will say it, he was elected because of his speech, his mystique and most of all because he is a black man. he was not elected for the reasons we have elected any other president, for his beliefs, his causes or his ability to lead. i am a registered voter, i pay alot of attention and i am not happy with the manager, we the board of directors have hired and i think something should be done....anyone care to join that cause or are we scared to be called bigots by those who are, by their actions, the true definition of that. disagreeing with a mans idea makes you neither a bigot nor a racist, it makes you an american and our god in heaven and our forefathers and our soldiers thru history have sacrificed everything for us to have that ability and thet freedom. this blog will be removed, thanks democrat, but until it is read it look further than the middle of the blog and think about what you would give up, because you dont hjave to....someone already has for you and then use the freedom that you have been given and speak out, your not un american or nazi for doing so, your not fringe. you are a human being that has opinions and.....a few freedoms of that by god you should be using

-- Posted by thisguy on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 10:23 AM

Health Plans and Death Plans

There's nothing good for your health in Obamacare as spoken from the left..

http://counterpunch.com/cockburn08142009...

-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 9:55 AM

The death panel apparatus is already in place. One piece, $19 billion of the last "stimulus" is being spent to track and control every procedure. Incintives for doctors that follow the guidlines and punishment to those that don't.

Bureaucrats are making life and death decisions now. They just don't label it as Death Panels.

http://wistechnology.com/articles/5523/

http://newsblaze.com/story/2009030316371...

-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 8:49 AM

"Cheney volunteers for death panels!"

That's just another lie.

-- Posted by Ray on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 4:20 AM

Slater,

I have not spoken down to anyone. I merely offered a suggestion that I thought might help a mate out.

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 2:06 AM

Cheney volunteers for death panels!

http://www.legitgov.org/shulman_cheney_d...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 1:54 AM

I hope no one takes offense at my preceding post. It was largely an exercise in self derision. I must admit though that I am not the only one who takes this stuff entirely too seriously.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 1:14 AM

WTF said: "I guess the republican equivalent would be a tax exempt church,right?"

More hogwash, churches who have been the biggest violators of the IRS rules in my community have been African American, Pentacostal Churches, but there have been other more liberal churches violating those rules as well. It appears that may be the case throughout the U.S. I recall (at least) the last three democrat Presidential candidates getting plenty of free pulpit time to push their presidential candidacies.

Here's an example that goes back to the 2000 Presidential election:

http://tinyurl.com/kv8xua

"DALLAS -- Making a rare and quick foray into the heart of Gov. George W. Bush's Texas, but using a televangelist's pulpit to reach a national audience, Vice President Al Gore said Sunday that the United States must not ignore suffering, whether in the Balkans or in American cities.

His reference to the Balkans was a response to Bush's plan--if he's elected--to pull U.S. peacekeeping troops out of their NATO mission in that troubled region of southeastern Europe."

WTF said: "It clearly seems as if you feel abortion is only tragic when it is an American fetus and anyone else is fair game."

More hogwash, the democrats (the culture of death) push their abortion agenda through the U.N. Here's an excellent book covering that and Hillary's trip to Peking a few years back to push the abortion agenda.

http://tinyurl.com/qvv6en

I made no distinction when I said "I'm against killing children," and it is disingenuous and dishonest of you to put words in my mouth. Let me say it again, in case you missed it again, "I'm against killing children."

WTF said: "Please show me where I EVER accused our military. I blame thier commander in chief..."

"Our military" includes the commander in chief in the chain of command. If an order is illegal, military personnel can refuse to obey it. Some would say they have an obligation to not obey it. Our military personnel have chosen to follow their commander in chief with virtually no exceptions. If our military has followed an illegal order, they are likely culpable. I don't see how you can blame a commander in chief for an allegedly illegal order, without blaming the military that allegedly follows such an order. It's a military thing.

http://tinyurl.com/lml5cz

"A military order must have a military connection and must not contravene existing law, such as the Constitution, treaties, and statutes. An illegal order is just that - illegal, and does not require that it be obeyed. As the law either has no valid military purpose or contravenes existing law, obeying the order may expose the person to prosecution."

Now here is a recent example of a Major refusing to follow what he sees as an illegal situation involving an alleged commander in chief:

"Yesterday, World Net Daily broke the story of Army Major Stefan Cook, who argued that he should not have to deploy to Afghanistan because President Obama has not proven that he is a natural-born citizen, therefore he is unable to serve as Commander-In-Chief.

This is something that will receive little, if any, coverage from the mainstream media.

However, the fact that the U.S. Army revoked the orders of a soldier about to be sent overseas based wholly upon such a claim is unprecedented."

-- Posted by Ray on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 1:10 AM

We could just play Dominoes, or feed pigeons in the park.

Watch weather at five, supper at six, sleep before its dark.

Stare at a wall, be careful not to fall, when we shuffle down the hall.

Who was in that movie, a name I can't recall, maybe some one will call.

But, my mind still works in fits, and jerks, many thanks for that.

So I'll get on the blog get mad at Ray, and we will go to the mat.

Thanks to all; friend, and faux foe, I've more to do than give my dog a pat.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 12:56 AM

Why was my post rejected? I had an opinion on Rays Post, & Ray! I don't think there was anything wrong with my Comments. Even gave my Name, to be up front! And not hide behind some Blog Name! Answer Please!

-- Posted by Jo on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 12:52 AM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
I checked the website records and no comments by Jo have been deleted since March 2.

All you people who are complaining about Ike going on the river to learn first hand what is going on as opposed to having some shouting match at a townhall meeting. Well too bad. If you want to make your opinion known to Ike then WRITE a letter, an email or call. I emailed my opinions on healthcare to Ike last Monday and today in the mail I received a written letter. I know somebody had to read the email because his letter addressed several points that he disagreeded upon. I got my message across to him. Plus I didn't have to be rude, crude or disrespective to our congressman.

Folks you get a lot farther with honey than vinegar! And that is how I see it! pssst!

-- Posted by movaldude on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 12:26 AM

Wonderjim: That is obscure. Benadryl? You have lost me with this one. Explain please.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 12:21 AM

Okay, I have that off my chest now, so I'll say Good Morning and Good Night to one and all. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 12:12 AM

Post Script:

News, I'm not speaking for WTF and he didn't ask me to. He's quite capable of speaking for himself, as is very evident from his posts.

My comments were about me. My post, agreeing with what WTF had to say, was also deleted, so when you talked down to WTF, you were talking down to me as well.

Maybe WTF doesn't have as much Irish in him as I have in me.

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 18, 2009, at 12:08 AM

News,

The editor had already responded to WTF's inquiry regarding the deletion of his post, and the matter was settled. Then you came along and offered WTF your "advice" on how to get along without his posts being subject to deletion. The tenor of your message was high-toned and implied that WTF didn't have enough sense to know how to word his messages.

The editor didn't ask you to contribute to his decision, nor did WTF ask you for advice.

"I find your comments, regarding my well-intended attempt to be of assistance to WTF, very odd and frankly, almost hostile."

My comments definitely were not odd, nor were they hostile. When I have something on my mind, I get straight to the point. Some may see it as hostility; I see it as directness.

-- Posted by Slater on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 11:58 PM

Below is a preview of your comment. If you are satisfied, press the Save button at the bottom to finish posting your comment. If you wish to correct something, use your browser's Back button to return to the previous page.

ike can appear on a boat on the missouri river, but can't hold any town halls. sounds like a loooong-time congressman who is feeling fat and sassy and lazy and afraid to face the people he represents now that he sees REAL change coming.

sounds like a story for the demo-news to go after, if they are brave enough to go for it. the paper has always been skelton's sounding voice and given him free space and never challenged the man ... sooooo ... demo-news .... why don't you ask good ol' ike why he isn't holding any town halls? after all, he does represent all of us. i'd love to hear from the man and see for once a congressman face the music from the people who pay his salary.

-- Posted by aikman8 on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 11:20 PM

Slater

I merely offered some helpful advice to WTF...there is no insistence on my part that he follow it. Nor does my advice have anything directly to do with Eric.

I find your comments, regarding my well-intended attempt to be of assistance to WTF, very odd and frankly, almost hostile.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 10:14 PM

Which pill is the pink one, WonderJim? Does it make you larger, or smaller?

Maybe I'll ask Alice.

-- Posted by Slater on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 9:43 PM

Ray said:

"Sadly, taxpayer dollars pay for democrat politics to be indoctrinated into America's youth, not as another way of thinking, but at the only way of thinking."

I guess the republican equivalent would be a tax exempt church,right?

"I'm against killing children. - Ray"

Who's children Ray? Only ours? Why is it only tragic when it is an american embryo as opposed to some 25 year old kid in another country? Innocent is innocent and dead is dead regardless of the age when thier life was aborted.

Finally you said:

"and it appears the vast number were killed by Islamofascist (roadside bombs, car bombs, etc.) so please stop falsely accusing our service people. - Ray"

Please show me where I EVER accused our military. I blame thier commander in chief who, based on lies and deceit destabilized a country and as a direct result thousands of innocent lives were aborted.

It clearly seems as if you feel abortion is only tragic when it is an American fetus and anyone else is fair game.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 8:25 PM

News,

If the editor wants to appoint you his stand-in guardian, I'm sure he'll alert us to that fact.

WTF is very capable of understanding the editor's role and doesn't need you to "refresh" his memory.

Quite frankly, your condescending and patronizing attitude has become quite wearisome.

-- Posted by Slater on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 7:37 PM

Roe at 35

by Gary Bauer

01/18/2008

"Since Roe, at least 50 million abortions (equal to the combined populations of 25 states) have been performed..."

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?i...

-- Posted by Ray on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 7:31 PM

Slater,

I read your comment and frankly, I feel your being a bit judgmental and a bit unfair, but you certainly have the right to your opinion.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 7:25 PM

WTF,

Editors like Eric are always the gatekeeper of any publication. Its their job to decide what goes in and what does not...and rightly so.

However I do want to assure you WTF that your sentiments and concerns on many issues are shared by many of the other readers and commenters in this forum.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 7:20 PM

What the...

I see News is once again sticking his nose in where it doesn't belong.

It's clear to most of us that Editor Crump is the designated voice controlling this blog.

-- Posted by Slater on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 7:09 PM

"Ok, this person is obviously against a woman's right to choose. Fine."

"...here in the USA we have aborted 2739 babies a day, 365 days a year for the past 40 years. Now I must say that seems a little high to me."

"Do we even have enough abortion doctors to pull that off? I don't know nor do I claim to know. Maybe someone can provide some direct evidence."

Then your going to be really sad to hear it's acutally closer to 50,000,000. Yes, we have plenty of abortion doctors to accomplish that killing rate. Roughly, more than one million babies are killed every year in America. - Ray

Here is this from a 1999 article.

http://www.cwfa.org/articles/1416/CWA/li...

"In the more than 26 years since that Supreme Court decision, the phrase "rare abortion" has become a mockery. Over thirty-five million abortions have been recorded.23"

I'm against killing children. - Ray

"Then this person goes on to say about the amount of Iraqi's who died as a direct result of our actions as a country..."

The link provided (also below) indicated that those Iraqi's killed where far less than you alleged, and it appears the vast number were killed by Islamofascist (roadside bombs, car bombs, etc.) so please stop falsely accusing our service people. - Ray

http://www.iraqbodycount.org/database/

"So I ask, when is it ok to kill innocent people?"

Obviously, when you're an abortionist. - Ray

-- Posted by Ray on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 7:05 PM

"I don't know of any reputable, accredited university that would allow any student to submit such "sources" in an effort to qualify their thesis or supporting statements."

Hogwash! Far less credible sources than that are acceptable on most college and university campuses today. America's college's and universities, have, since the 60's been pushing Marx-o-centric propaganda as fact primarily through the liberal arts. What passes for education these days is bigoted, Marx-o-centric deconstructionist propaganda. One facet is moral relativism, saying there are no moral absolutes, no good and evil, and that all truths are equal, unless of course you believe in moral absolutes (good and evil), then you are condemned as politically incorrect, intolerant, etc. The leftist hypocrisy in academia and leftist politics stinks to high heaven.

The leftist ideology taught on college and university campuses is at the core of democrat party politics. Sadly, taxpayer dollars pay for democrat politics to be indoctrinated into America's youth, not as another way of thinking, but at the only way of thinking. Yes, our youth are taught what to think, not how to think. They are taught to think like democrats. Your comments, like the comments of many college and university professors today, would be good for a laugh if they were not doing so much damage to America.

-- Posted by Ray on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 6:38 PM

News Across and Eric.

Ok, fair enough. I'll even apologize for calling an anonymous poster a "bitter old man" even though that individual is allowed to call well known figures "evil".

This situation does leave us with an interesting quandry.

As a society,where do we draw the line and who gets to decide what the line is? In this instance it is obiously the newpaper editor but what about other issues?

For instance a certain poster here lamented on more than one occasion saying things like:

"Why would anyone entrust any health care decisions to a party that has historically, wholeheartedly embraced a culture of death through the deaths of over 40, 000, 000 unborn children over 4 decades?

Ok, this person is obviously against a woman's right to choose. Fine.

Then this person goes on to say about the amount of Iraqi's who died as a direct result of our actions as a country:

"How many of those were killed by islamofascists? Could it be the vast majority? How many were being killed under Sadaam?

This indivual disagrees with the actual number of dead Iraqi's but goes on to state that here in the USA we have aborted 2739 babies a day, 365 days a year for the past 40 years. Now I must say that seems a little high to me. Do we even have enough abortion doctors to pull that off? I don't know nor do I claim to know. Maybe someone can provide some direct evidence.

Sadaam was a bad man but by that criteria alone we better get moving because we have a lot of other countries to invade although they probably wouldn't be nearly as profitable for the Halburton's,etc.

Nobody really talks about that anymore do they? I'm sure the GOP is overcome with pleasure that our national attention has been turned away from illegal wars and the profits thereof. "Pay no attention to the behind the curtain" so to speak.

Once again it would seem as if they have managed to create a new bogeyman.

Obama the commie.The GOP created it and America is falling for it. It's very effective and also very sad.

So I ask, when is it ok to kill innocent people?

Obviously it's not ok for a woman to abort a pregnancy even though the reasons behind it may be compelling from a health or quality of life perspective. Are innocent dead from a war that was waged on lies and deciet merely just collateral damage? Is thier death any less tragic? If so then why? Is it because we are the USA? Because we are the righteous and our motives can never be challenged? I wonder how many of us could look an Iraqi mother in the eyes and tell her that?

There is no doubt that there are bad people in Iraq but it is also true that Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11. They did nothing more than we would have done if our home had been invaded. Thousands of dead American soldiers and who followed orders and dead Iraqi's who defended thier home. For what? Money.

I guess when it comes to death and a conscience some people get to have it both ways.

Where do we draw the line and who get's to decide?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 6:11 PM

Ray,

to be quite fair, the only the only references I have seen you post are conservative blog pieces usually based less on fact and more on the author' empty opinion. I don't know of any reputable, accredited university that would allow any student to submit such "sources" in an effort to qualify their thesis or supporting statements.

In the end Ray, I think it remains true that an empty opinion, no matter how dressed up it may be,is still an empty opinion.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 5:35 PM

"I don't understand is why that person allowed to refer the president as "evil"?"

I supported my contention with factual evidence (actual examples from Obama's policies).

"The stimulus is also being spent on 'nude simulated sex-dancers, Saturday night 'pervert' revues, and pornographic horror films.' While providing taxpayer funds for "numerous" sexually perverse projects, and lots of money for welfare, the stimulus package has done little for America's roads and bridges."

And yes, I considering spending stimulus money (taxpayer's money) to fund abortions, and "'numerous' sexually perverse projects" (as explained in the article I quoted) to be evil.

God knows Saline county could use some bridge repairs, or new bridges. God knows there's some work in Saline county for structural engineers, but it appears the only engineering Obama is interested in is "social engineering."

The left loves to play hard ball, openly dissecting and criticizing every malfeasant conservative action coming down the pike, but as soon as their own bad behavior is pointed out they cry foul, ergo my contention of numerous instances of hypocrisy on the part of the left.

As far as someone's ad hominem attack on me, mentioning I'd be more at home in Cromwell's England, the only response I have to that is, "You're very wrong. I am not a Calvinist."

-- Posted by Ray on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 5:00 PM

WTF,

May I suggest that there are ways to express your sentiments {that your reader will clearly comprehend) without using a direct attack on any one individual.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 3:56 PM

Dear Editor,

You deleted my post because I referred to someone as a "bitter old man" Fair enough. What I don't understand is why that person allowed to refer the president as "evil"?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 3:27 PM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
More leeway is offered critics of public officials, as opposed to private citizens.

Dean: 'You can't really have reform without a public option'

http://rawstory.com/08/news/2009/08/17/d...

It looks like folks would prefer to keep financing

Big Insurance and keeping those rich fat-cats fat and rich.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 3:09 PM

Voodoo in Obama's Whitehouse

http://www.infowars.com/voodoo-in-obamas...

-- Posted by Third Child on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 2:42 PM

NB,

Was your yesterday Siesta refreshing? :) I freely admit to having the knack for putting people to sleep.

Evidently I interpreted the remarks about your father being under the weather, but I'm glad that he's doing well, and I'm sure he's enjoying that instrument you got for him.

There was a North family in Marshall, one of whom I knew - Jerry was his name - but I don't know if the Slater and Marshall families were related.

Thanks for confirming my memory about Carl Young and the barber shop. His older brother, James Donald, was a year behind me in school, and there was an older sister, Darlene I think, who was a year or two ahead of me in school. You said that Carl 'was' a barber, so I'm concluding he decided on another kind of livelihood.

I became acquainted with a very nice guy during one of my visits to Carl's shop, and I believe that person's last name was Richardson. I never saw much of him around Slater when I would visit there some weekends and don't know what happened to him and don't even know for sure what his name was. That's pretty bad on my part. People pass in and out of our lives, some having more emphasis than others, and sometimes they're misplaced in our memories. Not forgotten, but misfiled in the old noodle and recall is next to impossible.

Just three more days! Mixed feelings about the impending start of another school year for the students. Once I got beyond grade school and began to realize the implication that school could be a kind of social event, I was always ready for the start of the new year.

Come rain or come shine, I suppose. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 2:05 PM

WTF -- You have Ray framed up about right I'd say, and yes, it is sad that some people either can't or won't view the world in a more balanced way.

-- Posted by Slater on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 1:39 PM

Double vision! Sorry. Now guys don't jump on that one. It is too easy, and you all are to smart to sink that low.

This is a reference to my two double postings in a row in case anyone reads this after the editorial staff cleans up my error.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 11:58 AM

Ray, I am sorry that you feel so out of place, and want things to go back to...somewhere. Perhaps you would have been more at home in Oliver Cromwell's England?

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 11:52 AM

WJ have you been in conference with Paulie Walnuts? I take exception in the case of and, the hardest working of the trinity that brings it all together. The word has earned the right to lead occasionally. And, when used in that fashion it lends a subtle, but in your face emphatic nuance to a statement. :)

News I think Carville is right. If Obama pushed harder it would make Carville's scenario even stronger.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 11:45 AM

"corporations run this country."

As if big government is the answer. The Marx-o-centric propaganda that capitalist corporations are bad and that liberal government is somehow benevolent to citizens is the height of foolishness, especially for an administration as corrupt and evil as the Obama administration.

http://tinyurl.com/nm8nda

"The Obama Administration purged the stimulus package of most of the investments in roads and bridges originally suggested by economists, and filled it instead with welfare and social spending, out of political correctness, after feminist leaders complained that building and repairing roads and bridges would put blue collar men to work rather than women."

"The vast majority of people who have lost their jobs in the current recession are male - 82%."

"'Join your pervs for some explicit twisted fun,' urged a recipient of more than $25,000 from Obama's more than 800 billion stimulus package, which received the money from The National Endowment for the Arts. The stimulus is also being spent on 'nude simulated sex-dancers, Saturday night 'pervert' revues, and pornographic horror films.' While providing taxpayer funds for "numerous" sexually perverse projects, and lots of money for welfare, the stimulus package has done little for America's roads and bridges."

