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Bird Dogged Again

Posted Thursday, June 11, 2009, at 8:09 AM

As you can tell by the time on this posting I an somewhat of a night owl. Most of my friends know this so it's not uncommon to receive a late night call. Tonight I received another call from some friends who partied until closing time and were smart enough to call me to get a ride home.

To date I have been pulled over by the Marshall Police Department three times and by the Highway Patrol once because they saw me drive off the parking lot of a bar. Each time I asked why I was pulled over and each time the officer told me that I had swerved over the yellow center line.

I have been driving for over 44 years. I've driven over a million miles in my eighteen wheeler and probably the same number of mile in my private vehicle.

I expect to be stopped by a police officer if I commit a traffic violation but I resent being stopped and being told that I was driving in a dangerous manner when I wasn't.

Probable cause is the legal term that authorizes a law enforcement officer the right to stop a vehicle for a traffic stop. To me it reflects badly on the City of Marshall and the Marshall Police Department to have officers make up a reason to violate a persons civil rights. I wonder how many times a person has been given a citation for driving under the influence and the officer testifies untruthfully, under oath, as to the reason they stopped the car.

Some people might be a little peeved by my remarks but then we have the freedom of speech and the freedom of the press. Now my driving skills may just have gotten worse.

I'm John Q

What Do You Think?

Showing comments in chronological order
[Show most recent comments first]

I just want to say I think its wonderful you take the time to give friends a ride home. We need more people like you that are willing to give rides to friends that may have had one too many. Its people like you that save lives.

-- Posted by jl32320 on Sat, Jun 6, 2009, at 12:04 PM

'Unless you have something to hide, you should be happy..'

'Blinded by Scientific Programming' may be a better handle for this poster.

-- Posted by Third Child on Sat, Jun 6, 2009, at 4:52 PM

Don't you know that after about 11:00 pm, especially on a Friday or Saturday night, it's like shooting fish in a barrel. The Police/Highway Patrol will pull you over just to see if you are drunk. Then, they make up a reason for why they pulled you over. Particularly if they've watched you pull out of an establishment that sells alcohol.

-- Posted by Typesetter on Sat, Jun 6, 2009, at 5:12 PM

I have mixed feelings about this issue. However, if the law says that police officers cannot sit outside an establishment and pull over drivers simply because they are leaving said establishment, then they should abide by that. I know that the PD and the HP will sit near by places in Marshall or they will cruise back and forth on the roads by these places waiting until someone pulls out. Then they will follow them all over town. I personally have been followed from near the center of town clear out past the city limits several times simply because I pulled out of a parking lot of a place that servers alcohol.

While I think saftey is a major concern, I also think that my rights, as guaranteed in the Constitution are also a major concern.

Blinded by Science seems to make a generalization about JQP's life style and claims that simply because he did a friend a good favor by picking him/her up from somewhere that serves alcohol, that JQP has something to be ashamed about and therefore it is "right" for police to behave incorrectly.

One way to look at this is that the police are only caring about street safety. Another way is that if people who are willing to pick up people from bars who should not be driving, are continually being pulled over for no valid reason, then those people might stop being willing to get out in the middle of the night to be designated drivers. And since there is no taxi service, then are we really making the streets safer?

When I was a kid, the police did the same thing to teenagers. The police would follow teenagers hoping to see them make a beginners mistake so they could pull them over. Most normal people who have been driving all of their live still get nervous when a cop pulls up behind them, even if we are doing everything right and are completely sober.... Teenagers were getting pulled over and cited and it was only because the cop started following them, making them very nervous.

-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jun 7, 2009, at 4:08 AM

Kudos to you Larry for helping out a friend. But I guess it is just the price you pay for being a good guy!

Yes, I get nervous when a cop pulls up behind me, ANYTIME. But I wish the Cops would police business 65 and 65 hwy more becuse a lot of people ignore the 45 mph within the city limits. Not good. Expecially with more pedestians all over the place.

-- Posted by salinemg on Sun, Jun 7, 2009, at 1:44 PM

Blinded by Science, I don't what your problem is.