-- Posted by Ray on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 11:29 AM

Bloomberg

Obama Campaign Ad Firms Signed On to Push Health-Care Overhaul

$343 million of your tax money to David Axelrod to hype socialized medicine.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=2...

-- Posted by Third Child on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 11:07 AM

Hey Lukey

Good article about Woodstock.

One thing jumped off the page at me, however.

This was your assertion that the legendary Les Paul may have had something to do with designing the Fender Stratocaster - which is what Hendrix so famously played at the concert - wowing the crowd with his own version of "The Star Spangled Banner."

As a musician, I have played both the Gibson Les Paul (Recording Model is my favorite) and the Fender Stat. Had no idea Les Paul designed the Strat.

I'll agree with you that Paul does, however, deserve honors for his contributions to guitar playing and design.

Thanks for the article.

cr

-- Posted by circuitrider on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 10:54 AM

A note from my cousin Lyall Lukey of New Zealand.

Gday folks

Here is my take on Woodstock and NZ at the time. (Some great videos etc at the end!).

http://lukeytraining.wordpress.com/2009/...

Add any comments/ memories at bottom of post!

Cheers

Lyall

______________________________________

Lukey Resources & SmartNet

Mancan House, 236 Manchester Street

P O Box 13-577, Christchurch 8141, New Zealand

Phone (+64 3) 366-7874; DD (+64 3) 366-4249

Skype lyallsmartnet

Lukey Resources www.lukey.co.nz

SmartNet www.smartnet.co.nz

Blog http://lukeytraining.wordpress.com/

____________________________________

"The ability to learn faster and deeper than your competitors may be the only

sustainable competitive advantage." Arie de Geus

-- Posted by ceh_meh@verizon.net on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 10:11 AM

Carville: Let GOP kill health care:

http://rawstory.com/blog/2009/08/carvill...

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 1:22 AM

Oklahoma Reader...

...if the public option fails...the American People lose and I don't think its the President they will blame.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 1:20 AM

http://blog.buzzflash.com/node/9214

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 12:29 AM

If you doubt that corporations run this country, if you think that you have rights that are stronger than those of giant corporations, if you wonder how we got in this mess wherein only corporate voices are heard...read this:http://blog.buzzflash.com/node/9214

We must somehow take back our rights, it is a tall order.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 12:23 AM

Public health option losing ground. Lack of assertiveness by the Obama Administration may result in assuring that he is a one term president.http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/17/health/policy/17talkshows.html?_r=1&hp

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Aug 17, 2009, at 12:14 AM

School starts tomorrow, time for high school football! Good luck Owls. Can hardly wait for the first home game. GO Owls!

-- Posted by LAMR on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 10:23 PM

So News, Obama gets caught lying about selling out to big pharma no one talks about it. Now he rolls over for the insurance lobby.. what have you got to say about that? Still a believer?

-- Posted by Third Child on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 6:06 PM

Concentration of wealth in hands of rich greatest on record:

http://rawstory.com/08/news/2009/08/15/c...

-- Posted by news across on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 4:10 PM

Slater,

Sorry, didn't scroll down far enough to see your response. Th...an....k...you....al..so..zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 2:32 PM

IESG,

Thanks!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 2:24 PM

Reveler = Nachtschwaermerin

-- Posted by ieatsuperglue on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 2:23 PM

NB,

Nachtschwaermerin = Nightowls, in the collective sense. (The a has an umlaut over it, but my computer doesn't know German so I had to add the e behind the a.)

The German word for owl is Eule, so if I were addressing you only, and if it were evening, say around 11pm, I would say Guten Abend, Nachteulen (good evening, nightowl).

The German language is made up of feminine, masculine, and neuter genders (die, der, das - if my memory is correct), so if we referred to the owl, we'd say die Eule.

Okay, enough of this. I can hear you snoring. :)

Gotta go. The next-door neighbor is having a birthday party this afternoon.

Later :)

-- Posted by Slater on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 2:22 PM

Slater,

My dad is doing well. Drives down a couple of days a week for coffee. Bert North was his uncle.

In reference to a question you asked another; yes Carl Young used to be a barber, had a shop right where you stated.

No, cannot play a tune on anything, except maybe a Kazoo! Oh and chop sticks, although haven't done that for many years. My dad sold all the instruments at auction. Was sad! I searched high & low on the internet to find the exact guitar that was his favorite, and bough it for his birthday last year. He was so surprised! Sat right down and played a little German tune that I had always asked him to play from 5 years old on. Made me cry!

My grandson does appear talented, but I'm quite sure he will be the star performer dancing at the goal line of the Chicago Bears Football games. He's going to be a big fella. When he retires from football, I'm quite certain he will then start a career leading to the presidency of the United States! :)!

My mother used to love watching Lynette Jennings. I sometimes watched, kind of thought some of her projects were a bit garish. I am not opposed to some furniture being painted, but prefer antiques to be in their original state.

Painting the windows & picnic tables was supposed to start tomorrow....IT's RAINING....oh well. Such is life. Supposed rain all week. Ceiling will have to wait a while longer.

PS: I know you said good morning, what's the third German word?

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 1:38 PM

Rumor has it Con Agra will be back at work tomorrow.

-- Posted by ieatsuperglue on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 12:09 PM

The boil order has been lifted. Please see our updated story for more information.

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 12:01 PM

Yank,

Was it Carl Young who was in the barbering business? One of the Young's was operating a barber shop in Slater in the early '60s when I got home from the Army. The shop was in a space behind the old post office building which sat on the northeast corner of Main and Maple.

I may be wrong about this, but I'm fairly certain both Charlie and Karen are deceased, Charlie several years ago and Karen just in the past few months.

-- Posted by Slater on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 11:24 AM

You all just want something to complain about. I agree, they should help those who have touble. My mom is disabled, on oxygen, and has a lot of other health trouble. I have a 21 month old and an almost 9 month old. I see both sides of what you all are saying. Help those who can't help themselves and stop compaining. Ya'll sound like a bunch of old hens. Cluck, cluck, cluck. (Insert rooter crow)

-- Posted by ieatsuperglue on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 10:49 AM

I have been boiling my water, and I can afford to buy the water if I want to. But my mother who has trouble just walking from one room to another this creates a problem. I have been helping her but I am sure there are others who need assistance that do not have family members helping them. My daughter has a baby on formula she and her husband make minimum wage can not afford water and do not want to take a chance on water for their child, I went out and bought water for them.

I at least have some compassion for others and am not complaining because it only effects me. I only posted for those who need assistance.

-- Posted by litlmissme on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 10:17 AM

"Straight talk" from President Obama on health care?

Don't bet your life on it..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3JKDTBOY...

-- Posted by Third Child on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 10:16 AM

I have a 6 month old and even if I had bought bottled water I would still be haveing to heat it on the stove to wash his bottles so it is saving me money just to go ahead and boil tap rather then heat bottled.

And as far as mixing formula - breastmilk is so much better for baby and the WIC office supplied me my wonderful hospital grade pump for a $50 deposit - more mothers should know about this program.

-- Posted by STLgirlMarshallMom on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 10:15 AM

litlmissme its real easy get out a pan fill it with water turn on the stove and let it boil for 3-5 minutes.

Why does everyone want something for nothing people need to get off their rearends and take care of them selves!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-- Posted by Gal66 on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 9:56 AM

litlmissme,

There is clean water right at their fingertips. Boil it for five to ten minutes and let it cool. I haven't bought any water...I didn't see the point in giving my money away when all I needed to do was boil the water. I know it's not as convenient as grabbing a bottle already filled and ready, but technically it all comes from the same place (most bottling companies get their water right out of the tap too). In fact, our water is probably a lot better than some of the bottled...so my advice is to boil what you have and appreciate the fact that you know where it is coming from. :)

-- Posted by Marshall Citizen on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 9:53 AM

Why is there no place for people who are less fortunate to get free water. I was at Walmart last night and the only water on the shelf was the expensive brand.

The young mothers and elderly can not afford the stretch their budgets around that.

Now that the boil order has been extended I believe that at least the Saline County Health office should provide water for those on food stamps, or with children who use formula, the elderly and disabled, and any one who feels that they can not afford it, for what ever reason.

-- Posted by litlmissme on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 9:16 AM

'Death panel' is not in the bill... it already exists..

http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/08/d...

-- Posted by Third Child on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 9:06 AM

Fake town halls burst with Obama 'plants'

Campaign donors, health care lobbyist, SEIU members, fake doctor..

attn: NanaDot 'Supporters' organized and bussed in..

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.vie...

-- Posted by Third Child on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 9:03 AM

"Did you know any of the Callahan's from Slater?"

Nope. I visited Slater in 2007, and drove around a lot of the town. A lots changed, but a lot remains the same. The little park on the west side of Main Street looks nice.

-- Posted by Ray on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 8:39 AM

In the case of the Doors, it was Morrison's increase of unreliability due to increased drug use and also experimenting with crowd psychology and inciting riots at concerts that killed the group as well as Miami, stress, his mistress demanding action on her pregnancy (Supposedly his child), decreasing record sales and bad PR, having to post bond in case of profanity before every concert that DIDN'T cancel, 20-30 sudden cancellations in 1 month,(due to fear of riots and profanity) etc. The other Doors had slowed down their use of drugs if not all together and that also added a rift in the group.

As for the Beatles, I think they stopped the drugs when they went to India and I think the emerging creativity of Paul, and then later George as solo acts made them think "We were great once, but now everyone's prety much gone their own ways, so what's the point?" (Or "Pernt" as Archie Bunker used to say:-)

Side note, Remember Ed Sullivan's producer telling the Doors "You have to change 'Light My Fire'--you cannot say the word 'Higher' on this network." Several years before, the Beatles were singing I Want to Hold Your Hand on Sullivan and actually sang on tv "I get high, I get high, I get hiiiiigh!". Strange, huh?

-- Posted by AlphaState on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 4:09 AM

hey slater. thanks for some memories, i also knew the norths, good family. i beleive wes is still working for railroad unless retired. charlie and sister i dont know where they are. have been in their home many times, we were all close, jim stoufer, carl young,and of course couple more but one is dead,i guess 2 is dead, jim stoufer and art k. jess young, joe gieger. a pretty close bunch.

-- Posted by yank on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 3:51 AM

Working harder for less?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32374533/ns/...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 1:46 AM

NB,

I'm sorry to hear about your father being off his feed. I wish him well and hope he's back to normal soon.

The North family I know from Slater was Bert North and can't recall his wife's name. They had three children, I believe - Wesley, Karen, and Charles, and they lived on the northwest corner of Jenkins and Leroy Streets, which was a block east of where I lived (northwest corner of Jenkins and Euclid).

So your grandson is exhibiting a musical talent, eh? That's pretty cool. :) He may already be working on his life's career. Did you learn to play any of those instruments your dad played, or any others? I tried my hand at the cornet and trombone, but I wasn't dedicated.

Isn't it odd how people will paint about anything, thinking about your desk. A woman by the name of Lynette Jennings used to be on a tv show about redecorating, and her idea was to paint everything. Yep, paint it! That'll make it look new! She may have influenced the person who painted your desk.

It's very quiet in here tonight, a far cry from the way it was a night or two ago when people were bashing one another right and left. The sensation for me is like being alone in the gym and listening to how every sound echoes.

I'm glad you won't be climbing any ladders to get that painting done on the trim. What about the ceiling? Did hubby line up someone for that? :)

I'm looking forward to seeing those purple and gold picnic tables.

-- Posted by Slater on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 1:29 AM

Ray,

Did you know any of the Callahan's from Slater?

-- Posted by Slater on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 1:00 AM

Guten Morgen, Nachtschwaermerin :)

-- Posted by Slater on Sun, Aug 16, 2009, at 12:53 AM

"Did The Beatles kill rock 'n' roll?"

The 60's was a turbulent time writhing with radical social upheaval. A lot of things changed in western society. Perhaps the drug culture that exploded in the 60's killed rock and roll. It's really hard to rock and roll, when stoned & tripping.

Personality conflicts have historically split up a lot of musical groups. The rampant illegal drug use of the 60's probably caused some problems and some breakups. I suppose it's also possible that some illegal drug use anesthetized some dysfunctional personalities, thereby allowing some groups to stay together longer? Oliver Stone's movie "The Doors" shows drug use as both a unifying, and destructive, force. But ultimately it was a force that brought total destruction to the groups central talent.

Did Americans mature and lose their naivete as a result of the 60's, or did they just lose their innocence and moral values? Bye, bye miss American pie.

-- Posted by Ray on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 11:48 PM

I never learned much about the era of payola and how government intervention to clean up the record industry may have contributed to the changes occurring in music. I'm sure that listeners had a big influence on its metamorphosis.

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 9:11 PM

NAFTA 1993

Ross Perot versus Al Gore

Al Gore lied then as he lies now about global warming..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gptzlaG1...

-- Posted by Third Child on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 9:04 PM

Stills and Young were part of the Buffalo Springfield group which had a pretty short life.

Clapton was a part of the Animals, Derrick and the Dominos, Cream, and probably one or two others.

A mighty clash of egos so often, I suppose.

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 9:04 PM

Speaking of expanding and moving around...Crosby- Stills-Nash-Young?

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 8:54 PM

It was a time of expansion, however you care to define it, expansion in every respect, and the Beatles were caught up in what was happening to everyone.

I agree that they suffered from too much familiarity, which no doubt helped drive them apart.

I was just thinking about all the different ones, like Clapton, Stills, and a slew of others who moved from group to group, I suppose in search of the ideal combination.

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 8:52 PM

In spite of their influence, I'd be more inclined to attribute the demise of rock and roll in its 1950s form died a natural death.

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 8:43 PM

"The times killed the Beatles..." Hmmmm...well, maybe that's true. Or maybe they just grew up and grew apart, a lot like married people sometimes do?

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 8:42 PM

I really like "that old time rock 'n' roll," and although I like early Beatles stuff, the later, long-winded psychdelic junk really turned me off completely.

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 8:40 PM

I believe I'd have to say that the times killed the Beatles.

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 8:38 PM

Do you mean rock and roll as it had evolved in the '60s?

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 8:34 PM

Here's a question to ponder instead of the usual political stuff:

Did The Beatles kill rock 'n' roll?

I say yes.

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 8:25 PM

Thanks, Slater...I'm not often sick, so I'm not a very good patient, as my poor husband could attest.

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 8:22 PM

KF, sorry to hear that you've been puny, but wishing you a speedy recovery! :)

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 7:45 PM

Slater, now THAT is rock 'n' roll! I've been home for three days on the sick, lame and lazy list but that made me feel a lot better, thank you! :)

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 6:57 PM

Cease fire!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOZ29ujxH...

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 5:57 PM

Straight talk from President Obama on health care facts:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/...

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 5:29 PM

Lou Dobbs Tours Single-Payer Systems Abroad and Realizes, Holy Cow They're Good!

http://www.alternet.org/healthwellness/1...

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 5:06 PM

"...and as many as 1 million dead Iraqi civilians later some of those same folks want to deny they supported that war."

Please cite your source, even liberal sources don't use your inflated number.

http://www.iraqbodycount.org/database/

How many of those were killed by islamofascists? Could it be the vast majority? How many were being killed under Sadaam? Oh yea, he didn't keep records of that - unless you start counting the bodies in mass graves left behind by Sadaam. Your post is one more disingenuous reason I don't trust anything that comes out of the mouth of the left, or Islamofascists. Islamofascists have been committing genocide against westerners since the 7th century, but it is only recently that leftist Americans have been assisting them, IMO.

-- Posted by Ray on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 4:00 PM

Just face it, with Osama in charge, we are all in trouble.

-- Posted by ieatsuperglue on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 1:54 PM

Obamacare Protest are Real.

Most people are against it. Rush Limbaugh doesn't have to bus them in..

Another politician hides from the crowd:

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/story/1...

-- Posted by Third Child on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 12:02 PM

well now i have read all comments, just wanted all to know, i did not vote for obama, will not.someone wrote an intelligent black man, that is not obama, Dr. Martin luther King was an intelligent black man, i would have voted for him. the terriost is being moved to american soil so soon our elected official will pardon them and then arm them. the state of illinois has not had an honest politician since the days of al capone.

-- Posted by yank on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 11:29 AM

Third Child,

I guess I'm doing as much as you are. I never had a problem with Afghanistan because that is acutally where those responsible for 9/11 reside.

As for Iraq I wish we would bring them home today but the damage is done and was done long before Obama took office. I disagree with all who voted for it democrat or republican.

You said"

"This is intellectually shortsighted as all the facts were not in at the time and we were being lied to."

Exactly right. Great reason to go to war right?

What did that war accomplish other than death and profits?

Your right that I attack the Bush administration for that and will continue to do so until those responsible are prosecuted. This, in my opinion is a little more important than chlorinated water or god forbid someone trying to enusre that you and I have affordable healthcare.

Obama is no god to me nor do I agree with him on every issue but I am willing to give the man a chance. Even if he could walk on water you would probably see that as a man who can't swim.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 10:42 AM

'News' and 'what the' repeatedly attack others for George Bush's illegal and immoral wars of aggression and imperialism. This is intellectually shortsighted as all the facts were not in at the time and we were being lied to. Supposedly *they* were against the invasion of Iraq at the time? Maybe not, but it sure is a convenient bone of contention to hang their hats on today..

The question is, what are you guys doing today besides pointing fingers at yesterday's news? Democrats are in power and can stop these immoral wars if they would only take action.

But the war is forgotten and bigger socialized/fascistic government is all the 'change' we get. Obama has been a seamless continuation of Bush policies. Same crooked banksters and lobbyist are running the show and brown people are still being systematically murdered for the same phony reasons.

Where is the change? Look in your pocket and maybe you'll have two nickels to rub together.

So what are you two antiwar democrats doing today about illegal and immoral wars that Americans are financing and dying for? When are Democrats going to demand that the person they elected live up to at least one of his campaign promises? How many more of our children or grandchildren are going to die for lies?

What do you two have to say about this? Please comment.

-- Posted by Third Child on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 9:25 AM

News Across,

No doubt he will have a lot of musical ability and/or possibilities. He's only two and already sings so many songs. His mother plays the piano and I'm hoping she'll teach him. He's already playing along with Guitar Hero, ha! Guess that's a start. My son sent me a little video of him singing & dancing, titled "Future American Idol?"!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 3:08 AM

nouveaublogger,

I haven't any Grandchildren yet, however I am definitely in favor of encouraging children to strive to learn a musical instrument from an early age if they are interested in music.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 2:46 AM

News Across,

Oops! Sorry about that last blog, sending it out to Slater and all.

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 2:26 AM

Slater,

My mom used to sing that song, I used to think it was about "her butt" also. Now with my kids, it was 'eye spy with my little eye' when we took car trips. My son came home from preschool singing Little bunny foo-foo...and forever I didn't want to hear that song. Now, though I can teach it to my grandson! Be it a right of passage or justice, it makes me smile just thinking about it. I have already purchased him a little play guitar and my daughter bought him a drum set! :) They live in Chicago, so don't get to see them as often as I'd like. Didn't get my summer trip in either as my dad has been under the weather, so to speak and didn't want to leave him.

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 2:24 AM

"As all-knowing as you pretend to be, how come you aren't in Washington getting the place straightened out?"

I can't be everywhere. I'm not rich enough to run for office so I'm back in college (Stalinist re-education camp), trying to deconstruct the Marx-o-centric propagandists who are indoctrinating our youth with their Marxist propaganda - instead of teaching our youth how to think. American colleges and universities are a cesspool of leftist ideology. Our colleges and universities are supposed to be bastions of free speech and academic freedom, but the political correctness of the left has largely shut down academic freedom and free speech in favor of Stalinist re-education tactics and propaganda - most heavily in the liberal arts. We are losing America to the radial left on our college and university campuses. FIRE is one group fighting the totalitarian tactics of anti-academic freedom forces on our college and university campuses.

http://www.thefire.org/

If you have a spare million to donate, I'll be happy to run for office as an Independent. If elected, I'm sure I could succeed in offending people of both major parties, but I doubt I'd be able to successfully further the liberty our founding fathers envisioned for all Americans - given the state of affairs in D.C. :-\

-- Posted by Ray on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 2:22 AM

nouveaublogger,

My Dad was a rhymes and song guy too...he still is. One time while on a drive from Marshall to Chicago my Dad started singing an old depression days song which goes in part,

"She has freckles on her...but she is nice..."