All I'm saying is that I have been driving for over 44 years. I have never driven under the influence and I resent being pulled over by a policeman who says the reason he stopped me was not true.

As a former police chief I know what the rules are. An officer has to have probable cause to stop a vehicle. In my department my officers were not allowed to Bird Dog establishments that sold alcohol. There are enough speeder, people who fail to stop at stop signs...

There are enough unsolved crimes is this community that should take priority over harassing people just to up your count in the department and raise revenues for the city.

-- Posted by John Q. on Mon, Jun 8, 2009, at 12:35 AM

Here-Here John Q. Couldn't have said it better myself. There was a time when the Highway Patrol would sit either in the Dairy Queen parking lot, Wood & Huston Bank on Morrow, or some other place in that area just waiting for someone (particularly college students) to leave Hustlers or Bogie's...or even Stonehedge. Now they seem to concentrate on watching the comings and goings from the Living Room. At least when people leave the Living Room they might actually be on a highway - since Hwy 65 is adjacent - but why are the Highway Patrol laying in wait in town and not out PATROLLING THE HIGHWAYS and letting the City Police do their jobs in town? And you are right - just because you leave a bar parking lot doesn't make you guilty of driving while intoxicated. Some people are actually responsible and assign a designated driver or call a friend (like you) to come get them when they've had a little too much to drink!

-- Posted by Typesetter on Mon, Jun 8, 2009, at 10:22 AM

this is a tough one, very tough. i think law enforcement should have the right to pull you over no matter if you break the law or not, they are trained and should know what to look for, i was pulled ove ronce by a highway patrol on 10 highway because when i drove past him i scratched my forehead and he thought i was hiding my face....is that harrassment or a hunch that could have taken someone bad off the streets? there used to be a highway patrolman that patrolled the junction area and was responsible for alot of major drug busts, 50% of them on a hunch, is that bird dogging?

i think we all get angry when accused of something we know we didnt do, i think its human nature, but how do we feel when we see someone dong something wrong and they arent there to bird dog them? and really typesetter, the living room? they should stalk that lot, its pathetic what that has turned into.

my complaint is not that they sit, perched, ready to strike if they feel you are up to no good, my complaint is that when a citizen sees someone up to no good and calls them to come help it seems nothing gets done.

-- Posted by thisguy on Tue, Jun 9, 2009, at 1:20 PM

My rights guarantee that I am innocent until proven guilty. That includes being stopped merely because I pull out of parking lot that happens to be infront of a bar or other establishment that serves alcohol. It is so easy for the police or HP to "claim" that someone did something wrong, no turn signal or other, when in fact that person did use proper turn signals. It happens all the time everywhere. Is it wrong? You bet it is.

Does the loss of your freedom and rights outweigh the occasional people that they might find doing something wrong? If so, then we might as well become a police state, tyranny, or a socialist nation where the Government tells us when, where,what, and how to do every little thing in our lives.

-- Posted by mrxray on Tue, Jun 9, 2009, at 2:56 PM

"It is so easy for the police or HP to "claim" that someone did something wrong, no turn signal or other, when in fact that person did use proper turn signals. It happens all the time everywhere."

Just think how dangerous it would be to pull out of the parking lot with a Ron Paul or Chuck Baldwin for President bumper sticker! They may have to shoot first and ask questions later! You could be a Constitutionalist or a home schooler, Christian that deserves special attention.. don't make any sudden moves..


"Goodbye First Amendment: It's been good knowing you" April 30, 2009


-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Jun 9, 2009, at 5:23 PM

i am actually kinda glad the police and highway patrol dont care if the pope himself is driving around at night, pull him over. and i dont need to know JQP's lifestyle to know that if you on numeroous occasions are called by "friends" to come pick their irresponsible @$$#$ up from a bar then you live that same lifestyle on occasion. so what if he serves his life in service? that is one way to always think you should get away with more, and please dont quote ben franklin and the constitution to me on this one, those days are gone those beliefs are gone, and mostly thanks to people that dont think they should be treated like criminals when they dont feel they have done anything. they are gone thanks to the democrat and republican parties always pulling an organization or group one way or the other for support and promising newer, more fairly written rules. do you people realize most criminals doing something wrong are careful for the most part? and really JQP, you have driven 1 million miles in a semi, been in law enforcement long enough to become a chief somewhere and now still find the energy to stay up late and blog, kudos....kudos

-- Posted by thisguy on Wed, Jun 10, 2009, at 11:36 AM


The recent events in Kansas don't prove anything except their are lunatics everywhere these days.