However to a car full of little kids {6 kids}, it came out sounding like "She has freckles on her butt...she is nice. Now I gotta tell ya we just about died laughing. So we too began singing it too...then laughing...then singing it again...and so on...

By the time we reached Chicago we were all 6 permanently prohibited from singing that song for the rest of our lives.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 2:05 AM

Ray,

...after reading your last couple of comments...all I can say is thank God for my Australian citizenship...and God help America.

Oh,Ray I am a Vietnam Era Veteran...regular Army...not a draftee...and and I was always treated with respect.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 1:46 AM

Slater,

Oh, the rhymes are ok with me. My dad used to make up little rhymes when I was growing up, some cute and a lot corny, some a bit ornery. He and a few of his buddies would sit around with their guitars making up little songs about one another, on the spot. Don't know if you knew him, as he was born & raised in the Blue Lick area, but I bet you knew some of his relatives as his mother was a North, from Slater.

On another subject, the hubby finally dealt with his honey-do list today. He gave me the phone number of a local contractor! Ha! Looks like I'll get those windows painted now.

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 1:07 AM

NB, wait! I wasn't picking about the condition of the desktop! If we were to compare desks, yours would no doubt look like a cadre of orderlies tended to it every minute. :)

Incidentally, my daughter does the same to me. When she comes up here I shudder because I know what's coming. Sometimes I move the stacks around to make it look as if I've been "organizing."

I promise not to make any more silly rhymes. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 12:42 AM

Slater,

Alright, now it sounds like my daughter has recruited you to shame me into cleaning my desk. Drat that little perfectionist! I swear 1 1/2 weeks ago, you could see the top of it. I really don't know how it gets to be such a catch-all. The desk belonged to my dad, and I could not let him get rid of it when he sold the house and auctioned all. It is a massive, old desk that he bought for $5.00 and had been painted an institutional gray. He had it stripped and it's solid mahogany and totally beautiful! However, whenever he moved and left me to prepare everything for sale, it took me 3-4 days to get to the top of the desk! So maybe...it's a little hereditary and maybe it's a little of NanaDot's suggestion of me being left-handed. By tomorrow it will be neat and orderly!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 12:28 AM

Ray, Men have breast cancer too. It's less common and frequently not caught in time. I quite agree w/you that men frequently get shafted in "Family court" outcomes. I recently sat in on a session and was absolutely appalled. In a time of recession, the judge was happily gaveling poor blokes off to jail until they came up w/support funds that had been computed in better times. Men who had suffered health problems, and/or lost their jobs. The most blatant was a very pregnant woman who had three children. The two older boys, 6&7 had health problems that required frequent medical care. The man, in court was father of a darling two year old girl who was in the back being held by the current boy friend. To keep the child from calling out. The boy friend was holding his hand over the child's mouth. She was screaming. A sheriff came back. I thought this was good. Nope, he told the boy friend he'd have to take her outside. The child screamed and screamed outside. None of the "Family Court" personnel seemed to notice. The man said he didn't mind paying for his child, but he sure couldn't increase the amount in these times. The woman was trying to convince the judge that support should be set upon the national average of what barbers make. Now the national average would include John Edwards' barber as well as Bill Clinton's. Those chaps were earning $400 per hair cut. The local fellow didn't even have a barber's license yet. He was just cutting friends' hair.

One would think the judge might offer a counseling session on birth control to the woman. Considering the latest figures for raising a child to 18, more people should think about how many children they can afford to bring into the world.

-- Posted by upsedaisy on Sat, Aug 15, 2009, at 12:10 AM

Little nouveaublogger

Sat in the corner

Scanning her recipes.

Along came her daughter

Who exclaimed with a falter

Mother--your desk is clean!!

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 11:10 PM

Ray,

As all-knowing as you pretend to be, how come you aren't in Washington getting the place straightened out?

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 10:57 PM

Wonder Jim,

I wasn't aware of a new GI Joe movie. I saw The Story of GI Joe a few weeks ago (Robert Mitchum, Burgess Meredith as Ernie Pyle).

Is this a remake?

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 10:50 PM

"I bet that you are opposed to any taxpayer money for abortions but favor coverage for drugs for males that correct e.d., e.g. cialis?"

You bet wrong and choose a rather moronic example, considering the many ways that men are discriminated against. Men and women die about equally from breast and prostate cancers, but breast cancer receives many times more funding for research. I'm all for real equality, when it comes to "choice." I believe that a father has a right to adopt a child that a woman "chooses" to abort. I call that "real choice." It's better than letting a woman murder a baby. I'm for a father not being responsible for a child that a woman "unilaterally chooses" to have. Upon divorce, I'm for fathers automatically getting 50/50, equally shared parenting. As it is now, family law courts routinely drive fathers from their children's lives, then blame fathers for being absent. They blame fathers for being absent, just like evil Oblama did this past father's day.

-- Posted by Ray on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 10:48 PM

ND --- I think you'd be proud of me if you could see the neat, orderly stacks on my desk. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 10:33 PM

June, 1963 found me within a few miles of where the following words were spoken:

http://www.historyplace.com/sounds/ichbi...

I believe Obama spoke in about the same location when he visited Deutschland.

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 10:25 PM

Well Ray after reading your post regarding how men are oppressed at the hands of the Democrats am I jumping to conclusions when I bet that you are opposed to any taxpayer money for abortions but favor coverage for drugs for males that correct e.d., e.g. cialis?

-- Posted by upsedaisy on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 10:22 PM

No Ray,

Once agan it was a simple question. You seem to have an opinion about everything else and I find it hard to belive that in light of your other comments that you don't have an opinion about the Iraq invasiion.

You call me ignorant? Fine. But you can't seem to answer one simple question. Were you or were you not in favor of the invasion of Iraq?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 10:11 PM

Well, WonderJim, what do you think of having a cool glass of water now

-- Posted by waterman7622 on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 7:42 PM

"I'm still curious about your position on the invasion of Iraq."

Not every issue is my issue so why are you so insistful that I have a position, when I don't? Did you ever stop to consider that instead of (as some on this thread), bigotedly jumping to conclusions?

Are you just as curious about the fact that the most recent invasion of Iraq lead directly to Khadafy of Libya abandoning his atomic bomb project?

-- Posted by Ray on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 7:38 PM

"I take it that prior to Jan. 20, 2009 those statistics would have been exactly 50% men and 50% women right? "Fair and Balanced",right."

Your ignorance is showing. Men and women have historically faced oppressions in their lives. The chivalrous conservatives have always tried to have gender roles that protect women, often at the expense of men's safety. But in the 1960's it was the radical feminists in the democrat party who fueled vast, new discriminations against all things male - and you know it. Men today face all the same old historical prejudices and many new ones that have been added to the pile since the 1960's. It has been the democrat party running amok with special privileges, entitlements, programs and services for women, while many, many, many of the valid issues and needs of men go ignored by both parties. It is the democrat party that works to undermine the valid needs of men most of all, when men speak up and try to attain some degree of equality in the misandrist gender war that is going on in America.

-- Posted by Ray on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 7:28 PM

"...the same way you played Captain commando with our kids lives in Iraq."

That is an outright lie. You attack people who are opposed to the unsound agenda of the dem's. as if they were conservatives or republicans. You foolishly assume too much.

I will never forget the dem's. being the party whose members spit on servicemen in uniform. I will never forget being given instructions not to wear my uniform in public because of that. One can see how many G.I's. think of that despicable bunch as the true enemies of America.

-- Posted by Ray on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 7:16 PM

"Canadian officials knew US abused Gitmo prisoner"

So did Nancy Pelosi..

-- Posted by Third Child on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 5:50 PM

Court: Canadian officials knew US abused Gitmo prisoner:

http://rawstory.com/08/news/2009/08/14/c...

-- Posted by news across on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 5:25 PM

Former House Majority Leader Dick Armey (R-Texas) is resigning from DLA Piper law firm amid a wave of negative attention his grassroots organization, Freedom Works, has drawn for helping to organize protesters at health care town hall meetings with members of Congress.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/080...

-- Posted by news across on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 5:16 PM

Scarpetta, I think a store that much closer to me would be just dandy! The closing of Dollar General was part of the plan, by the way, and since that's happened or is about to happen, I'd say they must be moving along. I've been out of town most of the last week and home sick for two more days, but when I get back to work Monday, I'll do more checking and see how the project is progressing.

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 4:59 PM

No Ray...

my point is and was that you neocon/tea party/birther/deather folks are again playing political games with our health care options in the same way you played Captain commando with our kids lives in Iraq. We can see how that worked out. The fact is you neocons have a long history of terribly serious lies and "mistakes"...with equally terrible results.

I support our President's plan and I sure don't trust you neocons any futher than I can throw you.

...and I just finished writing Bond and McCaskill as well as my Congressman Emanuel Cleaver and urged them to support our President also.

-- Posted by news across on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 4:55 PM

Thanks Kathy, let's hope they still move. A store is needed on this end of town.

-- Posted by Scarpetta on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 4:53 PM

Ray,

Those deaths numbers you stated are indeed an impressive statistic and would appear as if you couldn't wait to use it.

I take it that prior to Jan. 20, 2009 those statistics would have been exactly 50% men and 50% women right? "Fair and Balanced",right

If that's the case then the democrats must have more power than anyone thought possible to be able to kill off so many more men than women in a little over six months. Maybe,just maybe if they were to use thier powers for good and not evil, they just might be able to reform healthcare don't you think?

I'm still curious about your position on the invasion of Iraq.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 4:09 PM

Kathy,

I guess I was wondering if it will actually happen? I realize you may not know. Might I add that since Aldi's moved I think Patricia's is actually more populated than before.

-- Posted by Scarpetta on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 4:05 PM
Response by Kathy Fairchild/Staff writer:
This particular issue goes back at least three years, to about when I moved here in May 2006. At that time, Patricia's was running a poll in the store, asking where shoppers would like the store to move. I filled out a ballot and suggested the move closer to me - which, as it turned out, is exactly what they were proposing to do.

Since then, it's been a watch and wait kind of thing. We ran a story about the new Aldi's store in August 2008, and this is what Patricia's told us about the status of their project then:

"...Patricia's Foods is moving ahead with plans to relocate their store to South Odell Avenue, a move that's been in the works for more than two years.

Nancy Eckhoff, with the corporate office in Concordia, said the company plans to begin remodeling the former IGA on Odell in a few months, and expects to move in "about a year."

Eckhoff said plans to move the business were set aside when the Concordia store burned, destroying all the food stocks and computer equipment.

"We're still going to move," Eckhoff said, putting to rest recent rumors the move had been called off.

Ray,

It may not be too late for you to have a sex change operation.

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 3:24 PM

"Ray a lot of folks...including me...have noticed that the same folks telling us that a public heath care option is so bad are the same folks that told us the war in Iraq would be so good...and now 4000 dead American kids, 20,000 injured, and as many as 1 million dead Iraqi civilians later some of those same folks want to deny they supported that war."

What a load of hypocrisy. I just happen to notice that the people who spout off about the 4,000 deaths in Iraq really don't care about the fact that over 97% of those deaths are male, that men lead in 12 of the 15 categories for leading causes of death, are tied in two categories with women, and women lead in only one category (according to the CDC). People spouting off about the horror of the 4,000 deaths in Iraq don't address the 26, 000 males who commit suicide EVERY YEAR (75% of suicides). They don't address the approximately 8,000 to 10,000 homicides of men EVERY YEAR (76% men according to the DOJ), They don't address the work place deaths and injuries 94% men (according to NIOSH), etc., etc. Yet democrats say men are privileged and oppress women so they give women all kinds of special taxpayer funded programs and Offices of Women's Health, Women's Commissions, Women's Studies programs, Offices of Violence Against Women, etc., etc., etc., ad naseum, ad infinitum, but these same people (democrats) work overtime to deny comparable services for men. There are no Offices of Men's Health, no Men's Commissions, no Office of Violence Against Men, no Men's Studies programs, etc. Yes, women are the majority of the electorate and all elected officials pander to women, but it is democrats who promote the prejudice in every category and it costs tens of thousands of men their lives every year. Any man who supports the democrat party is doing so at the cost of years off his own life. So, if you're going to count those 4,000 deaths in Iraq as if you really care, then by all means don't fail to mention how democrats cost so many more men their lives EVERY YEAR, through a variety of misandrous discriminations. That discrimination as well as democrat hypocrisy ignoring it, stinks to high heaven, IMO. Those same people (democrats) are pushing ObamaCare. Any man who supports ObamaCare is apparently, either very short sighted, ignorant, or outright suicidal, IMO.

-- Posted by Ray on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 2:52 PM

Scarpetta: The rest of the building is part of the deal with Patricia's to move there, at least that's what they told us about a year ago.

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 2:51 PM

Kinda what I thought What the F... , my curiosity got the best of me. :)

-- Posted by Scarpetta on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 2:45 PM

I've heard from a couple different people now not to drink the city water because there is no chlorine in it. Any truth to this?

Response by Eric Crump/Editor:

We're checking on it now.

-- Posted by Oldblackcat on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 1:13 PM
Response by Geoff Rands/Staff writer:
There is a boil order in effect due to low chlorine residual levels.

www.marshallnews.com/story/1562371.html

Thanks Scarpetta,

That clears that up.

Ray,

There is a reason why I was curious about your views on the invasion of Iraq regarding something that you have now said a couple of times.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 10:50 AM

What the f... ,

So this cat was curious and went to the source about the Hustler's issue. Sounds like they are staying...along with their part of the building.

Again I have to ask what will happen to the rest of the building...

-- Posted by Scarpetta on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 10:21 AM

World Wide Wiretap..

The Defense Dept. also designed video games.. now the kids that grew up in the fantasy of virtual battles with imaginary images on a video screen are driving the drone bombers of today..

They work a nine to five killing people by remote control and sleep like a baby. Video games are mind control.

-- Posted by Third Child on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 10:08 AM

"Ray a lot of folks...including me...have noticed that the same folks telling us that a public heath care option is so bad are the same folks that told us the war in Iraq would be so good...and now 4000 dead American kids, 20,000 injured, and as many as 1 million dead Iraqi civilians later some of those same folks want to deny they supported that war."

You are apparently attempting to make illogical connections between two disparate issues. I suspected as much. You are attempting to misread my motivations through use of logical fallicies. The Iraq war and ObamaCare are not the same issue and the motivations behind each can be very complex and very, very unrelated. Please stop reading into my comments what you believe are my motivations and deal with the issue of ObamaCare on its lack of merit.

-- Posted by Ray on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 10:00 AM

Oops. Apologies to Broke-n-busted and Third Child for misremembering who said what. I still recommend the book, though, which I found to be more interesting and entertaining than you might think for a book about a bunch of geeky scientists doodling around with primitive computers and wires.

-- Posted by Eric Crump on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 8:38 AM

Much concern and protest about federal revision of insurance/health care is about voters not trusting government to represent their interests. If we look at the record last year, the "stimulus" was not specific to the job loss situation. Lead laws that threatened to close children's libraries and prevented motorcycle dealers from selling youth products are another example of Congress "not reading the bill". Passing legislation and then expecting some government agency to interpret legislated confusion is not what we have a Congress and President for.

Years and decades of reducing regulation and lack of federal oversight caused our Depression. But lawmakers and most top Wall Street investment bankers do not feel the "bite" of job loss or reduced wage. We aren't Pelosi astroturf. We're "crabgrass". Doesn't anyone remember Enron: offshoring and complex derivatives? Doesn't anyone remember the Savings and Loan deregulation disaster? How about junk bond leveraging (now called hedge funds) that closed Marshall's Wilson plant that paid reasonable wages. Wall Street is all about short term, frantic gain, not community building in rural states. While Congress removed some of the Great Depression regulations (Glass-Steagall 1933) contributing to the present disaster, some other measures live on (FDIC insurance, federal takeover of under funded banks) as current protections, making this Depression less severe.

We have a bi-partisan lack of accountability, not a this party or that party problem. And Obama has his horse pushing the cart, not in front of it pulling, if we look at how Roosevelt tried to handle the problem. First bank and Wall Street regulations were created to control "big shot" leveraged foolishness. Job creation for young people was at least attempted. After these foundation measures, social programs came next. To follow the Roosevelt era pattern, first fix the financial lack of regulation/oversight to build jobs. After that do the social programs. Revising health care is a social program and we could do better with health care. However, the current cause for increasing numbers of uninsured is job loss. Lose your job -- lose your coverage.

-- Posted by Cat13 on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 7:27 AM

News I do not know about Ray but as someone that supported the war at first I do not deny I supported that war because I supported it based on what I thought was the truth.

As far as government controlled health care if and only if I really thought it could be ran right would I support it.

But it would have to be run as well as the system in Australia and EVERYONE would be under the same system even the leadership of this country.

ONE SYSTEM FOR EVERYONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-- Posted by Gal66 on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 7:13 AM

Ray

....I believe questioning the motivations of any given stance of an individual regarding important issues is quite appropriate. Perhaps that is why I was anxious to hear your answer to what your position on the Iraq war was when the war began also. I see by your brief comment on same was another avoidance of the question...and more importantly...the answer.

Ray a lot of folks...including me...have noticed that the same folks telling us that a public heath care option is so bad are the same folks that told us the war in Iraq would be so good...and now 4000 dead American kids, 20,000 injured, and as many as 1 million dead Iraqi civilians later some of those same folks want to deny they supported that war.

-- Posted by news across on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 2:07 AM

Dear NanaDot

Your description of our current healthcare system is "Dickens" was a stroke of genius! The current system will have us all begging for "More Please, May I have some more Please"

My gosh it was just perfection in the English language. Just to let you know I'm going to steal your word.

Oh by the way the Mar-Saline NAACP has issued a paper about the healthcare distortions. Contact your local branch and have them email it to you. Its good!

Hey Take Care, NanaDot

-- Posted by movaldude on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 12:59 AM

WTF asked, "Did you support the invasion of Iraq? It's a simple question."

That appears to be a non sequitur, or possibly the beginning of a straw man argument. What does that question have to do with ObamaCare? That's all I've addressed so why are you going off topic? Is that a straw man argument to draw attention away from ObamaCare, or will I next be asked if the moon is made of green cheese, or if the price of tea in China is on the rise?

I used to be a democrat, but I have come to see how completely destructive to America the democrat party is. I presently am not a dedicated supporter of any party, but I have a lot of problems with a lot of things that democrats stand for these days. From what I see of the identity politics the democrats practice, the democrat party is one big Marx-o-centric hate movement, working to prejudicially divide good people along lines of race, class and gender.

-- Posted by Ray on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 12:51 AM

Yep, Mosaic and then Netscape. I still say bookmarks instead of favorites.

-- Posted by Dawson16 on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 12:48 AM

Ray, thanks for taking the time to answer the challenge. I don't want to put words in your mouth, so correct me if I am wrong.

Your position is that nothing really needs to be done except something for the fifteen percent or so that have no coverage. You believe that every one else is fairly satisfied and being fairly well treated. You further believe that we must be careful that what we do for the fifteen percent does no harm to the rest of us.

Is that about it? If so what do you think should be done for the fifteen percent?

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 12:33 AM

NanaDot,

You observation would be dead on! :)

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 12:01 AM

Slater;

NO! Far Worse. She made me clean my house. HA! (I would have loved to sit in a corner. Preferrably in the corner of my office where my computer is)! She picked up some mail I had dropped on the table, along with my purse and informed me she was dropping it into the "black hole", her name for the condition of my desk. Alas, after 30 years of office work (and now that I don't really get paid for it) my origanizational skills have become a thing of the past. However, I know where everything is....on top of my desk...somewhere!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 11:46 PM

Obama delegate/student lies and says she is a doctor in support of Obamacare at town hall meeting.. gets hug from Sheila Jackson Lee for being such a good liar..

http://lonestartimes.com/2009/08/13/obam...

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 11:34 PM

NanaDot, I remember.

And shell accounts and telnet and finger and PINE mail on the old COIN system out of Columbia and ORION in Springfield.

Then along came graphics and color and simplicity was gone forever.

I remember calling an ISP back in the 90s about a new account and asking the person who answered the phone if they provided shell access too. She put her hand over the phone but I could still hear her ask someone, "What the heck is a shell account?"

Those were the good old days of dial-up.

-- Posted by Dawson16 on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 11:08 PM

"The internet was a fully developed, functioning communiation system long before corporate america took the reins."

Actually it was Broke & Busted that mentioned Al Gore's internet and yes the internet was first designed for the defense department. Corporate may run the internet now but DoD still holds the reigns.. they affectionately call it the 'world wide wiretap'

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 10:49 PM

Third Child: I recommend "Where Wizards Stay Up Late: The Origins Of The Internet" by Katie Hafner. The internet was a fully developed, functioning communiation system long before corporate america took the reins.

-- Posted by Eric Crump on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 10:29 PM

Ray,

Did you support the invasion of Iraq? It's a simple question.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 10:12 PM

Indeed, ND, it's a sad day for Les Paul fans.

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 10:09 PM

NB,

Did you have to sit in the corner for being a bad girl and messing at your computer while your daughter was there? (heh heh)

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 10:07 PM

Ray, weren't you in the class of 1950 at Slater?

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 10:03 PM

"...QUIT SNIPING over the LIES put out by THE PROFITEERING insurance companies!"

The above is the real falsehood. The dissatisfaction with ObamaCare is from the American people. They're not lying.

http://tinyurl.com/p7853j

"Using the latest CNN and Census data, if 85 percent of Americans have health insurance, and 80 percent of Americans are satisfied with their current health quality, then approximately 70 percent of Americans are satisfied with their current arrangements. Care must be taken to ensure that changes to help 15 percent of Americans do not make the vast majority of Americans worse off."

"There are currently 5 (FIVE) draft proposals from the HOUSE, NONE from the SENATE. It's NOT time to panic, people - it's time to study, and investigate, and converse, NOT terrify our old people with a flat out lie."

One of the most recent lies is directly from the mouth of Obama, saying he has the endorsement of AARP, but once again he lies. AARP has refuted his lie.

ObamaCare is just one more abomination being foisted on Americans by the radical socialist agenda of Barack Obama. Why would anyone entrust any health care decisions to a party that has historically, wholeheartedly embraced a culture of death through the deaths of over 40, 000, 000 unborn children over 4 decades?

http://tinyurl.com/mmb3dm

http://tinyurl.com/lztubg

-- Posted by Ray on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 9:04 PM

Whew! I don't usually go on like that. Think I'll go to bed now.

-- Posted by broke-n-busted on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 9:01 PM

The people I know that send their kids to private schools do so because they say they are better. Last stats I saw the USA school system doesn't stack up so well against a lot of the world.

I drove on the Interstate system today - scares me to death. We keep pumping more money into it and it always needs more. I was in Kansas and had to pay a toll for the priviledge.

Medicare is as broke as I am.

The VA is as broke as I am. On top of that they treated my dad so poorly that I wouldn't recommend it at all. I mean - better off dead!

I worked for the allmighty TVA once in my life. Don't try to tell me public utilities save us money - I have never seen so much waste and terrible management.

And Eric, I thought Al Gore was responsible for the Internet ;-} (LOL snort chortle). Ahem, Sorry. I think the key to your statement is they invested in and stayed out of the development of the Internet. If you spend enough money one day you will come up with a winner.

It is problems with the very programs that you tout as good examples that create in me a very real concern that the government might not make it better. I agree it is pretty well broken right now and we darn sure need someone to fix it. I sure hope Obama is the man that can get it started but I'm not sure we have given him all the tools to get there. Barney Frank can only do so much and I am afraid he might be overloaded as it is. I mean let's face it - we don't have the Country's best managers managing the Country. The best managers are out working for the mega-corporations raping and pillaging to the tune of millions of dollars of salary/bonuses a year. Some of the people we have managing our Country wouldn't even survive in the corporate world much less excel. These are the people we have making decisions about the future of our health care.

Fear. For good cause.

I think part of the frenzy that we are seeing has been caused by the manner in which health care reform is being approached. When Clinton came out with a plan for health care he pretty much did just that. He had a plan and he said here it is we have to have this. It didn't fly. So Obama is taking a different approach. He has a more open management approach. He has said to Congress ok it is broken what do we need to do to fix it? Problem is NOBODY trusts the Congress. I mean they look like they need help tying their shoes in the morning. I think some form of loose framework giving them some type of direction is in order.

NanaDot - Respond to me and tell me that you trust the current United States Congress with the very lives of your spouse and children. Tell me that you trust the Congress implicitly to do what is right to restructure a system that will be responsible for the lives of your parents. Tell me that and I will be forced to re-examine the concerns and reservations that I have with the process as it stands today.

-- Posted by broke-n-busted on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 9:00 PM

To NanaDot's list add: The little old internet, invented and developed with our tax dollars.

-- Posted by Eric Crump on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 7:45 PM

My memory is not what it once was. Could somebody give me a good example where our government stepped in and saved me money? Better yet saved large numbers of people large amounts of money? Preferably on a national level. And, oh yes, the service must be better too. I'm trying to think of a good "for instance" but it just isn't coming to me.

-- Posted by broke-n-busted on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 7:13 PM

As we cogitate on the issues, we could take a little break and put our minds to other things more palatable. Here are two ways to get started tomorrow night:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wkEIx3yDw...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ndub6h4bh...

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 5:42 PM

I think it is fear. Fear of change. Fear of the unknown. Fear of the loss of what little control we have over our own lives. Fear that can be manipulated by politicians left or right. Fear that we will be promised something and then when we need it most finding that it isn't there - again.

-- Posted by broke-n-busted on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 5:32 PM

Slater,

Every modern, 1st World nation except for the USA provides some form of socialized health care and also manage to pay for it...far more effectively and for far less per person than the USA does.

If we have dollars to kill with we have dollars to heal with. I guess its all just a matter priorities.

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 5:21 PM

Republicans are now saying they have a better idea and that would be great; however, what did they do during the Bush years and the Bush Congress? Think back - - exactly what did they do or say about it until Obama mentioned it? I am not an Obama supporter by the way, but all these lies that are circulating on biased news stations and the internet are sickening.

-- Posted by Listening In on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 5:10 PM

News,

What I wonder is just how much input the government is accepting from the medical community like the Cleveland Clinic and Mayo Clinic, two examples. Both have developed their own methods for providing quality care and at a much lower cost than the national average, this according to the two who are in charge of them.

The head of the Mayo Clinic (Rochester), when asked if he was being allowed by Congress to share his experiences, said not really. He said no one acted as though they're interested in hearing from him.

And, of course, that seems to be at the heart of the matter regardless of the issue - the legislators believe they're omniscient. If you don't believe it, just ask them.

One of the Committee of Six said Medicare is currently taking one dollar of every six dollars in revenue, and that figure is projected to rise to 1 in 3 within the next few years.

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 5:09 PM

"So, what do you think should be done?

If we all don't change the focus of our comments Eric might as well change "Post Comment" to "Post Complaint'"

If the federal government changes nothing in the nation's health care, it is far better than the "change" Obama is proposing, IMO.

http://tinyurl.com/pkyqp2

http://tinyurl.com/lztubg

-- Posted by Ray on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 4:54 PM

Slater,

Perhaps we could simply extend medicare to cover everyone 100%, while also allowing folks the option of carrying private insurance.

After all...its worked very well where I live.

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 4:42 PM

Listening In,

Thanks for the links. It truly puzzles me how citizens can say that reform will bring this and that when the reformers don't even know yet.

What I've heard the reform committee (Senate), the so-called Committee of Six, say is that at this point the legislation could likely contain both private and cooperative provisions - the cooperatives replacing the public initiative.

This concept seems to meet the test for reducing costs (all)while at the same time focusing on meaningful and quality care, but much work (negotiating) remains to be done before a bill acceptable to both political parties is finalized.

For now, as you said, distortion is what's making front-page news.

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 4:30 PM

Not for me its not Scarpetta,...

...for me its about my fellow Americans all -- 100% -- having easy, affordable health care.

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 4:29 PM

It is always about politics...

-- Posted by Scarpetta on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 4:19 PM

Well folks as you can see by some of the previous comments that for the neoconservative this has very little to do with health care, and everything to do politics.

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 4:15 PM

More disillusioned Obama supporters speak out as Obama is proven dishonest about pharma lobby deal..

The Health Care Reform Debacle: Obama's Coming-Out

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/michael-br...

It is Barack Obama who is to blame for this. For months, he stayed aloof from the out-of-control Congressional maneuvering based on a strange belief in some kind of bipartisan collective will emerging by osmosis. He never leaned the weight of his person and his office to elements of reform that has been touting as candidate and then President. He deceived the country by pursuing secret talks with the very lobbies who are the heart of disgraceful national health care situation. He entered into deals that were weighted heavily in their selfish interest rather than the national interest. In short, we have gotten from him the antithesis of what we were promised and expected -- in the substance and process of policy both. We have instead a conventionally minded politician overly respectful of the status quo and deferential to those who control and profit from it, A man with no apparent fixed convictions.

Serious health care reform is gone with the wind. It cannot be retrieved. All other domestic issues pale in importance by comparison -- except for the financial crisis. On that front, Obama has behaved exactly as he now has done on the health care front. That is to say, viewing the world from the prejudicial perspective of the high and mighty while neglecting his duty to the citizenry and those who put their trust in him. The question: 'who really is Barack Obama?' is more compelling than ever. The answer looks to be more and more disheartening.

Also:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/drew-weste...

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 3:28 PM

Yeah folks you just keep trusting the same folks who lied us into the war in iraq, made torture a standard American value, and crushed our economy because they clearly, only care about you.

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 3:14 PM

Unless you refuse to believe anything someone says with a different opinion than yours, this might give you an idea of what is truth and what is fiction regarding the health care plan, but if not, believe all the hype as much as you want because no one can change your mind:

http://www.WhiteHouse.gov/realitycheck

http://www.WhiteHouse.gov/realitycheck/f...

-- Posted by Listening In on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 3:07 PM

Ray,

Did you support the invasion of Iraq?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 3:05 PM

There are many great Americans who wonder why so many democrats are mesmerized by the Pied Piper of Marx-o-centric socialism that they fail to see all he is doing to destroy America.

http://tinyurl.com/l9nwau

-- Posted by Ray on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 3:01 PM

Imaloony,

I very much appreciate your time and trouble for the Amazon link. This is one I hadn't come across, and it does seem to be fairly well received.

Thanks a bunch!

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 2:59 PM

Right-wing pundits tear into 11-year-old girl for asking Obama a question:

http://rawstory.com/08/news/2009/08/12/r...

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 2:52 PM

Third Child and Ray,

Its hard to imagine why anyone would oppose socialized medicine -- especially for Americans such as myself who actually live in a nation that actually has socialized medicine and who already know the hype from the neoconservatives is pure horse dung.

Its difficult to understand why you or anyone prefers the neoconservative root hog or die system where millions go with out medical care on a daily basis...never the less...it appears that is what you prefer.

So I say great...you folks keep your third World system...and we in the rest of the World will keep our cheaper, far less expensive, modern approach with 100% coverage.

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 2:48 PM

WonderJim: I don't know how old you are, but I remember being blown away by "How High The Moon" way back when. It was very different from all that had proceeded it, and wonder of wonders, people embraced it despite the glaring differences from the rather bland pop music that was predominant. It became a hit song, and the rest is history.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 1:54 PM

Ray, and Third Child: You are both intelligent people, and are adept at stating your points of view. the problem is you emphasize what is wrong, but I do not read in your comments what would be right.

I think you both agree that the health system in this country is in crisis. You also are skeptical of the federal goverment's effort to correct it, it should not be news to you that I am also skeptical of the effort thus far, and even more so of results.

I have to ask you though, because I do not get a read from your comments, do you not also think that the private health industry has made a mess of things? Are you not concerned that they have put the squeeze on small businesses,and self employed individuals? In fairness I do not read comments from either of you championing the private health industry, but your silence is deafening.

So, what do you think should be done?

If we all don't change the focus of our comments Eric might as well change "Post Comment" to "Post Complaint"

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 1:45 PM

Ray,

Out of curiosity were you in favor of the invasion of Iraq?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 1:21 PM

"Even columnist Eugene Robinson, a self-described "true believer" who "will almost certainly support" "whatever reform package finally emerges", agrees that "If the government says it has to control health-care costs and then offers to pay doctors to give advice about hospice care, citizens are not delusional to conclude that the goal is to reduce end-of-life spending." [8]"

and

"Section 1233 authorizes advanced care planning consultations for senior citizens on Medicare every five years, and more often "if there is a significant change in the health condition of the individual ... or upon admission to a skilled nursing facility, a long-term care facility... or a hospice program." [3] During those consultations, practitioners must explain "the continuum of end-of-life services and supports available, including palliative care and hospice," and the government benefits available to pay for such services. [4]"

http://tinyurl.com/mkfvra

ObamaCare is just one more abomination being foisted on Americans by the radical socialist agenda of Barack Obama. Why would anyone entrust any health care decisions to a party that has historically, wholeheartedly embraced a culture of death through the deaths of over 40, 000, 000 unborn children over 4 decades?

http://tinyurl.com/lgnsmf

-- Posted by Ray on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 12:52 PM

"INDIANAPOLIS -- The federal government said Monday it will bump up a rate used to figure Medicare Advantage reimbursement to insurers, but many analysts expect overall payment rates to fall next year.

That raises some concern for how lower reimbursement will affect the plans, which allow the elderly and disabled to receive benefits through private health insurers.

These plans receive a government subsidy and generally offer more benefits than traditional Medicare, but they've drawn criticism for their cost.

The trade association America's Health Insurance Plans estimates that Medicare Advantage payments could fall nearly 5 percent next year as a result of the changes. Spokesman Robert Zirkelbach said the cut could lead to higher premiums and benefits reductions for the more than 10 million people enrolled in Medicare Advantage.

"It's an unnecessary disruption in the health security of seniors on Medicare Advantage," he said."

http://tinyurl.com/r9jusc

and

"Congress has proposed a 500 billion dollar cut in Medicare over the next ten years and only one percent is going to root out fraud."

http://tinyurl.com/o2ssgr

Senior citizens who have paid into Medicare their whole lives appear to be on Obama's chopping block, when it comes to their own medical needs (present and future). It appears the lives of seniors and the old are undesirable in Obama's Marx-o-centric socialist vision for America. First, the culture of death came for the unborn. Now they're coming for seniors. Who will they come for next? Will there be anyone left to protest when it's your turn?

http://tinyurl.com/m9zcq6

-- Posted by Ray on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 12:36 PM

Revealed: Obama's denied secret deal with big pharma..

A memo obtained by the Huffington Post confirms that the White House and the pharmaceutical lobby secretly agreed to precisely the sort of wide-ranging deal that both parties have been denying over the past week.

It says the White House agreed to oppose any congressional efforts to use the government's leverage to bargain for lower drug prices or import drugs from Canada -- and also agreed not to pursue Medicare rebates or shift some drugs from Medicare Part B to Medicare Part D, which would cost Big Pharma billions in reduced reimbursements.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/13...

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 12:10 PM

Sarah Palin said:

"Is it any wonder that senior citizens might view such consultations as attempts to convince them to help reduce health care costs by accepting minimal end-of-life care"

Well, let's see. They might get that idea when those consultations are unfairly characterized as "death panels" Anyone who has ever had to have one of those consultations knows that they are necessary so that the wishes of the dying may be observed. People will die regardless and preparation for that inevitability is what those consultations are for. The govt' isn't pulling the plug on anybody.

To mis-characterise them as "death panels" is shameful and is only intended to scare seniors.

Sarah Palin and everyone who parrots the phrase knowing full well that it is a lie should be ashamed of themselves.

Maybe that's the problem with America these days. No one(especially politicians)feel any remorse when the are knowingly doing or saying something wrong. You have to ask yourself what thier motivation is. Next time you look at your paycheck and see how much was taken out for insurance you may find solace in knowing that money may go straight to a polititician or lobbyist who will make sure that you are denied the very healthcare that you thought you were paying for. Insurance premiums are another form of taxes and we rarely get what we pay for. What's wrong with trying to fix that?

It's all about money folks. Big,big money. And those who are living the highlife on the backs of your pain and suffering will stop at nothing to secure the staus quo. It's amazing how money can motivate people, for good or bad.

So we are expected to lend creedence to anything Sarah Palin says? She couldn't even finish her first term as a governor because the kitchen got too hot and her run for VP exposed her as the teriibly mis-informed person that she is.

In her farewell speech she chastises the press and tells them to "stop making things up". Really Sarah? Death Panels?

Sarah Palin is punchline. Nothing more, nothing less.

I don't consider afforable healthcare a hand out and I'm not begging for anything. They just want to reform a system that is catgorically screwing us every second of every day.

We are already paying for it. The inequity is in the level of care that I may get compared to someones else simply based on the almighty dollar.

I undertand what you are saying about reversing Bush's policies but that doesn't mean that we can't finally do something good for the American people as well.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 11:30 AM

The statement I posted from Camille comes from a speech made in 1991. Who knows what she stands for today? I really don't know much of anything about her though I'm pretty sure that Salon Magazine is left of neocon. We should all stop using labels to identify others. I was raised a Democrat but Democrats aren't what I was raised to believe they were. Neither are Republicans. Toss them all in a bag and you can't tell one from the other. We're being taken for a ride and we falsely think we're driving the bus.

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 11:14 AM

Thanks Third Child. I stand corrected. And so do you, yes? Paglia clearly defies categorization, unless perhaps we put her in the "iconoclast" group, and neither "neoconservative" nor "left" are very accurate.

-- Posted by Eric Crump on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 11:00 AM

"What qualifies Camille Paglia to represent "the left"? I've read some of her work and always thought she was a neoconservative of impeccable credentials."

I don't think she is qualified to represent the left any more than Rush Limbaugh is qualified to represent the right. Left and right are just terms to herd us into control groups so we don't have to think for ourselves. I used the term because the article was posted in a left leaning publication and I just took that shortcut.

"Neoconservative" doesn't appear to be the correct terminology for Camille either.

In her own words from:

Crisis In The American Universities

by Camille Paglia

American Professor of Humanities

What I don't like right now is that there's a kind of knee-jerk, intimidating way of calling someone "neoconservative" if they happen to criticize the liberal academic establishment--"Right, you're a neocon." Now, when people call me a neocon, what kind of idiots are they? I'm someone who is on the record as being pro-pornography--all the way through kiddie porn and snuff films. I'm pro-prostitution--I mean really pro, not just pro-prostitute and against prostitution. I'm pro-abortion, pro-homosexuality, pro-drag queens, pro-legalization of drugs. This is neoconservative? What kind of amateurishness is out there that people in the press--including The Village Voice and Mother Jones and things like that, which should be the voices of liberalism--what kind of stupid amateurish thinking is this to label me a neoconservative?

http://gos.sbc.edu/p/paglia.html

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 10:54 AM

'hope you were this outraged a few years ago .. warrantless wiretapping, etc.,etc.,etc.'

I was very outraged then and tried to wake people to what was happening. How about you?

Now I'm outraged that the party in power isn't rectifying and reversing these outrages against the American people and the people of the world. Obama isn't changing anything. He is owned by the same bankers that owned Bush and Clinton. Where is the outrage of the left? You supposedly have the power for 'change' but all you are worried about is what benefits you think you can get from government. Why aren't you standing up against illegal and imoral wars? All you are standing up for is a percieved handout and you don't even know that eugenics is what you're begging for.