All the more reason why we should be afforded the already constituional right to bear arms.

However, such incidents sure do give folks like you a reason to say "told you so" when it comes to gun control and other government control of our lives.

And by the way - it didn't appear to me that Mr. Stewart was "making fun of" the report from Homeland Security. He was calling it to our attention so that we might well contact our congressional representatives to express our concerns.

Looks like it worked. Ms. Nepolitano has since asked for a rewrite.

Respond if you must - but that's all you'll here from me on this issue.

Thanks again for your "humble" opinion.


-- Posted by circuitrider on Wed, Jun 10, 2009, at 2:52 PM

This Guy, I'm sorry that I've never had to the chance to meet your or you would know that (in your opinion) you might be wrong about me. First I'm the Chaplin for the Marshall Fire Department. I stand ready to answer the call should the department have a fire that involves fatalities. Secondly, I'm the worship leader at Trinity Episcopal Church in Marshall.

My life style is an open book as some of the other bloggers's have attested too. You say what that "that is one way to always think you should get away with more." That may be your opinion or a hunch or just a statement on your part. Just because someone is willing to go the extra mile is not a bad thing. My actions protect the lives of innocent people who may encounter an intoxicated driver on the highway late at night. As a former police chief I am aware of the duties of law enforcement officers in the performance of their jobs. I would say that over 85% of arrests result from traffic stops and the person is arrested for DWI, DUI, MIP, no license or expired license, parole violation, child support or an outstanding warrant for their arrest.

That said, when you haven't done anything and you are pulled over for a Bogus reason just to see if you are violating the law that's Bird Dogging and a violation of one's Constitution Rights.

-- Posted by John Q. on Fri, Jun 12, 2009, at 5:05 PM

you all want to blog well heres a blog for you fine something for these kids to do in your town something that doesnt costthere are people out there living pay check to check just so they can life you dont want your kids to break into a home or a car because they think its cool because they have nothing to do some one in that town be a team player it doesnt even need to cost anything do it for the kids you all have a great town there just dont want to see it being they way it was back inthe day

-- Posted by nichoil on Sat, Jun 13, 2009, at 12:07 AM

Third Child - the First Amendment is guaranteed to all citizens of this nation, not just the Christian ones.

Given recent events in Kansas, it looks like that report Mr. Stewart made fun of was, unfortunately, dead-on.

-- Posted by NanaDot on Wed, Jun 10, 2009, at 1:48 AM

Nana..... so your point is that anyone who kills someone must be a conservative, Ron Paul, Liberatarian? Our media refuses to mention all of the actions of terrorists in the Liberal Left/Democratic side of our nation who belong to PETA and Environmental groups who blow up things, threaten people. Nor does it mention that ACORN and other "community action" groups who enmass threaten and harass citizens of our nation at the beck and call of the Democratic leader, Obama and his henchmen. lol

-- Posted by mrxray on Sat, Jun 13, 2009, at 12:57 AM

mrxray you can not dodge the fact that most if not all of the cold blooded activist killings have been by right wing lunatics. Tim McVeigh comes to mind. Lets not forget the Atlanta bomber, he was a "right to life" activist.Now this nut in Kansas. How sick is it to blow up children for your cause? How sick is it to walk into a mainstream Christian church on Sunday morning, and shoot an usher of the church as he does his duties?

Your statement "Our media refuses to mention all the actions of terroristsin the Liberal/Left/Democratic side of our nation" is ridiculous. Think about it. Do you really believe that our media would not cover heinous crimes such as these if they were committed by liberals? Of course not.