Why doesn't Obama reverse these Bush transgressions against the people like he promised? Why isn't the left demanding this?

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 10:25 AM

Third Child: I have to ask. What qualifies Camille Paglia to represent "the left"? I've read some of her work and always thought she was a neoconservative of impeccable credentials.

-- Posted by Eric Crump on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 10:20 AM

Concerning the "Death Panels"

by Sarah Palin

http://www.infowars.com/concerning-the-d...

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 10:08 AM

Third Child,

I certainly hope you were this outraged a few years ago when we were lied into an illegal war. When the US. began a torture campaign. When we turned over untold billions of dollars to Hliburton, KBR, Blackwater and the like. Or how about when we politicized our justice department, outed CIA agents for politcal gain and began warrantless wiretapping, etc.,etc.,etc.

I ceratainly hope you were as outraged then as you seem to be now by someone who just wants all of us to have affordable healtcare. What is so terrible about that?

Are you really so outraged at healthcare reform or could it be that your upset just because your team lost?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 9:46 AM

The left attacks Obamacare..

"Obama's healthcare horror"

By Camille Paglia

http://www.salon.com/opinion/paglia/2009...

snippet

As with the massive boondoggle of the stimulus package, which Obama foolishly let Congress turn into a pork rut, too much has been attempted all at once; focused, targeted initiatives would, instead, have won wide public support. How is it possible that Democrats, through their own clumsiness and arrogance, have sabotaged healthcare reform yet again? Blaming obstructionist Republicans is nonsensical because Democrats control all three branches of government. It isn't conservative rumors or lies that are stopping healthcare legislation; it's the justifiable alarm of an electorate that has been cut out of the loop and is watching its representatives construct a tangled labyrinth for others but not for themselves. No, the airheads of Congress will keep their own plush healthcare plan -- it's the rest of us guinea pigs who will be thrown to the wolves.

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 8:47 AM

Ike Skelton update:

Mr Skelton still hasn't answered my question of how he justified voting for an expensive and ill advised carbon tax legislation that he didn't even have time to read.

Now it appears that he is avoiding constituents questions on the radical Obama healthcare takeover. As many times that he has been reelected I guess he just doesn't care anymore.. I imagine that if he doesn't win another election he'll have a lucrative job as a lobbyist, waiting and ready..

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/M/M...

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 8:21 AM

Slater,

mad at you? No...why would I be mad? You held your ground and presented your best argument...what more could I hope for?

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 6:21 AM

Sorry about the typos. Not enough coffee yet.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 6:04 AM

Third Child,

You may wnat to read this also. A former insurance exec. blowing the whistle on the fight against healcare reform:

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/08/12/h...

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 5:59 AM

Goodnight all, especially to you Yank....you sound like my kind of man sweetie...va va voom!

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 12:59 AM

WonderJim: Thanks I needed that. I am roflmao, mostly at myself.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 12:42 AM

Thanks Dot,

Maybe we can car pool? If we're going to hell we might as well go green.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 12:15 AM

Third Child,

Here's a nice little story about the "Liberty" Counsel, or "Liberty" University as they are also known.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/loca...

It's a lovely little group of conservative lawyers. More to the point I would almost bet that they are paid lobbyists for the insurance and healthcare industries.

Do you even care where you get your information?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 12:14 AM

Dear Yank,

Ok, one last thing. Your grammer is interesting yet sad at the same time. Do you do that on purpose. By the way, do you always YELL?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 12:01 AM

Dear Yank,

One more thing. You comments are a shining example of christian "tolerance". Your church services must be a real hoot.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 11:57 PM

Dear Yank,

I'll say this quick before your post is removed. I can only be offended by those whom opinion I respect. Therefore there is no offense taken from yout last post.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 11:54 PM

What Americans Need to Know About The Healthcare Takeover

http://www.lc.org/index.cfm?PID=14102&Al...

http://www.lc.org/media/9980/attachments...

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 11:08 PM

Slater,

Are you looking for something like this?

http://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technica-AT-...

I haven't used it, but the reviews on it aren't bad. If you've got lots of LPs to convert, it might be a good investment indeed. Good luck!

-- Posted by imaloony on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 11:01 PM

Hey Yank.. Yes it does seem like some can get away with more than others but I get censored plenty so don't feel like you're all alone in that respect.

Some subjects are taboo here if certain people don't want to discuss or debate them. We are hurtling toward hades in a handbasket and many just don't want to hear it. Only happy talk and delusions for some and they'll let you know it.. Keep trying to get your message through, though.. sometimes you'll get lucky..

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 10:54 PM

Slater,

A dobro is like an accoustic guitar that has a built-in metal resonator. It sounds more like a banjo than a guitar.

Gotta go, my daughter is here and she's not thinking I'm too cool at the moment for being on the computer! :)

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 10:40 PM

Dear Yank,

Why isn't it good enough for YOU to live YOUR life in in a way that's acceptable to YOUR religion without requiring the rest of society to live up to YOUR religious expectations?

You said:

"GOD is still on his Throne and will not allow queer marriages"

Sounds rather hateful to me but not surprising for a tolerant "christian"

The fact the gay marriage was ever illegal is troublesome enough but more and more communities are actually coming to realize that all men are created equal and have the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness wheter or not the christians agree with it or not. GOD BLESS AMERICA!

You also said:

"not afraid of a an elected official who wants your very life in his hands"

You are woefully misinformed and and unfortunate victim of the medical lobbyists. Translation: You are being lied to by profiteers who will beniefit from your pain and suffering.

Sleep tight.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 10:17 PM

Hey News!

Are ya still mad at me? :)

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 9:19 PM

my comments from last night has been taken out, yet you allow third child and slater say about whatever they want, what relatives or something? this county is going down the wrong road, wanting to sanction marriage to same sex, not afraid of a an elected official who wants your very life in his hands. well we all need to know or most of your comment writers need to know that GOD is still on his Throne and will not allow queer marriages or stupid elected officials continue in the direction they our going.STAND UP AMERICAN AND BE HEARD. GOD BLESS AMERICA.

-- Posted by yank on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 8:59 PM

Hey NB,

I'm pleased that you enjoy some of the things I put up here. Music, for me, has a way of expressing some thoughts I can't put into sensible form, and I just like music, most any kind (well, except maybe opera).

I have a sizeable collection of LP's, and I'm hoping to find a device that will let me transfer the tracks onto my computer so I can then put them onto disc, but I'm not having much success so far. My daughter said she saw something at Costco, so we went there today but couldn't find what she'd seen. I've been online looking, but I'm reading that most stuff available isn't worth spending the money for, but I'll get it figured out.

Yes, I liked that mandolin music also, along with the banjo. I've always been a fan of blue grass music. It sounds as if your father provided plenty of good listening time for you. What kind of instrument is the dobro and what does it sound like?

I always wondered if my kids ever thought their parents were cool. They turned out to be pretty cool, so maybe that's a good sign. :)

No head-butting for me tonight. Too much sun today!

Just one more week of calm for you (except for maybe the tail end of the painting).

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 7:23 PM

Assuming all else is equal between cars, ins., maint., tires, seatbelt with built in gag for mother in law, lis., etc. here's a comparison:

New GM car at $40,000 with 230 mpg per car for 230,000 miles, 1,000 gal. @ $3 gallon gas equals $43,000

New Toyota Prius at $22,000 with 50 mpg for 230,000 miles, 4,600 gal @ $3 per ($13,800)= $35,800 or $7,200 less.

If you drive 23,000 miles per year you will spend $720 per year extra for the GM car. If you are a traveling person and drive over 50,000 miles per year you'll be paying $1,565 per year.

No judgement or recommendation intended, just pointing out some facts of the matter. WT

-- Posted by White Tornado on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 6:59 PM

Hey Slater,

Who's up for head-butting this evening. There's a lot of squabbling goin on, isn't there?

I do like your message, I must say. In fact, I have enjoyed many of your 'you-tube' responses. Looks as if you have a well rounded appreciation of all types of music. Imagine my childrens surprise when I pulled out old record albums of Santana, Eric Clapton, Eagles, Rod Stewart...they didn't have a clue how old these guys are! It's really great when your own children start wondering if mom could possilby be, just a little cool! :)

I particularly liked the mandolin players and have gone back a couple of times to listen. My dad used to play the mandolin, uke, guitar, banjo, dobro...you name it. All by ear, never read sheet music in his life.

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 6:47 PM

Eric, I saved the post in question and there isn't any name calling. I did sign the post with a moniker that Oklahoma Reader gave me a while back that I kind of liked... Is that what you consider name calling?

Third Churl

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 6:17 PM

Ok, maybe it's just all the deletions. Trying to read along and understand was making my eyes cross. Sounds like I missed some "interesting" posts!

-- Posted by Dawson16 on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 6:00 PM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
It's frequently the case that interesting comments get deleted because the writer can't resist a parting shot. Insults of one sort or another are by far the most common reason comments get deleted. Few people can resist responding in kind and the conversation quickly gets diverted from the issues and devolves into a personal squabble.

Here's my message to the New Axis element:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdjeQUJwF...

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 5:52 PM

I've got to admit, sometimes this blog gives me a headache...and scares me!

-- Posted by oneofmany on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 5:51 PM

So who is responsible for the editing deletions this afternoon? Is it editor Crump or reporter Fairchild? Can you please explain the criteria?

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 5:44 PM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
Me. Namecalling.

NanaDot, maybe I'm just tired from a long day at work, and I don't mean to be insulting, but your posts don't make any sense!

-- Posted by Dawson16 on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 5:30 PM

"ObamaCare is just one more abomination being foisted on Americans by the radical socialist agenda of Barack Obama. Why would anyone entrust any health care decisions to a party that has historically, wholeheartedly embraced a culture of death through the deaths of over 40, 000, 000 unborn children over 4 decades?"

http://tinyurl.com/mmb3dm

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 5:27 PM

NanaODot:

If you have something to post that refutes what I've said, by all means post it, otherwise I do not just take your word for it. Where is the missing footage you allude to? It appears that what you have posted without support is the biggest b.s. of all.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 5:15 PM

"Yeah, yeah, yeah, and the Jews threw themselves in the ovens, the kid in Wyoming tied himself to a barbed wire fence, and beat himself to death, or if he didn't he shouldn't have talked to the good old boys like he did, and it wouldn't have happened.

You on the radical right never own up to anything. You have well learned the lessons of your Supreme Party Leader R. Limbaugh."

Oklahoma Reader resorts to ad hominem attacks and disingenuous information to spew propanganda.

#1 I have never, (NEVER) listened to Rush Limbaugh.

#2 It was the identity politics of the WWII, German, National Socialists that led to the Jews being sent to the ovens, and today it is American socialists in the Democrat party who are supporting the identity politics that targets groups of people for persecution. Identity politics has contributed to the killings of 40, 000, 000 unborn American children, and may well be targeting American seniors next.

It is disingenuous to even mention the Matthew Shepard case in the context of a hate crime, given the facts. The Matthew Shepard case is a case, that has been propagandized by the disingenuous, radical left in the democrat party. It is appalling that heterosexual victims of homosexual hate are never championed by the identity politics of democrat party socialist operatives.

http://tinyurl.com/lopzy4

"Money for drugs, not 'homophobia,' was the motive for Matthew Shepard's murder, Aman noted. The ABC report said Aaron McKinney, sentenced in 1999 to two life sentences for Shepard's murder, was on a sleepless week-long methamphetamine binge and in search of money for more drugs when he and his accomplice, Russell Henderson, met Shepard at a bar.

McKinney himself has said, "All I wanted to do was beat him up and rob him."

Henderson also denied the hate-crime charge. "It's not because me and Aaron had anything against gays or anything like that," he said."

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 5:11 PM

"With Helen Gurley Brown, I say "if they call you a B&*(), say THANK YOU"

So are we now supposed to call (----) "B&*()"??

What does that even mean?

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 5:05 PM

Yeah, yeah, yeah, and the Jews threw themselves in the ovens, the kid in Wyoming tied himself to a barbed wire fence, and beat himself to death, or if he didn't he shouldn't have talked to the good old boys like he did, and it wouldn't have happened.

You on the radical right never own up to anything. You have well learned the lessons of your Supreme Party Leader R. Limbaugh.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 4:38 PM

Third Child: Please quit calling me Okie. I know that you use it in derision. Only my friends call me that.

As you are well aware recent comments by the both of us were censored because I answered your name calling with an equally derisive word. They should have been stricken.

I believe that you feel you are one up on me because you can still say Okie, Okie, Okie! Lay off.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 4:25 PM

NanaDot refers to Rep, Scott. As far as Scott and swastikas, here's this little analysis that questions the veracity of his allegations.

http://tinyurl.com/q29pzd

"Democratic Rep. David Scott of Atlanta yelled at one of his constituents, a urologist, who had the audacity to ask Scott about his support for Obamacare. Yesterday, CNN had a segment featuring Scott and the urologist, and Scott didn't come out looking too good."

"Of course sometimes "hate crimes" are real (for example, this spring a College Democrat desecrated crosses at George Washington University with graffiti and condoms). It's possible that a neo-Nazi actually vandalized Rep. Scott's offices. But given the fact that the Nazi imagery so neatly dovetails with the left's smearing of health-care protesters as fascists, isn't it more likely that this act of vandalism was committed by one of Scott's supporters?"

Regarding NewAcross' very patronizing, ad hominem attack on my person, "democratic" many very well be aptly applied to the North Korean government, if American, "democratic," apparatchiks continue moving us forcefully toward Marxist/socialist policies and the tyrannical style of government Obama is foisting on America.

I may well have some trouble remembering all the good things taught to me at Orearville, R-IV. It has been a very long time. But be assured, I did not end my education there. I find some lessons learned on the Orearville playground of particular value, when confronting the Alinsky-esque tactics of democrat party radicals.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 4:21 PM

So...Ray...

...remember way back in grade school when they taught us not to judge a book by its title?

Do you also believe North Korea is a democratic republic just because those words appear in the official name of the country?

-- Posted by news across on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 3:54 PM

#1 I have no idea who Bill is so stop referring to me in connection with Bill, whoever he is.

#2 You failed to mention (or post) how Scott shut down the reasonable, free expression of a medical doctor at his townhall meeting with Scott's intolerant rant. http://tinyurl.com/kkwaya

ObamaCare is just one more abomination being foisted on Americans by the radical socialist agenda of Barack Obama. Why would anyone entrust any health care decisions to a party that has historically, wholeheartedly embraced a culture of death through the deaths of over 40, 000, 000 unborn children over 4 decades?

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 3:52 PM

"Here is another blatant Nazi tactic of the moronic thugs disrupting the congressional "town halls"."

Oklahoma Reader uses the term "Nazi" in his post and apparently The Democrat News doesn't mind. The term "Nazi" is an acronym using the first two letters from the two, WWII, German party words "Nationalsozialistische" or "National Socialist." I've even seen a WWII era medallion of "the people's Car" (Volkswagon), with a big swastika over it. Now let's see who has recently nationalized some car companies, banks, insurance companies, and wants to nationalize health care??? Wow, talk about "Nazi tactics." Don't get me started on all the thuggish "Nazi tactics" I've personally seen exercised by west coast Marx-o-centric groups (California Democrat voters). The examples are far worse than anything that's occurred in recent townhall meetings. It appears some people are just fed up with the thuggish tactics they've been bullied with by the left and are starting to adopt them (fair for the goose/fair for the gander). However, maybe the people at those town hall meetings (using those thuggish tactics) are just former Obama Dem's. fed up with proposed ObamaCare, using tactics they've used before.

-- Posted by Ray on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 3:25 PM

Newt Gingrich Changes What's Left of his Mind on End-of-life Care:

Matt Taibbi

http://trueslant.com/matttaibbi/2009/08/...

-- Posted by news across on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 2:50 PM

Stephen Hawking: "I would not be alive without the NHS."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnew...

-- Posted by news across on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 2:20 PM

I think a lot of People are like little Puppies that have been beaten, they keep crawling back to the ones who beat them! So it fits, that a lot of us are too Ignorant to be Governed! That's Sad,they won't wake up soon enough to make things better!

-- Posted by Jo on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 12:57 PM

Here is another blatant Nazi tactic of the moronic thugs disrupting the congressional "town halls". http://news.aol.com/article/congressman-...

KEEP YOUR PRIVATE COVERAGE. LET THE REST OF US HAVE OUR PUBLIC COVERAGE. ITS A FREEDOM ISSUE.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 11:46 AM

And one other thing Clarence.

Yes Daddy?

Please just tone it down for awhile...please? I'll double your allowance to make it easier.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 10:35 AM

Act 2, Scene 1, Government to Corporatists:

Clarence, come down here!

I'm busy, Daddy. (Clarence is diligently working at bilking the American Taxpayer)

CLARENCE! You get down here now!

(Clarence comes into the room, dressed in designer everything)

Yes, Daddy?

Clarence, you HAVE to behave! You're making Daddy look bad.

Okay, Daddy! (Clarence ignores the scolding and returns to his former ways)

* * * * * ** * * * * * *

Scolding won't get it done, not when the incentive to be crooked outweighs the punishment.

I wonder why anyone would expect the corporate heads to change their evil ways when they see the Wall Street crooks going scot free?

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 9:51 AM

Corporate Media Talking Point: Gun owners are domestic terrorists..

The establishment media and the Southern Poverty Law Center are again floating the talking point that militia groups and worried gun owners are growing in the United States and that this could portend a violent act of domestic terror, despite the fact that every major domestic terror attack in the 1990's was carried out by the federal government itself, from Ruby Ridge, to Waco, to the Oklahoma City bombing.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/media-floats...

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 9:34 AM

Media: Gun owners are domestic terrorists..

http://www.infowars.com/media-floats-tal...

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 9:29 AM

Time for Tavis Smiley. Adios, amigos!

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 12:09 AM

YIPPEEEEEEEEEE!!! IT'S MITTWOCH!!!!!!!!

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 12, 2009, at 12:01 AM

I have to admit that I've been pretty lax in keepig up with events, but it seems that TurncoatArmada.org is moving against Obama.gov in sinister and malevolent ways.

I believe it would be the best show if all the people occupying the lower-lower, middle-lower, upper-lower, lower-middle, middle-middle, and upper-middle classes of our socioeconomic caste system would band together and DEMAND a new attitude from everyone elected or appointed to some position in Washington.

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 11:53 PM

Hi ND...good to see you again. I was just off reading your Huffington link, trying to learn a little something. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 11:37 PM

Good Evening, Nightowls :) (forget the pun)

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 11:25 PM

Under Obamacare, The Government Would Indoctrinate Your Kids

Chuck Norris slams Stalinist "home intrusion and indoctrination" program

http://www.prisonplanet.com/under-obamac...

Dirty Secret No. 1 in Obamacare

by Chuck Norris

http://townhall.com/columnists/ChuckNorr...

-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 5:07 PM

JO, about your MD, here's info from a membership study. Since I can't just give you the link due to password protection, here's the gist of the studies.

Zinc and Antioxidants

A single solid study suggests that zinc, or a mixture of zinc and antioxidants can prevent or slow the progression of early macular degeneration. However it is not clear whether the antioxidant portion of this mixture added any additional benefit.

This double-blind, placebo-controlled trial evaluated the effects of zinc with or without antioxidants on macular degeneration in 3,640 individuals in the early stage of the disease.1 Participants were randomly assigned to receive one of the following treatments: antioxidants ( vitamin C at 500 mg, vitamin E at 400 IU, and beta-carotene at 15 mg), zinc (80 mg) and copper (2 mg), antioxidants plus zinc, or placebo. The results indicate that zinc alone or zinc plus antioxidants, significantly slowed the progression of the disease.

Note: Zinc at doses of 80 mg and higher daily can be harmful. One of the problems is that high-dose zinc supplementation impairs copper absorption. That's why extra copper was provided in the study described above. However, there may be other risks as well. Physician supervision is advised. For other dosage and safety issues, see the full Zinc article

Further parts of the study "suggested", since no double blind studies completed yet, that bilberry, lutein and zeaxanthin stopped or cured MD. Good luck. WT

-- Posted by White Tornado on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 3:53 PM

I just witnessed a young mother/baby sitter pulling one young baby/child in a bicycle child tow cart while at least three or four other young children road through the streets on the square feverishly trying to keep up BEHIND her on their own bicycles. All of these children were under 10 years of age! Where are the police? It is an absolute wonder that no one was hurt.

Several times during the summer, bicyclist have been riding accross the square in and out of traffic. Sometimes they will ride on the sidewalks going very fast and not stopping at the corners. Pedestrians walking out of a business can be seriously injured. Who will be at fault, the business owner or the cyclist riding where he should not be? When a car pulls up at a corner to come up onto the square, someone is going to get hit. Who will be at fault, the car driver cautiously approaching the square or the bicyclist who is riding where he should not be? And it is not always a child! More times than not the person is 15 years old and up!

Riding on the square after 6:00 in the evening is not really an issue! The square is pretty isolated at that time.

Parents and children, please tell your friends, your kids, and everyone that the square is supposed to be off limits to riding bicycles for up to a block off of the square. Please, walk your bike during business hours. It is for your safety as well as the safety of others.

If something is not done, someone will get hurt!

Kudos to the children and parents that do actually walk their bikes responsibly on the square during business hours. At least you know and abide by the rules and practice safe measures!

-- Posted by farmer'sgranddaughter on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 2:54 PM

If you want to be monitored by the government here you go.

Click on the link and watch this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWs12ccbO...

-- Posted by Maynard G Krebbs on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 12:33 PM

What was the question?

{"the government takeover of everything" is inaccurate, misleading and emotionally manipulative. Absolutes (everything/nothing; always/never, etc) are seldom true, and usually false. Nor does it address the question.}

-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 11:44 AM

People probably ARE wrong to call the government takeover of everything, socialism, when the correct term is more likely fascism.

-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 10:37 AM

http://saline.mogenweb.org/

I have posted several penny postcard views of Saline county views. Select the Penny Postcard link on the right.

Email me if you have questions about any of the views or pose your question here.

If any reader has additional penny postcard views of Saline county, please scan and send to Kris Marshall the coordinator or to me.

Enjoy

Craig Hubbard

-- Posted by ceh_meh@verizon.net on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 10:23 AM

Care to explain that?

-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 9:02 AM

Third Child,

You should be ashamed of yourself too.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 8:09 AM

The sleeping giant awakens..

Video Coverage of Obamacare Protests Around the Country

http://www.infowars.com/video-coverage-o...

-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 7:56 AM

aikman8

The reason I asked about McCain in the context of birth certificates is because he wasn't born on US soil. It all depends on how techincal someone wants to get on the subject.

This stupid mess with Obama? Which mess? The fact that he wants everyone to have affordable healthcare? Even you. Or are you talking about the absolute disaster the he inherited and now is tasked with fixing? You and all the other GOP lemmings should be ashamed of yourselves. I don't know what is worse. Whether it's that you actually believe the party pablum that you are spoon fed or that you do know it's all B.S. and just don't care. Either way it's shameful.

I've seen what your party has brought us. Now it's the other guy's turn. Why don't you give them a fair chance and quit being such a childish sore loser.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 7:15 AM

Slater, the Derby station was just to the north of where the A & W was.

-- Posted by SalineNative on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 7:08 AM

Slater the Derby Station was south of the 65 Drive In, on the same side of the road.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 1:59 AM

what the F .. how would we feel if mccain had been elected? i'll tell you how i'd feel ....... MUCH BETTER!

granted, mccain wasn't the best candidate, didn't really want to vote for him, but we sure as hell wouldn't have this stupid mess we have now with obama, the rookie president-in-training and the un-american pelosi staff, and his thugsters going out all over the place. they seem to just be stepping in it all over the place! inexperienced, and not ready for prime time prez we have.

c'mon people, WAKE UP to what is going on. as a long-time republican and middle of the road conservative, i long for the days of bill clinton and even hillary ... she would have been much better than the arse we have in the white house now.

-- Posted by aikman8 on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 1:59 AM

Slater you wrote "What would you think if I said I believe the American people are too well off, on average, for either of the two equalization issues you raised to ever happen?".

I think I would first say to you that you are on to something, and that you should read Joe Bageant's book "Deer Hunting with Jesus" which deals with the subject in a cogent manner.

Then I would say to you my friend that one of the reasons that you are correct is as follows. Though there are many people barely making it, or not making it at all, most of them aspire to do better. As they aspire they look to those a step ahead of themselves for inspiration. That second group in turn looks ahead for inspiration to the supervisors, the foremen,etc. That third group is where the middle class begins, and they are relatively comfortable. That group get their inspiration from their economic superiors. That fourth group is the one that preachs the corporatist doctrine, that private enterprise should be unregulated, that we have the best health care in the world, Fox News gets it right, unions are bad, ad nauseum. They do so because they also aspire, and know where their bread is buttered. Then those positions descend quickly until every body is touting the company line, even when it is not to there personal advantage.

Now many people in the middle class are becoming economically more uncomfortable, and see middle class people cratering all around them. That reinforces their believe that they must tout corporatist doctrine even harder because they fear rocking the boat now more than ever before in their lifetime. At the very least they keep their mouths shut. So the same old corporatist mantra continues to be repeated. Because of fear, greed, and lack of concern for society as a whole, counter messages are usually ignored, if even stated. Most know something is wrong, how could they not, but the messages murmured up, and down the line remain the same. People go on living lives of quiet desperation, occasionally lashing out, usually in the direction the corporatists point them toward. It is a mess.

So,(finally) I believe it is not that all the American people are too well off to ever implement those changes, but that those who directly influence the rest are all too well off for it to happen.

Old geezers like us don't count because we are not on the factory floor any more. This all sounds bleak, but believe it or not I have faint hope that change may occur.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 1:50 AM

I was just now remembering a farmer who lived out north of Slater (Joe Martin), and who raised some of the tastiest watermelons you'd ever want to eat. Made even tastier by the unlawful acquisition of a few straight from the patch. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 12:38 AM

Upsedaisy I have not read Timothy Egan's book. However, before I replied regarding it, I did go to the publisher's web site, and read several reviews. It sounds interesting, and I am going to put it on my list to read.

I don't know about you, but I find as I get older it takes me longer to read a good book. I hope, and believe it is because I ponder things more than when I was less experienced, or should I say I have more reference points that I must consider. Still there is that nagging doubt, that it is simply that my powers of concentration are diminishing.

NanaDot as they say down here wherebouts did yer kin settle in the territory? Was they Sooners or Boomers?

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 12:34 AM

OKR, where was that Derby station relative to the 65 Drive In? I can't get it fized in my mind.

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 12:24 AM

I'm not exactly certain how this tune fits into my current feeling that the Prez is punking us, but at least it conjured up a few memories. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8RVamiwA...

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 12:21 AM

OKR,

What would you think if I said I believe the American people are too well off, on average, for either of the two equalization issues you raised to ever happen?

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 11, 2009, at 12:08 AM

NanaDot and upsedaisy. Thank you both for your defense of "Okies", a name which some hurl to disparage, out of ignorance in my opinion.

Your decision to publically honor your genetic connections to Okies destroys the lie, for you are both elegant, intelligent people.

I suppose though that in some quarters you will be considered to have outed yourselves. ;)

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 11:58 PM

Is anyone reading about Windows 7? I'm wondering if it'll be a big step away from Vista in terms of quirky behaviors.

DO

-- Posted by Slater on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 11:41 PM

Oklahoma Reader, You can wear the term "Okie" with honor.

Have you read Timothy Egan's book (2005) on "The Worst Hard Time"? I remember visiting my father's cousin at their "ranch" near Pryor, OK. in the summer of 1941. The cabin was spotless, the feather beds soothing to car weary travelers (my Dad thought 500 miles a day was about right). The country ham in the morning was melt in the mouth. Fine hardworking people. There were families who went out to CA from many central states to earn money to purchase family farms lost during the depression. Others worked in mills and on the Missouri and Mississippi Rivers to earn enough money to pay the taxes on the farms.

Those people survived The Great Depression. The current mess isn't close.

-- Posted by upsedaisy on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 8:57 PM

Your right, it is Particia's , my mistake. Well that's just the stuff I'm hearing but I have no idea if it's true or not.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 8:36 PM

To the best of my knowledge Hustler's is still under the same owners. I thought it was Patricia's that owned the property? I could be wrong. I haven't heard the rumor about them building new...but it could be true.

-- Posted by Scarpetta on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 7:16 PM

The PBS affiliate here in San Antonio offers this program tonight. I have to conclude that you get yours from KCPT in Kansas City, and I didn't look at its lineup to see how it differs from this one here. I suppose a certain amount of the programming is regional, but this one would most likely be something broadcast to America.

Program Description

DOCUMENTING THE FACE OF AMERICA tells the inspirational "behind the lens" stories from some of the most celebrated photographers in history. Narrated by Julian Bond, the program highlights the forgotten collective pieces of our past. This story celebrates the courage and vision of legendary photographers and artists such as Dorothea Lange, Walker Evans, Gordon Parks, Marion Post Wolcott, Russell Lee and others who worked with the U.S. government under the unorthodox leadership of Roy Stryker from 1935 to 1943. Together they changed the course of photography, but more important, changed history, as Americans saw what life was like across the nation for the first time -- from North to South, from East to West, for rich and poor and for black and white.

-- Posted by Slater on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 6:18 PM

Good question Scarpetta,

I had heard that Hustler's had changed hands but then I heard that it closed because Prenger's owns the building and they plan raze it and build a new one. Anyone out there know the scoop?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 5:23 PM

Ok, since Family Dollar has closed up...what will happen to the structure? Will it be abandoned and left to rot like the rest of the building? Up side it matches the other eyes sores in the area.

-- Posted by Scarpetta on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 5:16 PM

Dear Obstructionist Lemmings,

I am sorry that the election of an intelligent black man to the position of president of the United States causes you so much anguish.

Life was so much easier when the president brought us things like WMD's, Sadam Husseins' Al-Queida links, de-regulation of banking, "Mission Accomplished", "Axis-of-Evil", "Swift Boat Veterans for Truth", CIA death squads, Secret Prisions, warrantless wiretaps, and other such over reaching and ill concieved policies.

And after all, things are so much easier to accomplish when 35% of the voters will swallow anything that Cheney, or Coulter, or Limbaugh spew.

I'll bet you folks really miss the good old days, its no wonder ya'll are so cranky. I'd keep cooking up more of those red herrings and keep shouting uninformed opinion as loud as possible. I reckon that'll get this thing turned around.

-- Posted by countryman on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 4:57 PM

Third Child,

I support the President.

The Birther nonsense, the teabagger nonsense, the conservative disruptions of our townhall meetins nonsense, all of it is a waste of time and effort.

The neocon/conservative/Republican/Libertarians, or what ever they are calling themselves today, somehow think their phony "issues" are going to make us forget that if was they...the same neocons/conservatives/Republicans/Libertarians, or what ever they are calling themselves today, that brought us 2 unfinished wars...one based enitrely on lies from their side of the aisle, torture, the spite of the rest of the World, a bankrupt economy with skyrocketing unemployment and failing banks, secret government, spying on good, law abiding American citizens in violation of our laws, the so-called Patriot Act which severely reduced some of our civil liberties...and now they would like to tell us everything is just hunky dory with our current health care system. Yeah...the insurance companies are our friends...not!!

Our memories are just not that short. We know who these folks are and what they did to us when they were in power. Things may not be perfect under the Democrats...but we sure aren't going to be turning over our Government over to the bad guys who caused these problems in the first place any time soon.

This independent voter will be voting straight Democrat ticket in 2010...thank you very much.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 3:35 PM

This whole "crisis" could be difused by the person in question, but he either can't or won't. When I first heard about it I didn't pay any attention to it, but as it lingers I'm wondering why the President is letting it go on if in fact he could prove the birthers wrong, once and for all and move past the issue.

-- Posted by outsider on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 2:59 PM

Religious Leaders for 9/11 Truth http://rl911truth.org

-- Posted by Third Child on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 12:56 PM

Can someone explain what is going here with the Health Dept "obtaining real estate through USDA"?

"The board of Saline Public Health Fund, a nonprofit foundation associated with the Saline County Health Department, will hold a public meeting Monday, Aug. 10, at 6:30 p.m. to discuss obtaining real estate through USDA.

The meeting will be held at the health department office, 1825 S. Atchison Ave. in Marshall."

-- Posted by Third Child on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 11:27 AM

Third Child,

How would you feel if John McCain had been elected?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 10:21 AM

NB,

With so little time remaining before the start of the new school year, it sounds as if you have plenty to keep you busy between now and then. Isn't it odd how those honey-do lists have a way of being ignored? :)

You've made an interesting color choice for the picnic tables. I wonder how many will notice. Too bad none of the friends who've expressed concern about you climbing the ladder haven't volunteered to get up there and do the painting for you.

So far I haven't had any success locating old photos taken inside the store, but I'm not through asking everyone.

I wish you success with the campaign for the free tin to put up on the ceiling. Maybe even a little design of some sort in it as well? :)

-- Posted by Slater on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 9:11 AM

News, when you're worthy of being on a debate team, I'll let you know.

In the meantime, why don't you take up politics? You have plenty of hot air for it.

-- Posted by Slater on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 8:41 AM

Oklahoma Reader

Its definitely going to be a tough decision. I was leaning Palin but now I think I am swinging over to Orley. Either way I am sure they will be a real winner.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 3:25 AM

It is beginning to look like the Republican Party is going to have a real horse race for the party's 20012 presidential nominee.

It is going to be hard to pick a winner with Orly Taitz, and Sarah Palin both cranking out those zany comments that the residue that used to be the Republican party love to see, and hear.

It looks for the moment as if Orly is first out of the gate, and leading by a mouth. http://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Orly-T...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 1:15 AM

News across,

Ok...you win! Maybe not with Slater...but I'm getting too sleepy to be your next debater! Ha! Maybe tomorrow...

Good night all!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 12:46 AM

A draw?!

Even in a horse race there is a loser and a winner.

My horse not only passed slater but kicked up a bunch of dust as it roared by.

-- Posted by news across on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 12:36 AM

News across,

I'd call it a draw...:)!

That would be "the Fair Go".

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 12:20 AM

Slater, I agree. It saddens me.

I was hoping that even against terrible odds that President Obama could make a difference. However, it appears to me his cautious nature is working against him. I wish he had just gone for broke, but that is not his persona. He didn't have much of a chance anyway. Its hard to sway a congress whose pockets are stuffed full of corporatist dollars.

I am now of the firm opinion that two unlikely things must happen for our people to ever get an even break, and they must happen in sequence.

First, we must get campaign costs removed from private financing, corporatists, unions, the entire spectrum. The cost of presidential, and congressional campaigns must be federally financed with reasonable limits. Included in that package it will be necessary to shorten the campaign period. It will also be necessary that the television networks as a public service donate real time to all the viable candidates, with no more of the slick nasty little ads. After all we aren't buying tooth paste, or a pill for ED here, this is serious.

Once that is done we need to curtail the advantages given to the "corporate citizen", and at least restore to equity with corporate, the rights of flesh and blood citizens.

Only when this occurs, if ever, will we become the federal republic that was intended by our founding fathers, and the one to which true patriots still aspire.

Sure, it will cost tax payer dollars for this to occur. No price is too high for liberty, and equality.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 12:16 AM

Slater,

Ok....but a head butt may be a little extreme!

Yep, I've been working at painting the picnic tables a fabulous purple and gold. Also have the long bench out front to paint. Have been trying to get the hubby to pay attention to that old honey-do list, but alas, I have failed! HA! Windows on the second floor need painting. Am tempted to do it myself, however, a few dozen friends and family as well as my physician have warned me not to climb a ladder. What's up with that? Fall off one, just once...oh well. It's just as well he hasn't done it as he hates to paint, therefore, he's extremely sloppy about it.

Have to dust down everything in the kitchen and buy some groceries and then we'll be ready to go. Opening the 19th, the day before school starts. Am going to extend my hours for breakfast and early dinners for the community. Guess we'll see how that goes. Tried it before and it just didn't work. Most of the people are dead set that this is "for the kids". But am going to try again.

Had a barn half blow away on the farm and tried to get the tin to put up on the ceiling, however, it was painted with old lead paint, chipping and peeling, so that didn't happen. Am going to contact an old friend who is in the sheet metal business and ask for an estimate. Darn the luck! Sure would have been nice for a freebie :).

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Mon, Aug 10, 2009, at 12:08 AM

HA HA HA HA!!!!!!!!!!! Oh sure!

-- Posted by Slater on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 11:59 PM

NB...

I kicked slater's rear mate...figuratively speaking of course.

Next debater step on up.

-- Posted by news across on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 11:57 PM

OKR,

Yes, as much as I dislike the possibility, I believe we're being punked.

-- Posted by Slater on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 11:43 PM

NB,

I'm smiling sheepishly as I write this. Ordinarily I wouldn't have gotten into anything like this, but I did, not to start an argument but to point out an error.

News and I aren't ad odds as far as I'm concerned. It was a discussion carried on in a normal tone, and now we're done, at least I'm done with it.

I must apologize if we've alarmed you, or if you feel that I've put you in the middle of this, which certainly wasn't my intention.

I'll meet News out in the street and we'll do a head butt. :)

Are you gearing up for the start of school?

-- Posted by Slater on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 11:27 PM

Slater & Newsacross:

Whoa! This isn't your usual friendly banter. If I had known the commotion that my answer to Closelook would cause, I would probably not have answered. Maybe if I had let it pass by, it might not have drawn such attention.

But now that we're all discussing this alleged situation...It is generally the School Board that is lacking the information about out of district residents 'cheating', so to speak, about their residential status, so they can go to school in Marshall. I merely think that if closelook has the proof, present it to the school board and let them deal with it! If they do not deal with it, then follow due process.

I note that closelook has not entered anymore comments, so perhaps her/his energy is spent on the subject, as we are carrying the torch for him or her.

With that being said...do you think we can put this to rest, at least until school actually starts? Why get soooo wound up before the school year begins and see if the situation even exists during the upcoming school year. Is that fair enough?

Now please, you two thoroughly enjoyable fellas do a fist bump and make up!

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 10:52 PM

Is Obama Punking Us? Of interest to liberals, and conservatives.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/09/opinio...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 10:15 PM

News, the only blame you need to accept is in not focusing on what Closelook was asking. (S)he included superfluous information which tended to distort the intent of the post, and you got hung up on that extraneous commentary.

I'm pleased that you value your "Fair Go," and I'd guess that Closelook feels the same. After all, that's the way it's supposed to work. Wheter is does in all cases is a matter for another time.

You and I are going back and forth on this, and it's my suspicion that Closelook doesn't care one way or the other what either of us thinks.

The critter is here wanting her bedtime snack, so I'm off to tend to that. What did you decide about the pig? :)

-- Posted by Slater on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 9:34 PM

Well Slater

I guess you could blame me and the Aussies for my attitude.

Here they have a concept known as "the Fair Go." Its a basic sense of being as fair as possible. I think you will also find this same basic concept echoed throughout our American history as well.

I make no apologies for expecting close to approach any research or investigation objectively, fairly, and responsibly and to present at least some evidence before pointing fingers in any one direction. Instead he made generalized allegations that point to the Marshall School system and ultimately to people who are in responsible positions...with not one shread of evidence of any violation...no probable cause...no reasonable suspicion...just his hunch,...apparently.

-- Posted by news across on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 7:42 PM

News, I didn't know you're the appointed spokesperson for the school board.

You can argue your perception all day long, but the point of our discussion is merely a matter of reading comprehension.

-- Posted by Slater on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 6:54 PM

Actually Slater,

His words speak for themselves and reckless allegations can damage the reputations of innocent people.

I stand by my statements.