It is time that you so called conservatives, and Republicans own up to your part in these horrors. The defacto leader of your party Rush Limbaugh, and other significant righties preach hatred of, and scorn for liberals and their actions every day, insinuating that they ought to be taken out. There is no parallel on the left. It is no stretch to see that unbalanced sycophants of Limbaugh, and that ilk take their message of hatred to heart and act on it. Get real.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Sun, Jun 14, 2009, at 1:57 AM

Sorry, but people that use Tim McVeigh as example to prove some specious left/right argumentation lose some credibility with me.

There is a manipulation afoot to paint anyone that believes the government should abide by the Constitution and be accountable to the people as some kind of Tim McVeigh wingnut. I've seen it elsewhere. This pattern of character assasination and guilt by association comes from behind the scene political hacks. Mockingbirds repeat these charges as relevant, but associatively attacking vast groups of people is detrimental to their own causes as it feeds a division of people that otherwise have common interest.

McVeigh is one sorry example to use in maligning any group of people, especially by someone that calls themselves Oklahoma Reader.. How much do you really know about the Oklahama bombing? You should know that this 'bombing of children' was not the work of McVeigh and one accomplice, as is the 'official' story.. you brought it up, check it out, please..

-- Posted by Third Child on Sun, Jun 14, 2009, at 1:02 PM

Rush is NOT a Republican, he is a Conservative. Liberal Media and Gobama gave the title to Rush as the Defacto leader of the Republicans and you just repeat what your brainwashed media tells you.

-- Posted by mrxray on Sun, Jun 14, 2009, at 8:11 PM

Third Child you make a preposterous assumption questioning my knowlege of the Oklahoma City bombing, but then you traffic in assumptions so it is no surprise to me.

Obviously you did not comprehend my larger point, or chose to ignore it. My citation of Mcveigh was only one of several cites to make a larger point which I stand by. You nit picked, took out of context, and then preached to me out of your own ignorance. You already have a credibility problem with others. You do not enhance your position with comments such as these.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Jun 15, 2009, at 12:40 AM

mrxray: Is that all you got...are you kidding me. It is hard to ignore Rush's influence within the Republican Party when the titular head of the party kisses up to him.

How about you name all those left wing ghouls that committed the horrific politically motivated acts that parallel those of the right slingers that I cited. That would refute my point. You can't because they don't exist. They don't exist because there is no constant, shrill, spewing of hatred by the left media. That is the exclusive province of the right. Aren't you proud?

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Jun 15, 2009, at 12:56 AM

"there is no constant, shrill, spewing of hatred by the left media. That is the exclusive province of the right."

You're starting to spew a bit yourself, Okie.

You count as left media in my book..

-- Posted by Third Child on Mon, Jun 15, 2009, at 10:14 AM

No hatred spewed by me.


-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Jun 15, 2009, at 12:16 PM

NanaDot I loved your last line "Dead, stuffed, and carved in stone" etc., it made me think of the Republican candidates lined up for debate during the last campaign. That isn't being fair to Mr. Paul though.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Tue, Jun 16, 2009, at 12:05 AM

"No hatred spewed by me."

Is this a joke, Okie?

"It is time that you so called conservatives, and Republicans own up to your part in these horrors."

That sounds pretty hateful to me and about 100 million others..

-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Jun 16, 2009, at 3:08 PM

Oklahoma Highway Patrol dash cam: Ambulance arrest


This patrolman just got back from Iraq.

He is clearly out of control..

Here is more of the attempted arrest:



-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Jun 16, 2009, at 4:28 PM

Collective guilt accusations lead to thought crimes in our Brave New World..

"It's not enough to prosecute these murders as murders. They are hate-motivated crimes and each of these men had been under some sort of police surveillance prior to their actions. Isn't it time we started rounding up promoters of hate before they kill?"

(US News)Bonnie Erbe


-- Posted by Third Child on Tue, Jun 16, 2009, at 4:39 PM

Third Child: That is not hateful, it is an observation that I made. Do you not admit that there is even a remote possibility that some of these looneys may get jacked up by the strident right wing rhetoric against abortion providers, and others?