-- Posted by news across on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 6:30 PM

How many times have you seen posts like that one on this forum? Most everyone can be inclined to make strong statements which may not have merit once the dust has settled. You have no way of knowing what facts Closelook possesses, and your "advice" is as reckless as the statement made by Closelook. Only time will tell if there's substance to the assertion. The point of the post, however, was to gain information about where to find the text of the pertinent school policy. That's the technical analysis of the statements.

You're making what I would call a mountain out of a mole hill. It's as simple as that.

-- Posted by Slater on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 6:17 PM

Well slater lets look at what was actually said:

In his comments closelook says "Taxpayers should be enraged by this lack of enforcement by the school district."

What lack of enforcement slater? What lack of enforcment closelook?

Further, closelook says, "I understand the school has a policy which is not being followed allowing students who do not meet the residency requirment to attend Marshall Public Schools without paying tuition."

What specific case does he site? He is clearly making an absolute charge that the school is not following policy? Where is his evidence? What were the details of the violation9s0 he allegeds to have occured? Which policy has been violated and how does the alleged behavior by the school violate the policy?

He is making allegations without question and its his words not mine. Yet he offers absolutely not one shread of evidence or a single detail. In fact, when he made these charges he, by his own admission, had no idea what the Marshall School Board's policies even were.

I guess we liberals are old fashioned but we still believe a defendant is innocent of all charges...no matter how fuzzy and empty the charges may be...until the defendant is proven guilty in a court of law.

-- Posted by news across on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 4:53 PM

Third Child

I realize that to many of you republicans/conservative/neoconservative/libertarians a defendant is guilty until proven innocent (see most of the prisoners at Gitmo and some Americans arrested in the USA such as Jose Padilla for more on this).

However, our entire jurisprudence system assumes potential defendants, such as the Marshall School Board would be if there were actually charges against them (and even before charges exist) (of which there aren't any), are INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY.

I guess we liberals are just old fashioned...we insist that such long-held American traditions continue.

-- Posted by news across on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 4:39 PM

News, what I read was Closelook asking for help to locate the written policies on the school Web site, and NB provided that help, along with a cautionary note about the workings of the school board, the need to have clear and concise documentation, and that protocol must be followed when filing formal complaints.

I don't see where Closelook was leading "US" to conclude anything other than what was asked, and, as we all know, NB answered Closelook's question.

I believe you've been wrestling with TC too much. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 12:59 PM

Obama's signing statements look a lot like Bush signing statements..

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/09/us/pol...

Obama's broken campaign promise on signing statements

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vAquUSGq...

-- Posted by Third Child on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 8:46 AM

News, what kind of evidence do you possess to come to your "logical conclusion" that there are no residency problems in the school system? Are you clairvoyant or something?

-- Posted by Third Child on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 8:29 AM

So much for the fake Kenyan birth certificate Birthers. Got anything else?

http://www.examiner.com/x-12767-US-Headl...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Aug 9, 2009, at 12:45 AM

Well slater the problems with close's approach is that he seems to have already made up his mind that indeed violations exist. Yet he has no evidence of such...none...or at least he certaily writes his comments in such away to lead us to no other logical conclusion. An objective approach might be a little fairer to everyone.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Aug 8, 2009, at 11:19 PM

News, if Closelook wants to determine if the district is in violation of any policies, I believe it's up to Closelook to investigate. If I remember the post correctly, Closelook asked where to find the text of the policies and not for arbitrary interpretations of same.

-- Posted by Slater on Sat, Aug 8, 2009, at 4:19 PM

closelook,

When did you establish that the Marshall School district is violating their own policy? I followed the link and read their policy and from what I can see they are following their policy to the T.

Surely you didn't think you were going to create the appearance of a conflict where one does not actually exist?

Both your statements and your charges appear to be without evidence and/or merit. This places your motivation in a highly suspicious position.

-- Posted by news across on Sat, Aug 8, 2009, at 3:59 PM

ND: Did, passed it on.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sat, Aug 8, 2009, at 1:16 PM

Closelook,

Answering your last two questions, probably both.

Answering the first question, what to do about it? It's been going on, and on...for many, many years. One trick of out of district students who have relatives in the Marshall school district is to simply give the relative's address as their place of residence, and so it goes....

Be aware you would be going up against an influential (I have contacts and it's not who you are, it's who you know); good ole' boys club; you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours; system that has been in place forever.

My only suggestion is to register a formal complaint with the school board, but absolutely have solid evidence to back up the allegations. Assuming nothing will be done about it, and you do have solid evidence, write a letter to the editor of the newspaper to make the situation known and to possibly garner support of the taxpayers. If nothing is done about it, contact your district representatives, and finally register a complaint with the State Board of Education. Make sure you follow due process and...like I said earlier, absolutely have the evidence to back it up. NB.

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Sat, Aug 8, 2009, at 11:26 AM

Thanks nouveaublogger

Now how do we get school administration to follow the policy? Taxpayers should be enraged by this lack of enforcement by the school district. Is this costing the taxpayers or does it allow the school to gain more federal dollars?

-- Posted by closelook on Sat, Aug 8, 2009, at 8:02 AM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
closelook: Just curious -- how do you know the district is not following the policy? Have you called district officials to ask about it?

A humorous jab at the blue dog democrats.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/dis...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sat, Aug 8, 2009, at 3:52 AM

NewsAcross, How fortunate you are to have a rapport with Joe Bageant's son....especially since he is a chip off the old block.

My wife, and I read "Deer Hunting With Jesus" (paperback edition), and then began passing it around. I was surprised to find that some of my liberal friends were not interested in the underpinnings of the successful right wing strangle hold on the perceptions of blue collar America. I was disappointed that some of them did not even read the later chapters that deal with the middle class inertia, "go along to get along", or "it's not my ox being gored". Oh well.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sat, Aug 8, 2009, at 3:15 AM

Closelook,

Go to marshallschools.com, click on Central Administration, bottom of the page, click on Marshall Board of Education, Policies Online. Next, click on section J, (Students). Going down the list, click on JECB, admission of nonresident students. This defines the policies of the school district about the nonresident student. Hope this helps. NB.

-- Posted by nouveaublogger on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 9:04 PM

Does anyone know if there is a policy for nonresident students attending Marshall schools? I understand the school has a policy which is not being followed allowing students who do not meet the residency requirment to attend Marshall Public Schools without paying tuition. As a taxpayer I want to know the policy and if it is being enforced.

-- Posted by closelook on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 7:54 PM

Gal66,

I'm laughing and laughing at the 2019 headlines! Thanks for posting.

-- Posted by Slater on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 6:24 PM

Sorry didn't mean to double dip!

-- Posted by litlmissme on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 4:59 PM

Kathy can you post again the link to the sales tax holiday, which counties and citys not participating? Thanks!

-- Posted by litlmissme on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 4:57 PM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
Here you go:

http://dor.mo.gov/tax/business/sales/tax...

On the contrary TC,

FOX "news" is a huge issue.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 3:15 PM

The information is about brownshirt thugery. The Fox news clip is not the issue. Did you read the article?

http://www.infowars.com/obama-connected-...

Here is the link to the free speech bullies: http://healthcareforamericanow.org/site/...

-- Posted by Third Child on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 2:19 PM

TC,

Do you expect us to give any creedence to anything said by any FOX news outlet? Your outrage over flouride may be misdirected.You should save some for Rupert Murdoch.

-- Posted by What the f...... on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 1:50 PM

Obama Connected Group Calls for Brownshirt Tactics Against Healthcare Opponents

http://www.infowars.com/obama-connected-...

#7.Collect signs and leaflets that are not provided by you or your organization. Another way to limit protesters' ability to hijack your event is to confiscate signs or leaflets that they may bring into the venue from outside. The best way to do this is to make a blanket rule that no one can bring signs or leaflets and to advertise this fact as you do turn out in the weeks preceding the event. You can distribute your own signs in the event and offer them one as they enter if you choose to allow them to enter.

#8.Assign people to greet the media and to stay close to reporters both as they enter and leave the event. It's important that you take away right-wingers opportunities to talk with reporters by making sure that your staff or leaders are in constant contact with the media who attend. You should set up a special table or area for the press to sit during the event and that area should be close t the stage and away from any areas of the venue where protesters may gather. Also make sure you have materials ready for the reporters so that they know the purpose and message of the event.

-- Posted by Third Child on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 1:27 PM

Are these fake protesters?

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/dpp/news/loc...

-- Posted by Third Child on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 12:10 PM

HEADLINES FROM THE YEAR: 2019

Ozone created by electric cars now killing millions in the seventh largest country in the world, Mexifornia, formerly known as California.

White minorities still trying to have English recognized as Mexifornia's third language.

Spotted Owl plague threatens northwestern United States crops and livestock.

Baby conceived naturally! Scientists stumped.

Couple petitions court to reinstate heterosexual marriage.

Iran still closed off; physicists estimate it will take at least 10 more years before radioactivity decreases to safe levels.

France pleads for global help after being taken over by Lichtenstein. No other country comes forward to help the beleaguered nation!

Castro finally dies at age 112; Cuban cigars can now be imported legally, but President Chelsea Clinton has banned all smoking....

George Z. Bush says he will run for President in 2026.

Postal Service raises price of first class stamp to $17.89 and reduces mail delivery to Wednesdays only...

85-year $75.8 billion study: Diet and exercise is the key to weight loss.

Average weight of Americans drops to 250 lbs.

Global cooling blamed for citrus crop failure for third consecutive year in Mexifornia and Floruba.

Japanese scientists have created a camera with such a fast shutter speed they now can photograph a woman with her mouth shut.

Abortion clinics now available in every High School in United States

Senate still blocking drilling in ANWAR even though gas is selling for 4532 Pesos per liter and gas stations are only open on Tuesdays and Fridays.

Massachusetts

executes last remaining conservative.

Supreme Court rules punishment of criminals violates their civil rights.

Average height of NBA players is now nine feet, seven inches.

New federal law requires that all nail clippers, screwdrivers, fly swatters and rolled-up newspapers must be registered by January 2020.

IRS sets lowest tax rate at 75 percent.

Floruba voters still having trouble with voting machines.

________________________________________

-- Posted by Gal66 on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 11:45 AM

aikman8: I just sent an email to Mr. Skelton, using the regular zip for this area, without the added four numbers, and it sailed right through. Try again. Persistence usually pays off.

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 7:43 AM

TC - the service area of Fitzgibbon Hospital extends over several counties with a population much larger than Marshall's.

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 6:19 AM

Oklahoma Reader

Thanks for posting that great link.

My wife Julie and I know Joe's son very well and have known him for quite a number of years now. He is just as brilliant as his Dad and is a heck of a good person. Naturally, he worships his Dad and if you ask him he would tell you that he is not half the man Joe is, but the truth is that talking with him is just like reading a chapter out of "Deer Hunting With Jesus"...entertaining and always leaves you with something deep to think about. We hope someday he will follow in his Dad's footsteps and write a book too. I guess its as the old saying goes...like father, like son. I could tell you a chatroom where Joe's son is a regular and I could tell you his chatname but he has asked us not to reveal that to people, so I will have to keep it to myself, but I really wish I could because Joe's son is a really unique individual who shares his Dad's sense of humor and wit...oh and he is a good lefty too.

-- Posted by news across on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 3:05 AM

Some of you are familiar with Joe Bageant, The author of "Deer Hunting With Jesus". I have enclosed a link to some thought provoking comments by Mr. Bageant. If you have the time explore his blog. There is a lot of "think outside the box" stuff.

http://www.joebageant.com/joe/2009/08/a-...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Fri, Aug 7, 2009, at 1:15 AM

http://www.marshallnews.com/story/140215...

"With over 700 new cases of cancer expected to be diagnosed in the Fitzgibbon service area each year, the Board of Trustees recognized the critical need for a cancer treatment here," he said. "A treatment center that would provide chemotherapy and radiation treatments."

A cancer causing poison is being added to the water. When is Marshall going to wake up?

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 11:43 PM

CLEARING THE AIR

There are those who might say that I have some hidden agenda in supporting a Public Health Care option for you folks. I don't, but there are some who might try to lead you, my fellow Americans, to think that.

And its easy to disprove such a notion.

I am an American citizen...born in Missouri to Parents who were born in Missouri to Grandparents also born in Missouri...and so on and so forth. However, I do not live in the United States and probably never will. I live in Australia, and whether or not the USA does the right thing and establishes an inexpensive Public Health insurance option which covers all Americans (despite any pre-existing conditions), it will never directly benefit me in any form or manner.

I will never carry any insurance in America. I don't need to. In Australia we have a public option we call "medicare." Yep, every single citizen and legal resident in Australia is covered. There is no insurance bill, no deductible, no co-payment, and we never receive a bill for medical care. Our medical care is top notch and Australians live longer than Americans as a result. In fact, Australian medical care is ranked 34th in the World while the United States is ranked 37th. Granted its not perfect. We are still working out some of the bugs in the system, and we are striving to reach number 1 with a long ways to go. In fact, we just expanded our socialized medicine to include basic dental as well. However despite the remaining imperfections, its as good or better than any medical care I ever received in the USA and no one in Australia is filing for bankruptcy due to medical bills...while in the USA 56% of all bankruptcies filed in 2008 were due primarily to medical bills folks simply could not afford to pay.

The system is simple here.

I picked my doctor from the phone book. I have always gotten in to see my doctor the same day I call to make the appointment...usually one hour after I call,... I see my doctor where only he and I have any say over my medical choices (no government permission is needed or desired nor is the Government informed of my choices, nor do they or can they interfere in my medical choices), and when I leave the doctors office I simply wave goodbye to the receptionist. There is no bill and money is never discussed. The longest I ever waited to see a specialist was 2 days...a heart specialist, and the longest I ever waited for major surgery was 1 week. Again, there was no charge, no co-pay, and no deductible.

You can find doctors in Australia who don't accept our medicare, but they are few and far between. If a person does not wish to use our socialized system, they are free to see one of those doctors that don't participate in the public option and pay out the rear for the same medical care they can get for free under our medicare system, and yes, there are some folks who do. So the choice to not use the public option is always there and available. You can also purchase insurance in Australia...if you want to...but I see no reason for it. Still, some folks do.

We pay for our socialized medicine through general taxes and my tax rate here is no higher than it was on a comparable income when I lived in the USA. Our economy in Australia is quite healthy...not perfect...yes we have some unemployment too...but we also still have more jobs than we can fill...so far. We aren't in a recession in Australia and the International Monetary Fund says we have the best economy in the World right now. So much for the notion that a pubic health care option will bankrupt the system.

We do have a relatively small budget deficit this year...but only because our Government issued a very successful stimulus tax rebate just to make sure we didn't get caught up in the American economic depression...and it worked. Prior to that we had a surplus in our treasury, and yes folks, we had troops in Iraq and Afghanistan too. However, our version of the Democrats (Labour Party) had the wisdom to pull all our troops out of Iraq and we are in the process of pulling all our troops out of Afghanistan as well.

I guess you could say that it would be easy for me to not really care one way or the other if America has a public option at all. However, I am an American, and I do care about my fellow Americans. I want you to have the same no-holds bared access to medical care that every other person in every modern, industrialized country in the World has (accept for the United States which is the only modern, industrialized nation without socialized medicine). I don't want a single American to go with out seeing a doctor when they need one just because they don't have insurance or money to pay the bill. I want all my fellow Americans to have easy and affordable access to medical care and without some big, rich, fat-cat insurance company finding some sneaky way to deny them the medical care they paid their premiums for and which they deserve.

My motivation is simple...I am an American and I care about my fellow Americans.

You folks now have an opportunity to catch up with the rest of the modern, industrialized World. Its up to you. You can keep getting royally ripped off and denied treatment by Big Insurance or you can move on into the 21st Century. Its up to you. But rest assured, if you don't get a public option now, you will probably never have another chance. Write or call your Congressional representative and your Senators now and demand that they give you the same public option the rich fat-cats enjoy...tell them to vote yes on the President's public health care reform act. Do it now before you lose the opportunity altogether...or universal access to good medical care may soon be nothing more than just a dream our Nation once had.

I wish you good folks the best of luck!

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 11:02 PM

funny how when you go to ike skelton's website, and click on send an email to ike, it asks for the nine digit zip code, i enter the zipcode, 65340-1327, and it keeps rejecting me.

hmmmmmmmmmmmmm. anyone else having this problem?

-- Posted by aikman8 on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 10:47 PM

Ike Skelton update:

I'm still waiting for Ike Skelton to explain how he could vote for a radical carbon tax scheme without even taking the time to read and understand what was in the bill. What a joke.

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 9:58 PM

Nazi-Style Denunciation Campaign Urges Americans To Report Each Other..

As America sinks into a military police state, it begins to parallel more and more aspects of Nazi Germany, especially in the context of citizens being turned against each other, which in turn creates a climate of fear and the constraining sense that one is always being watched.

One common misconception about Nazi Germany was that the police state was solely a creation of the authorities and that the citizens were merely victims. On the contrary, Gestapo files show that 80% of all Gestapo investigations were started in response to information provided by denunciations by "ordinary" Germans.

"There were relatively few secret police, and most were just processing the information coming in. I had found a shocking fact. It wasn't the secret police who were doing this wide-scale surveillance and hiding on every street corner. It was the ordinary German people who were informing on their neighbors," wrote Robert Gellately of Florida State University.

Gellately discovered that the people who informed on their neighbors were motivated primarily by banal factors -- "greed, jealousy, and petty differences," and not by a genuine concern about crime or insecurity.

Gellately "found cases of partners in business turning in associates to gain full ownership; jealous boyfriends informing on rival suitors; neighbors betraying entire families who chronically left shared bathrooms unclean or who occupied desirable apartments."

"And then there were those who informed because for the first time in their lives someone in authority would listen to them and value what they said."

http://www.infowars.com/nazi-style-denun...

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 9:46 PM

aikman8: Legislators aren't at all shy about letting us know where they will be. When we know, you'll know. If you'd rather not wait for us to publish the information, you can always visit the legislators' various Web sites:

Joe Aull - http://www.house.mo.gov/member.aspx?year...

Bill Stouffer - http://www.senate.mo.gov/09info/members/...

Ike Skelton - http://www.house.gov/skelton/

Kit Bond - http://bond.senate.gov/public/

Claire McCaskill - http://mccaskill.senate.gov/

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 9:24 PM

Take the blinders off. There was a hyperlink in first line of the article.

http://www.infowars.com/white-house-ask-...

"The posting warns against disinformation seeking to challenge the costly legislation, claiming that: "the President has consistently said that if you like your insurance plan, your doctor, or both, you will be able to keep them." And since when does the President do what he says? If he did, the wars would be over, people would have the promised 5 days to read pending legislation, Obama would not have used signing statements and his administration would have no lobbyists, etc., etc."

http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/Facts-Are...

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 9:16 PM

Dawson: Thanks...I did catch that...I was looking for references to "spying." Didn't see that...

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 9:14 PM

do any of our senators and congressmen have any townhall meetings scheduled in the area during their august break? or are they canceling them and hiding under rocks? inquiring minds would like to know, demo news.

-- Posted by aikman8 on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 9:12 PM

It's there.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/issues/health_...

On the right side of the page.

Or a direct link:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/Facts-Are...

-- Posted by Dawson16 on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 9:07 PM

Third Child: How odd. I don't find any such thing on the official White House Web site.

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 8:17 PM

Those of you who remember when the communists were under our beds will find the following link of interest: www.columbiatribune.com/news/2009/aug/06...

The Minute Men were going to save The Republic, armed to the teeth of course.

-- Posted by upsedaisy on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 7:56 PM

President Obama has stated clearly he has no enemies list (like Nixon had).

The Corporatists who have paid and organized the trained Republican "dissidents" (Republican sponsored disruptor mob) came up with that little piece of disinformation too...and some folks that post here got sucked right into it.

"Rachel Maddow named names and called out Republican operatives and organizations that are 'generating exploitative, manufactured, strategically deployed outrage' to benefit their corporate clientele." She has named the Corporatists who stand to profit by using the trained Republican disruptors currently being bussed from one Town Hall meeting to the next to carry out the Corporatists plan to deny you folks decent health care coverage. These Corporatists and their trained operatives want you to think your broken health care system is just fine. They want you to think its ok for big insurance to deny you coverage based on trumped up "pre-existing" conditions and to charge you ever increasing, outrageous insurance rates.

You can get their names here: includes video:

http://rawstory.com/08/news/2009/08/06/m...

Don't be fooled by their manufactured hype folks.

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 7:38 PM

White House Asks People to Spy on Health Care Dissidents

The WhiteHouse.gov Blog has released an appeal under the header of 'Facts are Stubborn Things' asking people to flag "scary chain emails" and "videos starting to percolate on the internet" claiming to "uncover" the truth about the President's health insurance reform positions.

This episode is reminiscent of the 2008 presidential campaign where an "Obama truth squad" vowed to arrest anyone telling 'lies' about Obama, and otherwise intimidating anyone criticizing him.

http://www.infowars.com/white-house-ask-...

Again, under the auspices of fighting disinformation, the Obama team is seeking out those challenging his policies and flagging them as in the wrong and even against the law. Nevermind that the Obama truth squad in Missouri were themselves on a highly-politicized campaign, itself not necessarily a true portrayal, to "remind voters" that Obama is a 'Christian who wants to cut taxes for anyone making less than $250000 per year' and to 'respond immediately to any adds violating Missouri ethics laws.'

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iStZAbf47...

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 6:35 PM

"On Wednesday night, MSNBC's Rachel Maddow named names and called out Republican operatives and organizations that are 'generating exploitative, manufactured, strategically deployed outrage' to benefit their corporate clientele."

with video:

http://rawstory.com/08/news/2009/08/06/m...

ALSO, congratulations Supreme Court Justice Sotomayor! Confirmed by Senate 68-31.

-- Posted by news across on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 5:25 PM

WTF, Cheetah,

It was Love in the Elevator. I was making a sick joke. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 5:11 PM

JO, I'm pulling for you on the MD problem. I have no idea if "my exercises" will help that at all so just be careful not to do harm. The article I referred to was by Joe and Teresa Graedon who write a syndicated column that is aired in newspapers around the country as far as I know. Teresa holds a doctorate in medical anthropology and is considered a nutrition expert.

The original article I cited indicated about a year on the bilberry extract before a follow-up exam which then showed tremendous improvement but full recovery happened after that with no time frame mentioned. I kept the article but can't seem to find it. They can be contacted at www.peoplespharmacy.com.

Again, the article did not say how much or what other vitamins, etc. the lady was taking but maybe you can find out from the authors. I have been taking vitamins most of my life time and adjust the amounts when I get results from valid studies so at this time I take 420 i.u. of bilberry, 12 units of zeaxanthin and 20 units of lutein that are all mostly for the eyes. WT

-- Posted by White Tornado on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 4:32 PM

Well, today's vote will dictate how I vote for my Senators and Congressmen in the next election.

-- Posted by waterman7622 on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 4:28 PM

I thought it was "Love in an Elevator"

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 3:19 PM

I read where Steven Tyler of Aerosmith fell off a stage last night while singing, Walk This Way.

-- Posted by Slater on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 2:44 PM

Geez,calm down Ray.

Or should I say Bill from Raytown?

-- Posted by What the f...... on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 1:41 PM

Shame on Kit Bond for announcing he will be voting for Obama's nominee to the Supreme Court. Given Sotomayor's racist and sexist comments (on the record) she clearly is not qualified. Those voting against her are to be commended for voting against the sexist, racist bigotry Sotomayor has spewed over her despicable, legal profession career, IMO.

-- Posted by Ray on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 1:08 PM

Eric the editor,

Thanks for defining Kathy's position. Whew, that clears up that controversy.

-- Posted by countryman on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 9:00 AM

Kudos to Kit Bond for having the guts to announce that he is voting for President Obama's nominee to the Supreme Court. He knew that she was eminently qualified, and that a vote against her was nothing more than political posturing.

That is much better than the two clowns from Oklahoma, the laughingstocks of the United States Senate, Jame Inhofe, and Tom Coburn, who both will be voting against her.

Inhofe even announced that he was not going to even read the briefing, or talk to her, his mind was made up before the President announced his nominee. The reason he always says NO, is because yes is a harder word, and he is afraid he might have to write it.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 12:41 AM

William Jefferson Democratic U.S. Representative from Louisiana is convicted on the majority of sixteen complaints. Convict the crooks whether Democrat or Republican.

http://www.nola.com/news/index.ssf/2009/...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 12:17 AM

Aikman8 Ms. Fairchild is a reporter for the Democrat News. The best I can tell she is also a citizen who enjoys reading the blogs, and posting on them. Oh yes, she has her own blog where she comments intermittently.

I guess that is about all I know, or figure is any of my business to know about her role, or roles concerning the Democrat News.

I appreciate her pointing out various links that add information to posts, or correct misinformation posted, but that is just my opinion. I don't think that is any official role, just her personal desire to help us to be well informed.

I hope this helps answer your question.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Thu, Aug 6, 2009, at 12:10 AM

i'd like to know the role that kathy fairchild has at the demo-news. what exactly does she do? she seems to have an awful lot of off-the-wall comments and freedom. can we define her position?

-- Posted by aikman8 on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 11:46 PM
Response by Eric Crump/Editor:
Staff writer and columnist. She's doing what she's been hired to do.

Someone please correct me if I am wrong but are the auto makers not mandated by the department of transportation to make some cars with MPG above a level set by that department?

If that is the case does the problem not lay at the feet of the goverment?

KF I do not have a problem with them selling their cars over here the problem is the amount of import tax we have to pay over seas is much higher than what they have to pay to import cars into the US.

-- Posted by Gal66 on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 10:16 PM

Thanks for the resource, KF. I'll see if I can get ND to read it to me. Since it's only 750 pages, that shouldn't take more than an hour or two. :)

Have you looked around your house? One that size you might be using as a doorstop.

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 9:23 PM

Many 'Clunker' Dumpers Buy Foreign

$664 Million Has Been Requested in Vehicle Vouchers; Most Top Sellers Are Japanese

Four of the five top-selling cars in the government's "Cash for Clunkers" program are made by foreign automakers, according to new data released Tuesday by federal transportation officials.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 5:53 PM

Slater: You might enjoy reading "The Reckoning," by David Halberstam, for a thorough rundown of the story of American carmakers. It's not a short read, but then it's not a short story, is it? The book was written in 1986, so it might not be easy to find. I'm not sure how, but I managed to lose track of my copy - how do you lose a book with 752 pages? - and I need to get another one.

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 5:44 PM

KF,

Yes, I'm in complete agreement. The carmakers have been stalling for decades after being ordered by Congress to begin producing a product less harmful to the environment. Wooden heads have prevailed in the management of all three, and that trend doesn't seem to have changed any after financial support.

A while back I'd mentioned that Ford has a diesel car being sold in Europe which delivers 60+ miles per gallon, and when the head lump at Ford was asked why it wasn't being sold here in America, he replied that Americans don't want diesel cars.

A couple of years or so ago, when the head lump at GM was asked why it wasn't building an engine that delivered good fuel mileage, he replied that consumers didn't want them, they wanted the gas guzzling SUV's and such as that.

When you say it's on the car makers, you're correct there in my view. Every bit of economic decision-making that's been going on in this country for the last 50 or so years seems to be lunacy. People gain high places and then believe they have all the answers, which turn out to be self-serving and contrary. Which is it, the Peter Principle that says people are promoted to their level of incompetency? And beyond, I'd say.

The automakers won't do anything different. They, like the rest of corporate America, refuse to acknowledge they're at fault. They're breathing a sigh of relief and laughing at the rest of us for being such big suckers.

DO

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 5:28 PM

Slater - Even if a goodly number of the trades are made in favor of "foreign" cars, that still benefits our economy when you factor in all the people who sell and service them here and the companies who provide many of the parts, both manufactured and after-market. And then there are the assembly plants here, too, employing American workers. And it takes ugly gas guzzlers off the street, in any case, no matter who made them.

What puzzles me (in part) is this: We want to sell Fords overseas - why do we object when other countries want to sell their cars here? The problem isn't with the foreign cars, which, in my experience are better - it's with American car manufacturers who didn't pay any attention to what happened in the 70's and after. They didn't improve their cars fast enough, and the really sad story is that they COULD HAVE. If anyone is looking to place the blame, they ought to be pointing to the car companies, not the buyers of foreign cars, who, after all, are really doing what everyone else says they do - trying to get the best bargain for the money. And as a bonus, they get a fuel-efficient car. If American car companies had made one, I'd have bought it a long time ago.

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 2:17 PM

I am really disappointed at the Cash for Clunkers program. I had high hopes of seeing constituents getting something back by discarding Reid, Kennedy, Pelosi, Obama, Frank and the Clintons, but it was limited to just derilect cars instead of bankrupt politicians.

-- Posted by Nonnymus on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 2:00 PM

Wonder Jim, I'm certain no one is going to try and force you to drive a Ford, or any other thing, for that matter.

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 12:34 PM

But TC does have a good point, KF. I haven't read the first sentence about the clunkers program, but I was believing that it was intended for the benefit of GM and Chrysler, but obviously not just those two. Many of the foreign brands may be made in America, but the profits go to the foreign companies.

I think I can go along with the GOP question about looking to make sure the first billion didn't end up in the wrong pockets before signing over another batch.

I think it's a great program, but I'd sure like to see a hard push on the crooks manning the bank vaults to do right by the people needing their mortgages renegotiated. After listening to that cluck at Chase I didn't detect any attitude change on their part since the bailout.

Extraordinary times require extraordinary measures, something many Americans don't seem to be able or willing to comprehend. I don't see any real signs that our government is willing to take extraordinary measures to clean up.

DO

-- Posted by Slater on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 12:33 PM

TC: According to CNNMoney.com, your 80% figure may be rather high:

http://money.cnn.com/galleries/2009/auto...

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 11:46 AM

80% of the cars bought with 'free' cash for clunkers are foreign.. I can't afford a new car but my money is being stolen so someone else can buy a new Honda. The trade ins are being destroyed on the spot so I'm deprived of a newer used car at a reasonable price and I'm also deprived of used parts that could be used to keep my used vehicle running.

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 9:48 AM

Happy Wednesday, everyone! We're halfway there!

-- Posted by Green Eyes on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 9:33 AM

News, I've only been posting at the MDN for a few months so your strawman argument fails. I've posted a lot against Bush and the insane wars that Obama continues.

It seems to me that you are guilty of the same transgression you falsely accuse of me. You've frequently bashed republicans for insane wars and genocide but now lap the democrat koolade as they continue the same war crimes. You see everyone that isn't you as a neocon and I don't believe you even know what a neocon is. Neocons are all about endless and expanding wars and Obama's policy, in contrast to his election rhetoric, is all about endless and expanding wars.

This country is unraveling by design. Obama is just a puppet like Bush was a puppet. Get over the simple minded left/right paradigm and start seeing things for what they are instead of the delusions of party superiority. Both parties are equally guilty of destroying the country and playing the voters for fools that bankroll their own destruction. The 'free' money for cars is just as much a republican theft as it is a democrat theft and yet you want to claim all the responsibility. Stop being a partisan fool. Marxist socialism isn't the answer.

"Dare I suggest you center your opinion around partisan party lines rather than a legitimate concern for the future of our Nation's children and grand-children?"

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 9:03 AM

Third Child,

I don't remember you screaming about the spend and borrow Republicans spending our children's future tax revenues on two wars...one of which was definitely based on lies and fought to give the United States control of Iraqi natural resources (Intentionally prohibited war of aggression). As I recall, you were completely silent for the entirety of the Bush Administration's war-mongering policies and resulting wars paid for with borrowed money.

Dare I suggest you center your opinion around partisan party lines rather than a legitimate concern for the future of our Nation's children and grand-children?

-- Posted by news across on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 1:48 AM

The humor...as promised.

http://pavlovianobeisance.com/index.htm

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 12:40 AM

Finally...a little slimeball left wing humor. Why do those lefties have memories like elephants for righty statements that made righties appear to be donkeys, or at least some part there of? It is the world upside down...every man a Mad Hatter to maintain sanity

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 12:38 AM

Will Afghanistan be for Barak Obama what Viet Nam was for Lyndon Johnson?

American soldiers are dying there at an increasing rate. And, for you Francophobes, a French soldier has died in Afghanistan. Can we finally do away with the silly substitute name "freedom fries"?

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 12:28 AM

Here is a digest of the areas of congressional consensus concerning health care reform. It is somewhat probable that something close to this will emerge as our new national health care policy.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/01/health...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Aug 5, 2009, at 12:04 AM

"the CARS stimulus is great. I am just looking for that money tree. Wish I had one in my backyard.."

The money tree is your children's and your future earnings, .. and mine..

What the government has done is put a gun to our heads and said, we're taking money from you to give to him..

As there isn't any money 'there' the private federal reserve will print this money out of thin air and loan it at interest to be paid by your children and grandchildren..

The amount stolen, (at present) is $3 billion to start out but with interest over the years it will be many times that amount..

The free money tree is at a great cost to your children's future. The supposed benefits will dry up in weeks or days.. how great is that?

-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 10:46 PM

W.T. & Kathy : I'm on the Eye Regime, for the MD Whitetornado, The Cupping is a killer. I just about sucked 1 of my Eyeballs out of my head! Just kidding! The only difference i've felt so far, is refreshed, i guess it will take a little time! Kathy: The Supplements, i'm taking are a little high but well worth it if they work,if i live long enough! Ha. Thank again!

-- Posted by Jo on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 10:19 PM

Wonder Jim,

Glad you overcame your doubts and checked out the offerings at "The Donut." Thanks for the review of the lemon filled. Just one surely won't be "to die for."

-- Posted by upsedaisy on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 8:30 PM

Missy, you may already have one without realizing it's there. Check your deed and see if you own the mineral rights to your land. :)

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 7:05 PM

news across --

You are right, the CARS stimulus is great. I am just looking for that money tree. Wish I had one in my backyard......

-- Posted by missy08 on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 6:33 PM

CASH FOR CLUNKERS,

has been a wildly successful auto industry stimulus but Fox News and the neocons try to spin it into something negative despite its incredible success at jump starting the American auto industry>

John Stewart of the Daily Show elaborates:

http://rawstory.com/08/news/2009/08/04/s...

...and lets not forget folks, as we learned from 8 years of Republican control of the White House... with neocons up is down, good is bad, and new is old...(neocon/Rove double-speak).

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 5:33 PM

oops

-- Posted by red dog on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 5:17 PM

Ron Paul: Clunker Government Targets the Poor

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LA8IM550t...

Cash for clunkers

-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 11:17 AM

It's not paranoia to believe that we are all being tracked, traced and analysed. I get five google ads today for 'police training' after posting a link from the US Army advertising for "internment/relocation" specialists for the coming FEMA camps..

Go Army

Be all that you can be, in the new world tyranny..

http://www.goarmy.com/JobDetail.do?id=29...

-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 10:47 AM

After reading the analysis by the "existentialist cowboy" of the causes for our present economic situation, I'm inclined to think he's eaten too much of that West Texas loco weed.

-- Posted by Slater on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 9:39 AM

Uh...red dog...

a "suee" would be the one getting sued. The 3 doing the suing would be the "su-ers.

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 8:54 AM

Let's see. We have three former employees of the school district suing the district. Maybe it can be settled out of court.

The district owns three old historic buildings. Building that could be restored to their originial grandeur. There is money available for restoration of such buildings if they get placed on the historical register. In other words they have value.

Maybe the suees (sounds like a hog call doesn't it?) will each accept one of the historic buildings in an out of court settlement.

Such a settlement wouldn't mean the school board is admitting guilt, just that the court action is an irritant and the community will be better served this way.

In the eyes of some people, the spectre of a lawsuit hanging over the heads of the school district means the district will wind up paying huge money to these three suees. Settle for the buildings and the problem is solved.

Silly proposal isn't it? BUT it's no sillier than some of the stuff I have read on this forum.

-- Posted by red dog on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 7:46 AM

Oklahoma Reader,

I enjoyed reading the article you posted the link to. I think the author, Chaz Valenza, hits upon some excellent points.

I have felt for a long time that the elimination of those controls that once protected our markets and ultimately wiped out most of our manufacturing base were...well...to put it mildly, economic madness. The only possible economic outcome for any nation that voluntarily gives up its markets and eliminates its manufacturing base is extreme poverty. Now we begin to realize the poisoned-fruits of those effort which began under Ronald Reagan, continued under Bush senior, Clinton, and Bush junior (GATT AND NAFTA). Now we begin to feel the effects of lowering our National living standard. When GATT, NAFTA, and other international policies that encouraged the exportation of our manufacturing base (and with it our jobs) passed through our Congress and were signed into law by the Presidents, I was one of the few voices out there asking what our economic base would be when the investment class (the rich) realized they could make a lot more money manufacturing our goods in Nations where a $1.00 a day was considered "a good wage." Today I think we have the answer to that question...oh and the rich have only gotten richer as a result (and anyone who thinks the rich "like us" or want us in their "club" had best think again).

Perhaps its time we re-evaluate the wisdom of eliminating the protections of our markets. Perhaps its time we scrap those international agreements and pass laws that require that goods sold in America are goods made in America by American workers. Perhaps its time we reconsider the value of high tariffs on foreign made goods. Of course I could be wrong. It may be that we enjoy the prospects of developing into a 3rd World nation. One thing is for sure...the opportunity to reverse these damaging international agreements is quickly running out and I believe we are nearing the point of no return. Let's hope for our Nation's sake and the sake of our People that our Congress and our President soon see where these failed international agreements and lack of protective tariffs are taking us.

-- Posted by news across on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 3:41 AM

"Three Rules ForLiving Through A Second Depression"

http://www.opednews.com/articles/1/Three...

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Aug 4, 2009, at 12:02 AM

Here is an interesting commentary pointing out controlling class scorn for, and neglect of the working classes... . that is ninety percent of us.

This is worth a look just to see the included video of Ginger Rogers singing "We're In The Money" from a 1933 Busby Berkley flick.

http://existentialistcowboy.blogspot.com...

For some of you it may be your first exposure to the transgressions of the investor class. In my opinion we must somehow stop these outrages if America is to survive as we once knew it, or for the younger among us, as they dream it might be.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Aug 3, 2009, at 11:41 PM

UK Government To Install Surveillance Cameras In Private Homes

State to spy on parents, make sure kids go to bed on time, attend school..

http://www.prisonplanet.com/uk-governmen...

THE U.N. SEIZURE OF PARENTAL RIGHTS

PART 1

http://newswithviews.com/BeritKjos/kjos1...

"...some opponents of Humanism have accused us of wishing to overthrow the traditional Christian family. They are right. That is exactly what we intend to do."[1] The British Humanist Association,1969

"...if you give me any normal human being and a couple of weeks, ...I can change his behavior from what it is not to whatever you want it to be.... I can turn him from a Christian into a Communist.... We can control behavior."[2] Psychology Professor James McConnell, 1966

"Article 13. "The child shall have the right to freedom of expression; this right shall include freedom to seek, receive and impart information and ideas of all kinds, regardless of frontiers...."[3] Convention on the Rights of the Child

-- Posted by Third Child on Mon, Aug 3, 2009, at 2:52 PM

Sunshine! Happy Monday!

-- Posted by Green Eyes on Mon, Aug 3, 2009, at 2:19 PM

A NOTE TO LONG BOTTOM

Don't let derisive comments and criticism keep you from posting your thoughts here.

Your opinion, and vote, it as important as all of them.

I always vote for the kids. I hope you change your mind about the "No" vote.

-- Posted by red dog on Mon, Aug 3, 2009, at 1:31 PM

Vaccination Myths and Truths

http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?c...

-- Posted by Third Child on Mon, Aug 3, 2009, at 12:42 PM


Respond to this story

Posting a comment requires free registration. If you already have an account on this site, enter your username and password below. Otherwise, click here to register.

Username:

Password:  (Forgot your password?)

Your comments:
Please be respectful of others and try to stay on topic.

Related subjects