Please reread my entire original entry that set you off. Read slowly, try your best to not start jerking sentences out of context, and waving them like a red flag as you jump off a cliff to an erroneous conclusion. To help you maintain focus until you conclude the read you may wish to stop at the end of each sentence, and ask yourself how does that relate to the previous sentence. Who knows, that may help you reach a much needed aha moment.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Jun 17, 2009, at 12:30 AM

Okie, I believe I called it correctly when I said your comments are mockingbird repeats of a given marketing script. You might be embittered by the rejection of gay marriage and your response is to lash out at your imagined enemies, repeating the talking points provided. You may not be cognizant of their implications.. then again, maybe you DO understand the implications.. either way, my reactions to you are now going to be few and far between. If you can come up with an honest debate on something, I'll reconsider..

-- Posted by Third Child on Wed, Jun 17, 2009, at 9:00 AM

So long Third Child, I am just going to join others in ignoring you.

Whose dog is barking?

It is not my dog barking,

I remain secure.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Wed, Jun 17, 2009, at 12:52 PM

If I may . . .

Why are many of you so hateful toward Third Child? I have no idea who Third Child is, nor do I know if TC is a he or she. (I'm leaning toward a she)

But what I do know is that Third Child's posts do not have a mean tone to them nor are they of substance to be deleted. At least not the ones I have read. But they are of a different viewpoint than many others have and that seems to bother people. I myself enjoy reading different viewpoints and don't mind a good conspiracy theory report. It keeps me thinking.

Just a wonderin' is all.

-- Posted by Tori on Wed, Jun 17, 2009, at 4:25 PM

NanaDot, did you have anything to do with getting the "Will Rogers Democrat" thread removed from Ron Monnig's political blog? Did you find it objectionable that someone would question Obama supporters about the deceptions they bought into and voted for, thinking they were going to get some kind of meaningful CHANGE?

You should be more upset about being duped by the globalist bankers that are looting and plundering our nation to remedy the very crisis they created as the new Messiah does their bidding.. Our government is being transformed into a tyrannical dictatorship that liberals would not so easily tolerate if it physically came from Bush2, but seems just fine coming from the Messiah Bush3!

Let's find out what you're really mad about, Dot.

Spell it out instead of just beating around the bush..

-- Posted by Third Child on Thu, Jun 18, 2009, at 10:37 AM

The Will Rogers column was not removed by the newspaper. It's possible Ron did it himself, for reasons we aren't aware of.

-- Posted by Kathy Fairchild on Thu, Jun 18, 2009, at 5:12 PM

"The Will Rogers column was not removed by the newspaper."

Thank you, Kathy. I thought it likely that Ron might have removed it. Until I'm corrected, I'll have to assume it was removed for political reasons.

-- Posted by Third Child on Fri, Jun 19, 2009, at 11:39 AM

Hey Oklahoma Reader, Jon Stewart, comments on the blame game..


-- Posted by Third Child on Fri, Jun 19, 2009, at 4:12 PM

I found this site most helpful to remedy my percieved by some shortcoming,i.e. the inability to understand neoconservative speech.

I am still not sure that I understand whatever it is that they say, that is I don't understand what it is about what they say that has any relevance.

I suppose that since I am unable to remedy my weakness, the next best thing would be to locate an interpreter of neocon speech. I believe I have done just that: http://www.salon.com/comics/tomo/2009/06...

I know that there are others like me that post on these blogs. Those that are confounded by the utterances of neoconservatives, or is it neonconservatives? I think neonconservative, defined by me as having a message of such meager substance that it must be surrounded by artificial flash and color to capture anyone's attention. Anyway those of you whose predicament is similar to mine, may also find a little relief, or something at the site. Enjoy.

-- Posted by Oklahoma Reader on Mon, Jun 22, 2009, at 1:57 AM

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Larry Maxwell is a retired businessman who often writes about topics related to faith and religion.
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